World Cup 2018 Qualification

[mister d]

Speaking to the above stuff, I saw Sands played all 90 today. If he has any sort of career with NYCFC that'll be "real bad".

[Nonlinear FC]

Some points in response to some posts:

* The US has a Development Academy system, which is now 10 years old. Every MLS team, a number of European clubs (AS Roma) and NASL and USL teams have them and they all play in one league. They just added the U12 division last year. The best ones are free, though this isn't across the board (and needs to change). The players are training 5 days a week and playing 25-30 games spread out over a 10 month season. These are professionally run and the incentive is to either develop the player to eventually play on the full side, or to sell them off for profit... Like every academy system in the world.

* Just to say it out loud - You can't just up and leave and go join a European academy. It is much harder than that, requiring a version of a youth work visa from that country's govt and approval from that country's FA. Pulisic had access to a Croatian passport. The kid that went to my high school and got picked up by Arsenal had a German passport.

We can talk about wanting our players to go abroad, but the reality is that they need to be truly exceptional because the barrier to entry is high. Euro clubs need to really want that player to invest the extra time/labor to get them to the academy. And in some countries, they require at least one parent to move. That's asking an awful lot.

=-=-=-=-==-==

* I have no real polling data, but my gut tells me US fans don't really give a shit who is on their MLS team... they just want them to win. Yeah, it's nice when you can cheer for Jordan Morris or a Nagbe or whatever, but I really don't think that has much of anything to do with rooting interests. I guess I could be wrong, and I don't hang out with "supporters" anymore. But just knowing the history of DCU pretty intimately... It was a sign of the strength of the club to have Pope and Harkes and Olsen.. But it was just as awesome to cheer on Moreno and Etcheverry and Raul Diaz Arce.

Re: the bold, I know you can't. I thought I referenced that above in my post when I said Pulisic was lucky. In a perfect world, that would change, and any US talent at age 15 that actually warranted it could go, not just someone who got lucky with the second passport like Pulisic did.

The development academy system is theoretically great? I guess? If you have a kid who lives near one, but so much of this county, that isn't the case. So I don't think that answers the criticisms thrown at "pay to play" (which, above, I defended as working relatively well for the u7-U14 crowd). The criticisms over "pay to play" seem to be that it leaves kids behind whose parents can't pony up the time and money to do it - and I don't know the answer to that - other than USSF setting up leagues and coaches in impoverished urban areas - but, again - how many, what areas, only urban? etc...

tb - I think you know I respect you a lot. There's no "that said" or "but" coming. A lot of times when I'm posting about soccer stuff on this board, I'm responding partly to what is being discussed but a lot of where I take things is a response to a lot of what I'm hearing/reading elsewhere. That's what I meant by "just to say it out loud" because I know you and most of the other soccer savvy people know this stuff. A LOT of people don't understand that point and I'm seeing a lot of people just blurt "kids should go to Europe" and they clearly don't know any of the red tape involved.

WRT to the academies... You have to start somewhere. This country is unique in its geography. At least by starting with the big markets that have an MLS (or NASL or USL) team, you are putting your flag in the ground and capturing the best players in those regions to be developed for pro-ball and/or connect to the US Soccer coaches/system.

Before that, it was bullshit like ODP that was just not working at all. I mean, think about that for a minute. Up until the early 2000s, the main vehicle (theoretically) for building our national player pool was the Olympic Development Program. Insanity.

=-=-=-=-=

I don't expect you to have read all my ramblings the past week (not being sarcastic), but I have been pretty adamant that the only way for the US to truly excel in development is to burn a bunch of the $100M surplus on outreach to the under-served. There are some great articles on it, and testuser linked to one that really lays things out. In particular, you go to the already established Ligas Latinas that exist in every significant urban area in the country and you do your best to establish a connection. There are people around US Soccer that know where to go, we just need to fund it.

The problem with US soccer is that they are lazy and they don't have incentives to change. They are driven almost exclusively by a membership that derives the vast majority of profits from suburban, rich white people. People make their livings off of the current system. What is in it for some club in Vienna, VA or Bethesda to have US Soccer spend a bunch of money on essentially creating competition for those individual players for spots on Academy teams, or for clubs to see other clubs tap into this potential player pool and then start kicking their ass? Zero incentive.

[Nonlinear FC]

One last thing. Pulisic played for Michigan Rush for a year, and then played for PA Classics from around the age of 9 until he left at 16. Throughout that time, he got to train for weeks at a time with Barca and a handful of other Euro clubs.

But the idea that the PA Classic development academy had NOTHING to do with the player he is today (which I hear a lot of people saying, even if indirectly) is pretty silly. I'm not saying they produced the player we see today... But they sure as Hell didn't fuck him up (which is what a lot of anti-US soccer people seem to claim about ALL of youth soccer in this country.)

Did you even read my post, or no? I can't even tell what you are responding to. I specifically said I thought the U7-U14 development in the US is actually working fine, that the issue and problems start at 15 -21. So, yes, I agree that Pulisic's early experiences here served him well. My point was, he was lucky to build on that at age 15/16 where other US prodigies have to wait, and that delay is a REAL problem. For the true US prodigies, having to wait until 18 puts them behind the rest of their peers. It just does. I don't think this country does very well at training the 15-18 year old potential international level players - certainly not like the training they could receive by being overseas during those crucial years. It is a real problem that it is only a rare happenstance like with Pulisic and the second passport that he was able to go. As good as he is, I don't believe he would be what he at current if had had to wait until he turned 18 to head to Germany...

Yep, not responding to you on this point at all, snarkypants*... Just generally speaking to the folks I mention in my two parenthetical comments. Like I said above (and I tried to make clear with those parens) there are a lot of people with agendas out there the last week trying to tear things down or take credit or whatever and a lot of it is nonsense and clearly biased to prove whatever "side" they are promoting.

* - This is a joke. I understand how my tangential shit had you scratching your head.

[tennbengal]

Cool, cool, cool.

I agree that not *everyone* in all areas can be reached by USSF actually trying to get to under-served populations, and I certainly wouldn't begrudge an effort to do so by USSF, because, you are quite right, generally, there are large swaths of population that could be really good players that never get a chance. I do think that the current pay to play model does just fine at helping to develop and let the truly talented from U7-U14 start to rise (where the kids are privileged enough to afford it)...but beyond that, that's where the plan falls off (and also acknowledge that it falls off because it doesn't come close to reaching everyone). I do think the academy system isn't near enough from USSF, and would be happy for them to have a plan and try and reach more kids in areas where pay to play isn't remotely a possibility.

Also re: academies -- still waiting to see if it is enough of a step-up for a high level kid to, say, leave Bethesda or Baltimore Celtic or Pipeline/Under Armour and go to the academy - that is, is the academy enough better than those high level clubs to make it worth doing? Around DC, it hasn't felt like it yet from my experience in the last eight years watching quinn play before he stepped away. I acknowledge that view may be different in Dallas where FC Dallas seems to have it together, or Atlanta or Seattle, for instance, where those academies and development programs look a step above what I am seeing from the DC United academy system...

[Steve of phpBB]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

[brian]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Well, the assumption here is that the kids want to do it. Not that you're saying this, but no one is putting a gun to their heads. Having the chance to play for a youth academy at PSG or Barcelona or some of these places is the opportunity of a lifetime. It is quite literally a winning lottery ticket.

It's not limited to soccer either. The same thing happens with hockey players, either with players going from Europe to Canada (or less likely, but still possibly the U.S.) or U.S. to Canada or even rarely from Canada to Europe.

[tennbengal]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Maybe? Although if such a kid is going, he isn't going primarily to make a better national team player, he is going because he is hoping that in three years he rises to where Pulisic is now and about to come into tens of millions of dollars. Being a better player for the US national team is a side bonus. If Quinn has been at the level (and he wasn't within half a million light years of being that good) his Mom and I would have talked long about that with him if it were an option. You want to make a real go of it as a soccer pro? Getting to Europe earlier for that training in those years is a huge help...

ETA: What Brian said...

Double ETA: Sargent (from Scott Gallagher in St. Louis) finally getting to Germany next year at age 18 - will be interesting to see if the delay held him up or not. And Atlanta may be solving the code, if Andrew Carleton really is developing as well as he is reputed to be developing - that said, until he goes to Europe, it's hard to know how good he really is getting - there is just no approximating that experience here in the States yet for that kind of talent in my opinion.

[The Sybian]

Oh and don't forget that Pulisic's dad was a professional soccer player (George Mason Hall of Famer and 296 goals over 9 year career with the NPSL Harrisburg Heat). The stories I have read all say the kid was just always at practice and messing with the ball. The teams that his dad played on and coached would have guys challenge him to try a new thing with the ball and Christian would come back the next week mastering it. That is dedication you get from a kid who will succeed.

Yes. No doubt he is special. But I am sure there are other soccer rats in the US who do similar things, who literally can't go to Europe when they are 15 or 16 and have to wait. And the waiting I think is a real issue for the few players in this country who might be able to think about that level, is my point. And depending on where they are in the country, if they are on a potential Pulisic type level, good luck finding training partners and coaching good enough on these shores to challenge them and help them develop at 15, 16 and 17 years old like they would be overseas.

This sums it up. Pulisic spent his childhood on the pitch with the college and pro teams his father coached. I've seen interviews with former players saying from 8 years old, Pulisic was off to the side doing the drills the players were doing. He spent his free time practicing footwork drills. A big part of Pulisic's success is his intelligence on the field and understanding of the game. That just can't be replicated without 2 All-American players as parents and a father coaching pro teams and bringing you to the practices.

In addition to the work permit issues, Pulisic's father was able to get a job with Borussia Dortmund, so he could earn a living while going over with Christian. I'd imagine it wouldn't be easy for many parents to go overseas and find a job conducive to their kid training at a European club. US soccer needs to target the poor kids who use sports as a way of pulling themselves out. Middle class parents may let their kids work towards a scholarship, but going to college all but kills an elite soccer player's career. Find kids whose parents will let their kids train for the dream of being an elite player, and then provide the training for free. Making kids pay for the training limits to well off families who are more focused on college, and not willing to risk their kids future on the dream of going pro. And unlike other sports, going pro in the US isn't going to make you much money, unless you are one of the biggest names in MLS.

[HaulCitgo]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Not only is it worth it, but does it even produce a better player? Ill assume that the comp and training is better but you have to be a pretty special 15 yr old not to curl into a perfect ball when everyone and everything you know is gone except a soccer ball and a bunch of guys that are better than you and whom you cant understand want to expose your weaknesses to climb another rung on the pro soccer ladder. Id go ahead and guess that 100% of parents are crazy for doing that and 90% of those teens would suffer.

[Nonlinear FC]

Cool, cool, cool.

I agree that not *everyone* in all areas can be reached by USSF actually trying to get to under-served populations, and I certainly wouldn't begrudge an effort to do so by USSF, because, you are quite right, generally, there are large swaths of population that could be really good players that never get a chance. I do think that the current pay to play model does just fine at helping to develop and let the truly talented from U7-U14 start to rise (where the kids are privileged enough to afford it)...but beyond that, that's where the plan falls off (and also acknowledge that it falls off because it doesn't come close to reaching everyone). I do think the academy system isn't near enough from USSF, and would be happy for them to have a plan and try and reach more kids in areas where pay to play isn't remotely a possibility.

Also re: academies -- still waiting to see if it is enough of a step-up for a high level kid to, say, leave Bethesda or Baltimore Celtic or Pipeline/Under Armour and go to the academy - that is, is the academy enough better than those high level clubs to make it worth doing? Around DC, it hasn't felt like it yet from my experience in the last eight years watching quinn play before he stepped away. I acknowledge that view may be different in Dallas where FC Dallas seems to have it together, or Atlanta or Seattle, for instance, where those academies and development programs look a step above what I am seeing from the DC United academy system...

And there we are... Your last couple of sentences is EXACTLY where the money needs to go. You are spot on, in addition to the academies you mention, LAG, Red Bulls, Real SL... Toronto, Vancouver... Orlando... These guys are killing it. DCU isn't quite there, but they actually have a fairly decent overall track record of finding and grooming guys to play for the big boy team.

When every MLS team has a residency academy that clearly is better value than area elite clubs, it will be a sign that the DA system is working. These elite clubs may not like to hear that, but for fans of the game, that's the way it needs to be.

[sancarlos]

Anyone buying a ticket to watch Wondo play?

Hey, San Jose is averaging 20,000 with him as their star striker. (Though to your point, they'd probably average exactly the same number if he wasn't there.)

[brian]

Could be assumed here, but remember it's not like we need this process to crank out three or four world-class players a year. Just one a year out of a nation of 320 million would probably make the United States one of the world's elite teams. If you can find and develop a Pusilic every couple of years and some solid to fairly great players to put around that core of five or six guys from age 19 to 31 every World Cup cycle, you're talking about Germany or Spain or Italy, etc.

[Nonlinear FC]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Not only is it worth it, but does it even produce a better player? Ill assume that the comp and training is better but you have to be a pretty special 15 yr old not to curl into a perfect ball when everyone and everything you know is gone except a soccer ball and a bunch of guys that are better than you and whom you cant understand want to expose your weaknesses to climb another rung on the pro soccer ladder. Id go ahead and guess that 100% of parents are crazy for doing that and 90% of those teens would suffer.

And yet... And yet we've been doing this with hockey players since forever. We send young tennis players off at the age of 13 to places like Bradenton all the time. We have the IMG Academy and other elite football h.s. programs that are thinly veiled football factories with primarily residency programs. We have tons of basketball kids that go to finishing or prep school out of state, some for one year, some for all four... It goes on and on. Gymnastics, figure skating... Just about every sport in America has a system where the truly elite move out of the house to put themselves in a position to move to the next level. We don't monetize that in this country, which is what trips so many people up. But make no mistake, the kids I listed see the sport as a means to make money down the line (and compete at the highest level.. same-same).

And I really hope people are reading what I'm writing. WE HAVE SOCCER-SPECIFIC RESIDENCY ACADEMIES. Bradenton has been around since the Landon/Beasley era. But now we have a number of MLS teams that have residency programs, and that number is expected to grow to about 12-15 in the next few years.

So, does the concern for you guys end if you can send your kid to Salt Lake City for residency?

[tennbengal]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Not only is it worth it, but does it even produce a better player? Ill assume that the comp and training is better but you have to be a pretty special 15 yr old not to curl into a perfect ball when everyone and everything you know is gone except a soccer ball and a bunch of guys that are better than you and whom you cant understand want to expose your weaknesses to climb another rung on the pro soccer ladder. Id go ahead and guess that 100% of parents are crazy for doing that and 90% of those teens would suffer.

And yet... And yet we've been doing this with hockey players since forever. We send young tennis players off at the age of 13 to places like Bradenton all the time. We have the IMG Academy and other elite football h.s. programs that are thinly veiled football factories with primarily residency programs. We have tons of basketball kids that go to finishing or prep school out of state, some for one year, some for all four... It goes on and on. Gymnastics, figure skating... Just about every sport in America has a system where the truly elite move out of the house to put themselves in a position to move to the next level. We don't monetize that in this country, which is what trips so many people up. But make no mistake, the kids I listed see the sport as a means to make money down the line (and compete at the highest level.. same-same).

And I really hope people are reading what I'm writing. WE HAVE SOCCER-SPECIFIC RESIDENCY ACADEMIES. Bradenton has been around since the Landon/Beasley era. But now we have a number of MLS teams that have residency programs, and that number is expected to grow to about 12-15 in the next few years.

So, does the concern for you guys end if you can send your kid to Salt Lake City for residency?

No. Not until I get the sense that what we are doing here is as good as they could get overseas from age 15-17. But I am happy that they (the US system) are trying to get to that level, I just wish that for most US prodigies, something like a residency program here for those ages was not the best they can hope for before they turn 18. I would also be more comforted if those in the US academy system were able to get loaned out or sent to Europe at 18 - is that the case now? Or are they expected to indenture in the US for a few years more for the MLS club once they turn 18? Will Carleton have to keep playing in Atlanta for awhile instead of going to Europe? That would be less than ideal from my perspective. The goal for the academies shouldn't be to turn out MLS players, it should be to turn out world class players. Since the MLS really isn't a world class league, I am not sure that the goals are where they need to be...

[Nonlinear FC]

Well, I was responding to those two guys and the overall concerns of "sending someone off at age 15" to a strange and foreign land.

=-=-=-=-=-

Oh, wait, I see below that you added. 'Cause I was confused by the initial post.

MLS teams want to make money. If a foreign club comes in and makes an offer, the MLS team is going to do the same math they do at Southampton or Villareal or whatever... future prospect vs. money in the coffers. So, no, it's not baked into the system that MLS teams are going to hoard their players and cut off interest from Europe. Frankly, if they started that shit up, you'd see a big swing of these players focusing on non-professional academies, who play in the same DA league right now.

And this augments the tension I was bringing up before vis-a-vis MLS acadamies versus the PA Classics of the world. What in the world is the incentive right now for PA Classics to showcase the talent in their pipeline? Right now, there's nothing stopping MLS (and others) from just plucking a kid off their academy team with zero compensation.

I don't have an answer for this situation, but something needs to get worked out. That's not a sustainable model.

[HaulCitgo]

Teens need strong parental guidance on a daily basis, not to mention education and socialization. Firmly believe that makes them better players, particularly in team sports. Besides, IMG certainly isnt the model to make NFL football players. Residency really isnt the model for the NBA either. As much of a factory as Oak Hill is, the infrastructure is educational and everyone else not involved with the showtime team is in the business of educating and improving young people. MLB doesnt work like that either. Mostly kids living with parents playing summer showcases and tournaments with local clubs before minors/college.

Now add those same concerns, but drop them off in a foreign country? Tons of professionals struggle with that, much less 9th graders. I mean, maybe you just weed out those who cant hack it and ID 2-3 every 5 years that could make it through those circumstances, but as a federation, id rather roll the dice offering lots of players lesser opportunities within their existing lives and see if we cant come up with more than 2-3 over 5 years by age 23.

[P.D.X.]

As an aside MLS recently raised the % that teams retain from overseas transfers (a chunk goes to the league). So there is currently a bigger carrot for developing/selling than there has been in the past.

[tennbengal]

Good.

[sancarlos]

If having a top-level national team requires 15 year olds to leave their country and their homes and their friends to live in a foreign country, away from their families unless their families can afford to go, is it worth it?

I apologize if that was discussed above and I missed it.

Not only is it worth it, but does it even produce a better player? Ill assume that the comp and training is better but you have to be a pretty special 15 yr old not to curl into a perfect ball when everyone and everything you know is gone except a soccer ball and a bunch of guys that are better than you and whom you cant understand want to expose your weaknesses to climb another rung on the pro soccer ladder. Id go ahead and guess that 100% of parents are crazy for doing that and 90% of those teens would suffer.

And yet... And yet we've been doing this with hockey players since forever. We send young tennis players off at the age of 13 to places like Bradenton all the time. We have the IMG Academy and other elite football h.s. programs that are thinly veiled football factories with primarily residency programs. We have tons of basketball kids that go to finishing or prep school out of state, some for one year, some for all four... It goes on and on. Gymnastics, figure skating... Just about every sport in America has a system where the truly elite move out of the house to put themselves in a position to move to the next level. We don't monetize that in this country, which is what trips so many people up. But make no mistake, the kids I listed see the sport as a means to make money down the line (and compete at the highest level.. same-same).

And I really hope people are reading what I'm writing. WE HAVE SOCCER-SPECIFIC RESIDENCY ACADEMIES. Bradenton has been around since the Landon/Beasley era. But now we have a number of MLS teams that have residency programs, and that number is expected to grow to about 12-15 in the next few years.

So, does the concern for you guys end if you can send your kid to Salt Lake City for residency?

Of course, there is a big difference between my friend sending his kid off to a hockey academy in Connecticut, and some soccer parent sending their kid off to play soccer in Catalonia. The cultural difference for the kid to be staying in the U.S. with other American kids can't be overstated.

[Nonlinear FC]

Teens need strong parental guidance on a daily basis, not to mention education and socialization. Firmly believe that makes them better players, particularly in team sports. Besides, IMG certainly isnt the model to make NFL football players. Residency really isnt the model for the NBA either. As much of a factory as Oak Hill is, the infrastructure is educational and everyone else not involved with the showtime team is in the business of educating and improving young people. MLB doesnt work like that either. Mostly kids living with parents playing summer showcases and tournaments with local clubs before minors/college.

Now add those same concerns, but drop them off in a foreign country? Tons of professionals struggle with that, much less 9th graders. I mean, maybe you just weed out those who cant hack it and ID 2-3 every 5 years that could make it through those circumstances, but as a federation, id rather roll the dice offering lots of players lesser opportunities within their existing lives and see if we cant come up with more than 2-3 over 5 years by age 23.

Honestly, this is kind of a silly moving of the goalposts sidebar argument. I'm a lot more interested in building up the academy system here and selling the highest caliber to European clubs than I am shipping them over when they are 14-15... I totally agree that the road of sending young kids over is fraught with peril and not a very sustainable model. Keep them home or at least close enough and I think we'll crank out a lot more high caliber player.

(My point is that it is done in the US, not that it's the model. It, obviously, doesn't NEED to be the model for the big 3 sports, because those are pretty well covered. And that is primarily because the money involved for college and the pro leagues provide the incentives for more than adequate scouting and talent acquisition. Beyond the big 3, you start to miss a lot of kids... Which is why the NHL has the model it has, and why sports like tennis and gymnastics require a lot of residency... Not enough world class coaches in the US to develop that talent.)

[sancarlos]

Well, I originally hadn't read closely enough the back end of your post. But, when I went to delete it you had already posted your breathless response.

[Nonlinear FC]

http://americansoccernow.com/articles/t ... opment-gap

That is a very interesting breakdown of the "lost generation." Not a heckuva a lot of explanation is to why, but if you want an interesting look at just how bare the cupboard was for this 2018 cycle in terms of the important 20-26 year old players... hoo boy.

I will also reiterate something I said in the JK Experience thread. Dude was a terrible manager... He is going to not likely get credit, but he has helped transform US Soccer. Most here know that he, along with Tab Ramos, has changed how the very young are going to play with their directives. (smaller fields and smaller sided games, no crowding on goal kicks to support possession style, etc.)

But what many don't know he is that he also implemented a system that added at least 4 additional national teams (and, obviously, the coaching staffs that go with them.) Previously, we had a U17, U20 and U23 program, with the latter really being a joint position with the U20 at times.

Now you have U15, 16, 18 and 19 programs. That is a massive difference in resources and in the amount of players in the system. Again, like the other changes, it's going to take time for this to have a big effect. But a lot of the kids in the U20 and U17 teams are getting shots because they got significant looks on this new teams... Specific tournaments and games they never would've had before.

[testuser2]

I would love to see US Soccer take that 100 million they have and use it to build futsal courts in urban areas. For rural areas maybe a grant program for clubs to add futsal courts or indoor practice spaces. Somewhere that kids can go and have pickup games in the neighborhood would be awesome.

We try to use the local school gyms because that's all that is available, but there simply isn't enough space. Having the club buy the land and then build something on our own is too much of a financial burden for a small/rural club. There are at least 5 months of the year where we can only practice indoors. The closest turf facility is over 60 miles away and is too full for us to get blocks of time.

[A_B]

Sweden and Italy draw each other in the playoff.

https://twitter.com/FIFAWorldCup/status ... 6949836800

[P.D.X.]

I would love to see US Soccer take that 100 million they have and use it to build futsal courts in urban areas. For rural areas maybe a grant program for clubs to add futsal courts or indoor practice spaces. Somewhere that kids can go and have pickup games in the neighborhood would be awesome.

We try to use the local school gyms because that's all that is available, but there simply isn't enough space. Having the club buy the land and then build something on our own is too much of a financial burden for a small/rural club. There are at least 5 months of the year where we can only practice indoors. The closest turf facility is over 60 miles away and is too full for us to get blocks of time.

Nike would be wise (in my mind) to do this, similar to how they refurbish/sponsor hoops courts.

[Nonlinear FC]

I would love to see US Soccer take that 100 million they have and use it to build futsal courts in urban areas. For rural areas maybe a grant program for clubs to add futsal courts or indoor practice spaces. Somewhere that kids can go and have pickup games in the neighborhood would be awesome.

We try to use the local school gyms because that's all that is available, but there simply isn't enough space. Having the club buy the land and then build something on our own is too much of a financial burden for a small/rural club. There are at least 5 months of the year where we can only practice indoors. The closest turf facility is over 60 miles away and is too full for us to get blocks of time.

Nike would be wise (in my mind) to do this, similar to how they refurbish/sponsor hoops courts.

US Soccer's foundation is doing this, but it's all about scale. (They also don't do a great job telling ppl what they are up to.)

[HaulCitgo]

Why not put money to use where people can actually play soccer outside at least 9 months a year? With 300 million people I think you can target 150 million low hanging fruit before you start trying to create players in urban/rural areas and cold weather environs. Think they'd also be much better off trying to target local ethnic communities instead of lower class black communities. Just too far to move the needle. We need players in the next decade.

[brian]

Why not put money to use where people can actually play soccer outside at least 9 months a year? With 300 million people I think you can target 150 million low hanging fruit before you start trying to create players in urban/rural areas and cold weather environs. Think they'd also be much better off trying to target local ethnic communities instead of black urban areas. Just too far to move the needle in lower class black communities. We need players in the next decade.

Yeah, I think the best bang for the buck is probably to target heavily Latino communities in California, Las Vegas, Phoenix, Texas, etc. That's where kids are already playing soccer from the time they can walk.

I think there's a misconception that kids with potential or literal dual nationality will pick El Tri when the time comes, but I don't know that that is true, especially if it's paired with world-class coaching from US Soccer and USS continues its outreach into Latino communities.

[Nonlinear FC]

Why not put money to use where people can actually play soccer outside at least 9 months a year? With 300 million people I think you can target 150 million low hanging fruit before you start trying to create players in urban/rural areas and cold weather environs. Think they'd also be much better off trying to target local ethnic communities instead of black urban areas. Just too far to move the needle in lower class black communities. We need players in the next decade.

Yeah, I think the best bang for the buck is probably to target heavily Latino communities in California, Las Vegas, Phoenix, Texas, etc. That's where kids are already playing soccer from the time they can walk.

I think there's a misconception that kids with potential or literal dual nationality will pick El Tri when the time comes, but I don't know that that is true, especially if it's paired with world-class coaching from US Soccer and USS continues its outreach into Latino communities.

This is what I've been advocating, while getting kind of muddled responding to other stuff.

1) Keep putting money into the Development Academy system. The more that are free to the players, the more that they become THE answer for elite players. It also gives you more of an incentive for the underserved in the Latino communities you are talking about. The money is a huge reason those kids can't be coaxed away from Liga Latinas...

2) Focus on places with existing, quality Liga Latinas and start to build relationships and partnerships to bring those kids into the US fold. Maybe it's seeing if they'd be open to Technical Directors assigned to leagues, professional coaching, forming an elite team from U12-U17 to compete in Showcase Tournaments. You need people that understand the culture and will be trusted... And you, obviously, need to fund this. So, you start with a handful of pilots and see what works. This isn't going to happen overnight, but it needs start now.

You've got two different things going. They are both very complicated by those who currently have a heavily vested interest in maintaining the status quo. That's the challenge. The Sunil Gulatis of the world answer to 3 distinct groups: The Pros (MLS/USL and a grudging NASL), the Adults (whatever) and the Youth System. The latter is a huge group and holds a ton of power in elections and direction of the Fed.

That's the power play that's going to play out going forward. Does the MNT and the Pros win the battle to reshape this landscape (professionalize the DA system, meaningfully add to the club/player pool with Latinos) or does the inertia of the existing Youth System and all that are making nice livings off of it keep us from reform and advancement.

[Nonlinear FC]

Why not put money to use where people can actually play soccer outside at least 9 months a year? With 300 million people I think you can target 150 million low hanging fruit before you start trying to create players in urban/rural areas and cold weather environs. Think they'd also be much better off trying to target local ethnic communities instead of lower class black communities. Just too far to move the needle. We need players in the next decade.

(Also, while I agree that the idea we are going to tap into inner city black kids is folly... A lot of these futsal courts are built in areas of cities with a lot of Latino families... Just want that to be clear. It could EASILY be tied into what I'll just call Liga Latina outreach.)

[wlu_lax6]

There is actually an interesting business model in Tampa that I am curious to see if it works. Basically 4 turf 5-a-side fields and one beach field. $8 per session (even scheduled leagues are pay to play the game). Lots of pick up game times. Outdoor (not like expensive indoor places in the mid Atlantic)
http://cincosoccer.com/

[govmentchedda]

Yeah, Cinco soccer is supposed to be great. The Howler magazine guys play there. I used to play in a local club sport league that played on smaller fields, but never at Cinco. I used to also play two mornings a week at the Y. There's a group there that meets from 5:45-7 every Tuesday and Thursday. However, if you subtracted 15 years from everyone's age, they'd probably still be too old to qualify for the USMNT.

[Sabo]

Jermaine Jones talks about the USMNT.

He isn't wrong. (It's 14 minutes long, but it's a good listen despite his odd accent.)

http://twitter.com/Jermainejunior/statu ... 6053341184

[HaulCitgo]

That was pretty good. Guys obviously freed up to speak their mind. Still though, nothing earth shattering. The euro guy prefers a euro coach that wants euro guys for the national team. Not a surprise.

[tennbengal]

Hugo Perez weighs in...

https://www.socceramerica.com/publicati ... creat.html

[govmentchedda]

I'm waiting for Fubo Chavez to chime in.

[DC47]

The USMNT was an implosion waiting to happen. The best players got old, and the next age groups just aren't that good. Some of this is chance. But most of it speaks to the comprehensively misguided nature of youth soccer -- every level, including the top -- in the USA.

There are some signs of change. Klinsman (not in his coaching role) and Ramos got some useful things done. But so much remains the same. And of course, the execs running things are not changing. So what's the real prognosis for productive change?

Iceland. Trinidad & Tobago. The contrast with the USA demonstrates the absurdity of the situation.

But the reality is that USA might routinely fail to qualify for the WC if the groupings were not rigged in their favor. Put them in Europe and the abject failure of a gigantic country loaded with soccer players and vast resources would be far more clear. The dumpster has always been on fire. It just becomes more clear from time to time.

[Nonlinear FC]

Hugo Perez weighs in...

https://www.socceramerica.com/publicati ... creat.html

Thanks for that link! Not only was the Perez stuff interesting, but right below it is an extremely important issue I hadn't been able to find any ink on:

https://www.socceramerica.com/publicati ... -on-t.html

This is a BIG DEAL in terms of compensating clubs for developing youth.

[Baloney]

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... cial-media

[degenerasian]

He'll play for Italy!