Copa America

Post by **Sabo** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:03 pm

True. Kinda amazed he didn't shank it, to be honest.

(Not really.)

howard · Post by **howard** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:04 pm

rass wrote:Just walk away Jermaine /theleftbanke

You won't see my fist in your face anymore

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:12 pm

Tight bum hole time for South Alabama.

howard · Post by **howard** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:21 pm

Klinsman must be outta subs, right? [/sarc]

Post by **brian** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:31 pm

They have a gift for making shit interesting. I'll give them that.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:35 pm

Damn, the whole family was tensely watching. The highlight for my daughter was Beckerman coming on.

Post by **brian** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:35 pm

So no Wood, no Jones and no Bedoya on Tuesday?

Post by **Sabo** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:51 pm

brian wrote:So no Wood, no Jones and no Bedoya on Tuesday?

Unless the Jones' red card is overturned on appeal, then yes. Probably looking at Beckerman and Zusi for the midfield spots. Not sure who they put out there for Wood's spot ... maybe Pulisic?

howard · Post by **howard** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 10:54 pm

Sabo wrote: ... maybe Pulisic?

from. your. lips.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:07 pm

Was at a bar where the sound was on the hoops game. Did Jones do anything red (or yellow) card worthy or did they guess the wrong guy after Brooks launched that dude?

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:07 pm

Also, it better be Nagbe next game.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Thu Jun 16, 2016 11:48 pm

mister d wrote:Was at a bar where the sound was on the hoops game. Did Jones do anything red (or yellow) card worthy or did they guess the wrong guy after Brooks launched that dude?

Jones got his hands in the face of an opposing player during the shoving after the whistle. It didn't appear to me that Jones actually hit his face, or even if he was going for the face versus going for the chest and getting his hands pushed up. But the announcers said that rules had been imposed that if you get someone in the face and you're not going for the ball, it's a straight red.

I don't know if they can review a replay and rescind a red card in a situation like this.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 6:22 am

brian wrote:Not sure if worthy of a booking but dumb as shit.

Yep, and I thought it was Brooks he was sending off for clattering into Valencia in the aftermath of the foul. John's lucky he didn't get a booking there.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:50 am

And, once again, you have a weird mixed feeling about a win... Amazing first half, very dogged/determined effort in the 2nd.

But WHY THE FUCK didn't JK use his subs earlier in the second? Bedoya was completely spent by the time he picked up that yellow, and with a shaky one goal lead and the obvious need to try to slow things down and possess, why isn't Zardes subbed out?

Don't get me wrong, I'm obviously over the moon with the result.. But I was losing my mind with the lack of subs.

(Also, last night was a perfect example of what I was bitching about in terms of the TV production. WTF are they thinking? I watched with some buddies and after I pointed it out, it was the running joke of the night. After almost every stop in play, they are showing replays, only to come back to live action and the ball is on the other end of the field. I just... WTF?)

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 8:52 am

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:11 am

Nonlinear FC wrote:And, once again, you have a weird mixed feeling about a win... Amazing first half, very dogged/determined effort in the 2nd.

But WHY THE FUCK didn't JK use his subs earlier in the second? Bedoya was completely spent by the time he picked up that yellow, and with a shaky one goal lead and the obvious need to try to slow things down and possess, why isn't Zardes subbed out?

Don't get me wrong, I'm obviously over the moon with the result.. But I was losing my mind with the lack of subs.

(Also, last night was a perfect example of what I was bitching about in terms of the TV production. WTF are they thinking? I watched with some buddies and after I pointed it out, it was the running joke of the night. After almost every stop in play, they are showing replays, only to come back to live action and the ball is on the other end of the field. I just... WTF?)

Subs
1.) Do you think JK was holding the subs back a bit because he was not sure that the US would hold onto the lead and wanted to have options in extra time/PKs? That was the only thing I was thinking. If you end up in extra time I think you would probably end up with Wondo or Nagbe coming on instead of a defensive player.

Seattle
1.) Imagine how great a stadium atmosphere that would have been if ticket prices were a bit lower. Between the game last night and the US Open Cup sell out the night before, it is hard to argue against it taking over from Columbus as the best place for the National Team...except for being farther for Euro guys to travel and not being real grass most of the time.

Random TV thoughts
1.) My guess is the TV production job is not a soccer guy. My guess with the fox connection we are seeing football group try to do soccer production and not getting the soccer tv crew that Murdoch and co has in the UK. Fox adding FS1 and FS2 means they have more camera and production crews for college football that have some free time right now. Even if they are not Fox employees, we are getting crews that normally cover something else.
2.) The stadiums where the games are being played are football stadiums. I think camera locations are compromised for soccer because of this. The camera angles for EPL, La Liga, and Bundesliga are just better.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 9:57 am

wlu_lax6 wrote:
Nonlinear FC wrote:And, once again, you have a weird mixed feeling about a win... Amazing first half, very dogged/determined effort in the 2nd.

But WHY THE FUCK didn't JK use his subs earlier in the second? Bedoya was completely spent by the time he picked up that yellow, and with a shaky one goal lead and the obvious need to try to slow things down and possess, why isn't Zardes subbed out?

Don't get me wrong, I'm obviously over the moon with the result.. But I was losing my mind with the lack of subs.

(Also, last night was a perfect example of what I was bitching about in terms of the TV production. WTF are they thinking? I watched with some buddies and after I pointed it out, it was the running joke of the night. After almost every stop in play, they are showing replays, only to come back to live action and the ball is on the other end of the field. I just... WTF?)
Subs
1.) Do you think JK was holding the subs back a bit because he was not sure that the US would hold onto the lead and wanted to have options in extra time/PKs? That was the only thing I was thinking. If you end up in extra time I think you would probably end up with Wondo or Nagbe coming on instead of a defensive player.

Seattle
1.) Imagine how great a stadium atmosphere that would have been if ticket prices were a bit lower. Between the game last night and the US Open Cup sell out the night before, it is hard to argue against it taking over from Columbus as the best place for the National Team...except for being farther for Euro guys to travel and not being real grass most of the time.

Random TV thoughts
1.) My guess is the TV production job is not a soccer guy. My guess with the fox connection we are seeing football group try to do soccer production and not getting the soccer tv crew that Murdoch and co has in the UK. Fox adding FS1 and FS2 means they have more camera and production crews for college football that have some free time right now. Even if they are not Fox employees, we are getting crews that normally cover something else.
2.) The stadiums where the games are being played are football stadiums. I think camera locations are compromised for soccer because of this. The camera angles for EPL, La Liga, and Bundesliga are just better.

Subs - perhaps.
Seattle - there was a game on that field the night before? Surprised they would do that to grass that's been laid on top of turf. Also, I was very surprised by the size of the crowd last night.
Random TV 1 - It probably isn't a soccer guy, but rather someone more in charge of shows like Emmys, or the like. It's not FOX though. It's whomever Copa chose to do the video.
Random TV 2 - you might be right about camera locations, but it seems like they should just zoom in a bit more. I thought the camera angle was way too wide last night

My own thoughts on the production - I did like some of the close ups that we saw. There were a few times that the production switched to a close angle view during play, and we got a really good look at the action close up. To me, that's high risk, high reward production. We got a few really cool views in the run of play, but way too many shitty shots of the crowd and unimportant replays

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:00 am

wlu_lax6 wrote: Subs
1.) Do you think JK was holding the subs back a bit because he was not sure that the US would hold onto the lead and wanted to have options in extra time/PKs? That was the only thing I was thinking. If you end up in extra time I think you would probably end up with Wondo or Nagbe coming on instead of a defensive player.

This is what I was thinking, but towards the end of the game, I started to think more that JK should've gone all-in to secure the win in regular time. I don't think we had any extra time in us. An Ecuador equalizer would've broken us.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:05 am

Like the World Cup, the COPA America will feature top-level international production teams, including one from the UK (led by Grant Philips) and two from Germany (led by Thomas Sohns and Wolfgang Straub). There will also be two all-American production teams led by Phil Mollica and Blair Tetrault.

http://www.sportsvideo.org/2016/05/31/c ... yon-video/

Look they are on linked in...

https://www.linkedin.com/in/phil-mollica-5bb6668

https://www.linkedin.com/in/blair-tetreault-24985b50

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:13 am

P.D.X. wrote:I don't think we had any extra time in us. An Ecuador equalizer would've broken us.

No extra time, just PKs.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:34 am

1) Not a big deal, but the US Open Cup game was played somewhere else on Wednesday. So, no, they didn't play back to back games on that field last night. That's just what happens when you put temporary grass down on top of turf. Always, without fail.

2) As Mr. D correctly points out, there wasn't going to be ET. There's really no logical or sound reason not to take Bedoya out of the game, regardless of yellow card concerns. Dude had to cover one of the fastest guys on the planet and it was obvious he was hitting a wall. Bedoya has quietly had one of the best performances on the team during this tournament. Losing him for the semis is arguably as big a deal as Jones.

3) And on that note, I'm still pissed JK put Wondo on this roster and not Jordan Morris. Wood has been a terror this tournament by stretching the opposition's backline. Wondo and Dempsey are just too similar in their predatory, subtle styles. Morris slots right into the Wood high-press, deep run mold up top.

4) And I guess we'll see Beckerman start. That's not good.

Post by **brian** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:36 am

ANY chance Nagbe starts instead of Beckerman?

(Yeah, I'll answer my own question.)

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 10:39 am

mister d wrote:
P.D.X. wrote:I don't think we had any extra time in us. An Ecuador equalizer would've broken us.
No extra time, just PKs.

That I did not know.

In which case, Klinsmann out!

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 11:51 am

Nonlinear FC wrote:Wondo and Dempsey are just too similar in their predatory, subtle styles. Morris slots right into the Wood high-press, deep run mold up top.

Yeah but for simplicity you have 4 types of strikers...
Dempsey predators (wondo as the backup)
Speedsters (Wood, Zardes, Nagbe)
Hold up guys (roster does not have one of these---Altidore)
Bigs (roster does not have one of these--McBridge, Conner Casey).

So the U.S. goes away from hold up player and bigs...if you drop Wondo who do you have if Dempsey gets hurt

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 12:55 pm

wlu_lax6 wrote:
Nonlinear FC wrote:Wondo and Dempsey are just too similar in their predatory, subtle styles. Morris slots right into the Wood high-press, deep run mold up top.
Yeah but for simplicity you have 4 types of strikers...
Dempsey predators (wondo as the backup)
Speedsters (Wood, Zardes, Nagbe)
Hold up guys (roster does not have one of these---Altidore)
Bigs (roster does not have one of these--McBridge, Conner Casey).

So the U.S. goes away from hold up player and bigs...if you drop Wondo who do you have if Dempsey gets hurt

I'd be over the moon if Klinsmann put Nagbe up top instead of Wondo. It's kind of not really the main point I'm making, but to address what you wrote: Wondo is in no way a replacement if Dempsey gets hurt. At that point, you have to find another guy to create chances, that's not Wondo... Just not what he does.

But back to the reality of the situation, fine... push Zardes or Nagbe up top. A Dempsey - Wondo combination up top will be a disaster against whoever we play next Tuesday.

DSafetyGuy · Post by **DSafetyGuy** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:25 pm

govmentchedda wrote:
wlu_lax6 wrote: Random TV thoughts
1.) My guess is the TV production job is not a soccer guy. My guess with the fox connection we are seeing football group try to do soccer production and not getting the soccer tv crew that Murdoch and co has in the UK. Fox adding FS1 and FS2 means they have more camera and production crews for college football that have some free time right now. Even if they are not Fox employees, we are getting crews that normally cover something else.
Random TV 1 - It probably isn't a soccer guy, but rather someone more in charge of shows like Emmys, or the like. It's not FOX though. It's whomever Copa chose to do the video.

I can't see that happening. TV production is pretty segmented with little crossover since everything is so specialized. Live sports and a live award show are vastly different beasts.

Post by **brian** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:33 pm

Just to summarize some of the points I made and some of you are making if Argentina wins tonight as expected, I'd like to see Jurgen go down swinging with a faster, younger lineup that will be more dangerous offensively instead of continuing to lean on guys like Beckerman who don't excite anyone. I'm not talking about replacing Dempsey with Pusilic or anything, but I don't think it's unreasonable to say -- losing in the semifinals of Copa America is not a bad result and let's at least play to win instead of playing to not lose.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 3:44 pm

brian wrote: guys like Beckerman who don't excite anyone.

Ahem.

Steve of phpBB wrote: The highlight for my daughter was Beckerman coming on.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:14 pm

Yeah, I think we're likely to see Zardes up top, Beckerman for Jones and Zusi out wide for Bedoya.

At this point, I don't really blame a manager for going with what is a nominally conservative lineup. (I mean, if Zardes is up top instead of Wondo, I still consider that a pretty aggressive move.)

Pulisic and/or Nagbe in late to spell Zusi or Beckerman, particularly if we need to press for a goal? Absolutely see that happening.

I also would roll Besler back out there again and see about pushing Fabian up the flank... He can still do what Bedoya did from that spot and mitigate some of the pressure on Besler. I just really like that dude's play and also like infusing more punch with FJ pushing forward.

Don't forget, by winning last night, we just earned two more games in this tournament. If we don't get a result on Tuesday, you gotta believe Nagbe and Pulisic see significant minutes in the 3rd place match.

Post by **brian** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 4:27 pm

I had forgotten about that potential third-place match and yeah, that'll definitely be a younger lineup if it comes to that.

Though do you think that changes if we somehow end up against Mexico in that game? (I think Jurgen still goes with the younger lineup either way, but trying to beat Mexico in a major tournament, even if it's a third place game does move the needle a little.)

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 5:41 pm

If Klinsman won't play the kids, it just makes his whining about the lost years of American youth between ages 18 and 23 even more bullshit.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jun 17, 2016 7:32 pm

tennbengal wrote:If Klinsman won't play the kids, it just makes his whining about the lost years of American youth between ages 18 and 23 even more bullshit.

Wouldn't it prove his point?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 5:08 am

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:39 am

I guess I'm Missing something then. If he prefers to play older players isn't it possible it's because he's positive he younger generation just isn't ready, or rather, lost? Which would prove he bit him point.

I'm genuinely confused, not trolling.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 9:45 am

Oh wait. I guess you're saying hey need playing time to not be lost. I was thinking he was trying to get results but hey werent good enough. I think I am tracking with you.

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 1:41 pm

From the WaPo's lineup speculation:

If experience wins out, Klinsmann could deploy Zusi and Gyasi Zardes on the flanks, partner Beckerman and Bradley in the middle, drop leading scorer Clint Dempsey to withdrawn forward and insert veteran striker Chris Wondolowski up top to apply high pressure and ease the burden on Dempsey against, presumably, a possession-dominant Argentine side.

that did not give me the good feels

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 2:59 pm

A_B wrote:Oh wait. I guess you're saying hey need playing time to not be lost. I was thinking he was trying to get results but hey werent good enough. I think I am tracking with you.

Yes, that. If Pulisic is good enough to start and make a difference at Dortmund, but can't get run for US - that's on Klinsman and he can go fuck himself for whining about lack of quality etc at that point available to him.

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 4:58 pm

tennbengal wrote:
A_B wrote:Oh wait. I guess you're saying hey need playing time to not be lost. I was thinking he was trying to get results but hey werent good enough. I think I am tracking with you.
Yes, that. If Pulisic is good enough to start and make a difference at Dortmund, but can't get run for US - that's on Klinsman and he can go fuck himself for whining about lack of quality etc at that point available to him.

Is nine games (4 starts, 5 subs) really that much to point to as far as league worthiness this year?

Mind you, I'm not trying to debate/pick apart what you're saying, TB (a lineup with CP >>>>>>> one with Wondo). Just trying to find that barometer of how to judge club impact I guess, if that makes sense.

rass · Post by **rass** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 5:29 pm

Really disappointed by everyone going out of their way to not argue with Bengal.

WTF happened to this place????

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Sat Jun 18, 2016 5:51 pm

If Klinsman goes with a lineup that had wondo over Pulisic in it , he never gets to say shit about young American talent again. Pulisic is literally doing and has had good early success at the exact level of play in Europe Klinsman whines about US players not having success , but won't play him? Fuck that.