The Swamp

brian wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:36 pm

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:29 pm My military friend who just moved to Las Vegas from Japan put an offer on your house, Brian.

You didn't pick her offer because obviously you hate the troops.

Oh, fuck - no way! Hell, if I had known that last night I would have at least given her a chance to counter. Was it the offer that was a VA loan, I'm guessing? (we only had one that was VA). She might not want to hear this, but if the people that offered $15K more than asking didn't get involved we would have gone with hers. If she doesn't find anything in the next week or two and this deal gets fucked up somehow, our realtor will want to get in touch with her.

Just about to edit my post, but they did find a spot:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/4757 ... e=txtshare

But I'll let her know what you said. She probably went VA loan most likely. She said her offer is 362k.

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:45 pm

brian wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:36 pm

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:29 pm My military friend who just moved to Las Vegas from Japan put an offer on your house, Brian.

You didn't pick her offer because obviously you hate the troops.

Oh, fuck - no way! Hell, if I had known that last night I would have at least given her a chance to counter. Was it the offer that was a VA loan, I'm guessing? (we only had one that was VA). She might not want to hear this, but if the people that offered $15K more than asking didn't get involved we would have gone with hers. If she doesn't find anything in the next week or two and this deal gets fucked up somehow, our realtor will want to get in touch with her.

Just about to edit my post, but they did find a spot:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/4757 ... e=txtshare

But I'll let her know what you said. She probably went VA loan most likely. She said her offer is 362k.

Yeah, that's the one. Well, I'm glad she found something anyway.

Same. She was lamenting her luck on Instagram the other day and I was like "Now is not a good time to come back to America. The housing market is fucking unreal because of a confluence of events stemming from COVID-19."

Her and her husband-to-be looked at dozens of places and made lots of offers and just couldn't find anything. She messaged me about what she was able to get about an hour ago and I thought "....wait a fucking minute."

Small world, though.

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:45 pm

brian wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:36 pm

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Oct 26, 2020 4:29 pm My military friend who just moved to Las Vegas from Japan put an offer on your house, Brian.

You didn't pick her offer because obviously you hate the troops.

Oh, fuck - no way! Hell, if I had known that last night I would have at least given her a chance to counter. Was it the offer that was a VA loan, I'm guessing? (we only had one that was VA). She might not want to hear this, but if the people that offered $15K more than asking didn't get involved we would have gone with hers. If she doesn't find anything in the next week or two and this deal gets fucked up somehow, our realtor will want to get in touch with her.

Just about to edit my post, but they did find a spot:

https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/4757 ... e=txtshare

But I'll let her know what you said. She probably went VA loan most likely. She said her offer is 362k.

Crazy coincidence. I mean, the odds that you happened to hear your friend didn't get the house and to connect it. Anyways, she got a much nicer house than Brian's, especially if she is looking to throw some raging coke parties in 1983. Some interesting decor choices, but I like the common area rooms. Bathrooms are way too dark. And I am really envious of that backyard. Not a single to leaf to pick up. Ever! Sign me up for that.

Just found out we got fucked by the appraiser, who appraised the house at not only way less than the selling price, but less than the asking price. Come to find out it's a trainee who used a bunch of bullshit comps, so now my realtor has to fight with the appraising company because they're trying to fuck us out of $15,000. What a bullshit industry. Just another reason I'm glad I'm leaving this country. Everything about this place is bullshit and meant to fuck over the average person while the 1 percent loots the place left and right.

Rant over.

Democrats and their regulations.

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:30 am Just found out we got fucked by the appraiser, who appraised the house at not only way less than the selling price, but less than the asking price. Come to find out it's a trainee who used a bunch of bullshit comps, so now my realtor has to fight with the appraising company because they're trying to fuck us out of $15,000. What a bullshit industry. Just another reason I'm glad I'm leaving this country. Everything about this place is bullshit and meant to fuck over the average person while the 1 percent loots the place left and right.

Rant over.

Happened to us on our last house. got 10k over asking and after appraisal (which conveniently came in at the Zillow estimate, to the penny) and the VA denied the buy's loan. We ended up selling at asking and had to do 2 repairs that the VA required even though it was an AS IS offer.

Fuck real estate. I'm never leaving this house now.

in the process of putting in an offer. staying in town.
1/4 acre property in town, backing to preserve .. so no one will build behind us (a bit like Syb's old place)
house is over priced.. coming in at $50k below asking.. realtors on both sides believe its a good offer
working on getting handyman to com eout to do some drywall work on our place.. have two weeks to put ours on the market (sellers are buying.. in no hurry.. although our purchase is contingent on our sale -- can carry both nuts maybe two months)
wife already spoke to GC.. we spent an hour in the house measuring.. she's got a major reno in mind.. i'm pushing the must have vs nice to have narrative... boy is excited.. lots of space.. great yard.. he'll have a shorted ride/walk to the HS.. a little closer to downtown too but its all very walkable anyway..
concerned on how to get my fellow board members to step up when we sell /leave as they'll be the ones who have to provide documentation to new buyers.. one joked they would hire me to keep doing the job cause they're incapable.
waiting on new letter from bank -- may mull it over the weekend as i read through the seller's disclosure.. but we have a good feeling..

let the adventure (almost) begin!

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:30 am Just found out we got fucked by the appraiser, who appraised the house at not only way less than the selling price, but less than the asking price. Come to find out it's a trainee who used a bunch of bullshit comps, so now my realtor has to fight with the appraising company because they're trying to fuck us out of $15,000. What a bullshit industry. Just another reason I'm glad I'm leaving this country. Everything about this place is bullshit and meant to fuck over the average person while the 1 percent loots the place left and right.

Rant over.

Fuck, man. I'm sorry. My realtor told a couple horror stories of her experience with inexperienced appraisers.

I still cannot figure out the point of appraising on some level. The person who bought my house was ready to go 10k over asking and pay cash. (That tells me, appraising be damned, I want this house.) But my appraisal came in at asking after all was said and done. All offers were at asking and we went with the "will close the quickest" option.

So does that mean someone can come in over the top when the house is listed and go under contract for that number only to have an appraiser undercut it and thereby fuck over the seller? Seems like the logic if you play it out.

I hope your situation can get unfucked. That's some bullshit.

The point is the banks don't want underwater collateral.

The truth is the buyer put a proviso in the contract that they would cover $5,000 if it didn't appraise for their selling price, we should be able to yell at the appraisal company to fix a couple of things (they didn't account for the spa that is part of the pool and swap out at least one of the bullshit comps they used which is a house in the neighborhood that has been wrecked by renters and is listed for $20K under what it should be and has still been on the market for 350 days, so that might add another $2K. Plus we have $1K in repairs on the pool that we were gonna do in good faith which we're gonna tell the buyers they can do now if they want them done. So when it's all said and done we're probably only gonna get fucked out of about $7K or $8K but it still chaps my ass.

A_B wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:12 pm The point is the banks don't want underwater collateral.

Sure, but the banks caused the Great Recession with their stupidity, got bailed out by taxpayers like me and all of the regulations put in place afterwards were not to protect homeowners or buyers but (mostly) to protect...the banks.

Fuck them.

My ass has also been chapped for 12 years that those fuckers weren't frogmarched into federal courtrooms and sent up the river for 20 years.

A_B wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:12 pm The point is the banks don't want underwater collateral.

I get that, but, then I feel like the appraisal needs to be done up front instead of at the tail end.

I mean, I went to market with an inspection that showed what I fixed. I feel like I could've gotten an appraiser to appraise early too. There's too much variability and all of a sudden you have something worth a lot less than you expected.

Johnnie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:21 pm

A_B wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:12 pm The point is the banks don't want underwater collateral.

I get that, but, then I feel like the appraisal needs to be done up front instead of at the tail end.

I mean, I went to market with an inspection that showed what I fixed. I feel like I could've gotten an appraiser to appraise early too. There's too much variability and all of a sudden you have something worth a lot less than you expected.

You could have done that. But the bank would still have required an appraiser of their choosing.

I'm not pro bank. I wish that a couple of more banks had been left to founder in the housing bubble.

hot and controversial take: what if it's as simple as a trainee screwing up because he/she is a trainee?

Brontoburglar wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:32 pm hot and controversial take: what if it's as simple as a trainee screwing up because he/she is a trainee?

Could be. That's what my realtor is going to try and find out. The offer was well over asking and would be a bit of an outlier relative to other houses in the neighborhood, but our house is maintained better than most of the houses in the neighborhood so it seems like we're being punished for that instead of rewarded.

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:34 pm

Brontoburglar wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:32 pm hot and controversial take: what if it's as simple as a trainee screwing up because he/she is a trainee?

Could be. That's what my realtor is going to try and find out. The offer was well over asking and would be a bit of an outlier relative to other houses in the neighborhood, but our house is maintained better than most of the houses in the neighborhood so it seems like we're being punished for that instead of rewarded.

This is a real thing. Friend had same issue. They made improvements and kept their house really well but it was in a bit of a starter neighborhood and it wouldn't bear higher prices.

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:30 am Just found out we got fucked by the appraiser, who appraised the house at not only way less than the selling price, but less than the asking price. Come to find out it's a trainee who used a bunch of bullshit comps, so now my realtor has to fight with the appraising company because they're trying to fuck us out of $15,000. What a bullshit industry. Just another reason I'm glad I'm leaving this country. Everything about this place is bullshit and meant to fuck over the average person while the 1 percent loots the place left and right.

Rant over.

y piensa que todo va a ser diferente en Mejico?

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:34 pm

Brontoburglar wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:32 pm hot and controversial take: what if it's as simple as a trainee screwing up because he/she is a trainee?

Could be. That's what my realtor is going to try and find out. The offer was well over asking and would be a bit of an outlier relative to other houses in the neighborhood, but our house is maintained better than most of the houses in the neighborhood so it seems like we're being punished for that instead of rewarded.

That's why they say it's best to have the worst house in a great neighborhood and never buy the best house in a neighborhood.

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:40 pm

brian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:30 am Just found out we got fucked by the appraiser, who appraised the house at not only way less than the selling price, but less than the asking price. Come to find out it's a trainee who used a bunch of bullshit comps, so now my realtor has to fight with the appraising company because they're trying to fuck us out of $15,000. What a bullshit industry. Just another reason I'm glad I'm leaving this country. Everything about this place is bullshit and meant to fuck over the average person while the 1 percent loots the place left and right.

Rant over.

y piensa que todo va a ser diferente en Mejico?

Well, we'll be renting for one, but your point is well-taken.

As for this appraisal I dug through the nuts and bolts and found several errors that I all reported to my Realtor, so we'll see how that turns out.

Johnnie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:11 pmSo does that mean someone can come in over the top when the house is listed and go under contract for that number only to have an appraiser undercut it and thereby fuck over the seller? Seems like the logic if you play it out.

This depends entirely on what kind of contract you negotiate. If you go accept an offer that is contingent on financing, and you know financing is contingent on the appraisal, then you're agreeing to make your contract contingent on the appraisal.

So if you have a choice between a contingent offer and a non-contingent cash offer - if you can get one of those - you'll be less likely to be at the risk of an appraisal.

Even that can't give you complete protection, though. The standard REPC usually makes the purchase contingent on inspection. So if the buyer gets his own appraisal and doesn't like what he sees, he can use the inspection contingency to back out.

A real estate deal is never done until the cash hits your account.

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:54 pm

Johnnie wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:11 pmSo does that mean someone can come in over the top when the house is listed and go under contract for that number only to have an appraiser undercut it and thereby fuck over the seller? Seems like the logic if you play it out.

This depends entirely on what kind of contract you negotiate. If you go accept an offer that is contingent on financing, and you know financing is contingent on the appraisal, then you're agreeing to make your contract contingent on the appraisal.

So if you have a choice between a contingent offer and a non-contingent cash offer - if you can get one of those - you'll be less likely to be at the risk of an appraisal.

Even that can't give you complete protection, though. The standard REPC usually makes the purchase contingent on inspection. So if the buyer gets his own appraisal and doesn't like what he sees, he can use the inspection contingency to back out.

A real estate deal is never done until the cash hits your account.

See, that makes more sense and goes into more detail than what my realtor (or any realtor, honestly) can explain up front.

My story, if you missed it: I put my house on the market at 240k. Within 12 hours of listing I had a full cash offer up to 250k. (The lady really, really wanted my house.) We went under contract at 240k by the end of that day (no one else offered more). She accepted my pre market inspection. And she only had a contractor look at the fixed stuff (which was fine) and we did the inspections for termites (cleared), vents (needed work, offered a credit which was accepted), and sewage (fine).

That's when my realtor was like "Last hurdle is appraisal and we're golden." To which I'm like "Wait... She's paying full cash. Why even bother?" She says, "It's part of the process." "And if after everything this appraisal comes in below asking, then what? I potentially get screwed out of money?" She's like,"I don't see that happening, but it's possible."

So luckily my appraisal was exactly at asking and I dodged a money loss, but looking at your last sentence, I wasn't enthusiastic when I went under contract initially because there's always something. And I trust nothing. That's what happens after many, many years in the military and sometimes people just don't get it.

But once I had the money in my account...weeeeeee!

The Sybian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:42 pm That's why they say it's best to have the worst house in a great neighborhood and never buy the best house in a neighborhood.

And, that's what I tell myself every time I wake up to the sound of pounding nails or a Bobcat beeping after they shift the gear to reverse.

Several teardowns/new homes in the neighborhood, but someday we'll benefit from having the sales prices of those houses as our new comps.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 8:18 pm

The Sybian wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 12:42 pm That's why they say it's best to have the worst house in a great neighborhood and never buy the best house in a neighborhood.

And, that's what I tell myself every time I wake up to the sound of pounding nails or a Bobcat beeping after they shift the gear to reverse.

Several teardowns/new homes in the neighborhood, but someday we'll benefit from having the sales prices of those houses as our new comps.

Even better, if you wait a few years and all the other houses are newer and bigger, you can sell as a teardown and not have to worry about fixing shit, cleaning up for showings or inspections and appraisal.

We got the appraiser to come up $5K so we’re only gonna get fucked out of $7K instead of $12K. Yay.

Why not ask em to pay the other $7k themselves. Just because their lender won't finance it doesn't mean they can't front the rest of the cash/equity portion, right? Sounds like your satisfied and still plenty time left for something else to cause the deal to fall apart so maybe a closed deal is better than an unclosed deal with better terms, but throwing out a solution/question.

Are these the people who agreed to pay the difference if it didn't appraise at a certain level?

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Sat Nov 14, 2020 12:20 pm Are these the people who agreed to pay the difference if it didn't appraise at a certain level?

They agree to cover $5,000 of it. We had agreed to do about $1,000 in repairs to the pool and we're going to ask them to absorb that instead and that will be that if they agree. It is what it is. The original appraisal goes on the record so there's not much point in blowing up the deal or asking for more money. Life goes on.

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:59 am in the process of putting in an offer. staying in town... but we have a good feeling..

let the adventure (almost) begin!

sellers came back last night w a counter offer...our offer was 92.5% of asking.. they countered with 98.5% of asking.. we went low because we had word they knew they were overpriced.. and the AC/Heat unit is 24yrs old.. and the roof is 20yrs old... and after telling us they would work on closing date as we are selling as well.. they came back with a firm date.

we're waiting on the final estimate from contractor to see how much we want to take off the reno to add to the offer, may not matter as i can't agree to a hard closing as long as its contingent on our own sale (which should go fast regardless. we'll see if they want to negotiate. Good news(?) their place has been on the market for a month.. we're the only ones who made an offer.
the missus didn't take the news well. regardless, painting and fixing and moving on as if we're putting it on the market after thanksgiving.

Is the HVAC and roof coming back to you post-inspection or are you eating that?

we lowballed the offer because of the age of those two.. had they (IF once they) accept the offer we'll go to inspection within ten days --

their disclosure claims no issues w either -- heck, my AC was older than than when it died.. and so was our roof -- a new roof here for that house would go around 7k.. AC likely another 12K.. thus the offer we made.. we took into consideration we'd need to spend around $20K to address those two.

not sure i answered your question.

I'm not sure why you couldn't get another appraisal. They only cost about $300 or so. And while they try to make it look like it's objective, it's obviously not, particularly in the selection of comps. Just hire another appraiser and let them know the last one came in way low due to bad comps. They shouldn't take your info into account, but they're human and they want business, so I can guarantee that their appraisal will come in higher.

Frankly, I always thought that the fact that you have an offer at a higher price should be pretty clear evidence of value, but I guess folks can use that to game the system.

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:35 amnot sure i answered your question.

Yup. Around here it works the other way, you make your best offer to get accepted and then start working backwards on the known or inspection discovered issues. That's almost always where deals fall apart here.

gotcha.

mrs flaco has lots of changes in mind so we got in to the house last week with a contractor.. have an idea of what that's going to be (although need the written estimate) as we'll do the mortgage to include the reno.
i'd hate to lose out on it - great bones, great property - as is.. at the least needs master bathroom expansion -- all else cosmetic in MY mind.. she disagrees of course - but has all we want.. big yard, 2car garage, office space for me (and her) and finished basement.. within walking distance of downtown and train station (who we kidding, all of town is within walking distance of dowtown) and easy for the boy to get to school (no buses for HS in this town)

Walking distance to city center (and walkable streets outside the house) are something we knew we cared about, but didn't know just how much before we left Boston. Pretty much an absolute must now.

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:35 am we lowballed the offer because of the age of those two.. had they (IF once they) accept the offer we'll go to inspection within ten days --

their disclosure claims no issues w either -- heck, my AC was older than than when it died.. and so was our roof -- a new roof here for that house would go around 7k.. AC likely another 12K.. thus the offer we made.. we took into consideration we'd need to spend around $20K to address those two.

not sure i answered your question.

If the house I’m buying requires $20k in infrastructure repairs, I’m requesting they knock $30k off the asking price. Especially if the house hasn’t seen much interest in the first month it’s been on the market.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:44 am Walking distance to city center (and walkable streets outside the house) are something we knew we cared about, but didn't know just how much before we left Boston. Pretty much an absolute must now.

Heh, my wife grew up in Chatham, walking distance to Main Street. Her took her 10 years to get over the fact that our town doesn't have a downtown to walk to. She used to make the kids join us for walks to get Frozen Yogurt, and it was two miles with about a mile long uphill on the way home. Usually hiked the last, steepest half mile with my daughter on my shoulders. Now we have an easy walk to all stores and restaurants, but not goingh anywhere. One day... At least the local homemade ice cream place is serving through the takeout window.

Their graham cracker ice cream base is insane. We got it a few times over the summer.

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:50 am

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:35 am we lowballed the offer because of the age of those two.. had they (IF once they) accept the offer we'll go to inspection within ten days --

their disclosure claims no issues w either -- heck, my AC was older than than when it died.. and so was our roof -- a new roof here for that house would go around 7k.. AC likely another 12K.. thus the offer we made.. we took into consideration we'd need to spend around $20K to address those two.

not sure i answered your question.

If the house I’m buying requires $20k in infrastructure repairs, I’m requesting they knock $30k off the asking price. Especially if the house hasn’t seen much interest in the first month it’s been on the market.

that's pretty much what we did (well we took 40K off the asking). spoke to the contractor - he's writing it up. our option is to stay where we are.. in which case we will expand the attic into a legal bedroom (need stairs too) w a dormer on the side -- its a townhouse.. so need board approval.. i'm the hoa pres.. of course i'll recuse but already have enough votes to make it happen if necessary. but i really want that yard... the raking notwithstanding.. do have a growing boy ready to wield gardening tools.