The Swamp

So this might end up being just Bronto and I talking, but there should be a thread.

Watched the last 15 laps of the 500 yesterday. Very compelling few minutes. Amazing drama and appreciate that it did not end in a crash. Also Jeff Gordon did a very good in the booth. He brought a voice to the race that has been missing. Someone who can talk tactics and driver mentality (which I found surprising because ex-drivers have filled that role before).

It's not included in your parentheses, but my good friend takes some amazing photos of races around here. His website is here.

Some samples here.

A "C" race buoyed by an "A++" finish

Is this appropriate for this thread? I'd be careful passing on the inside on this course.

Mike Wallace got jumped at the Rascal Flatts. Picture of his face is brutal.
http://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/na ... /86120708/

So Jeff Gordon will take the #88 from Little E (concussion like symptoms from accidents). I know the Hendricks relationship but I still have to believe some of the 88 fans won't be comfortable pulling for Gordon.

Wow. Nico Rosberg, who just won the Formula 1 driver's title Sunday, announced his retirement today. He's 31 years old.

I wonder if he got sick of having Lewis Hamilton as a teammate, especially after Lewis wouldn't get out of Rosberg's way Sunday to ensure his victory.

Sabo wrote:Wow. Nico Rosberg, who just won the Formula 1 driver's title Sunday, announced his retirement today. He's 31 years old.

I wonder if he got sick of having Lewis Hamilton as a teammate, especially after Lewis wouldn't get out of Rosberg's way Sunday to ensure his victory.

the second line of your post is so, so, so F1. I loved what HAM did on Sunday; but given the culture of team orders, I totally understand why Mercedes wanted him out of the way. (And also the fact that they wrecked each other at Barcelona)

Brontoburglar wrote:the second line of your post is so, so, so F1. I loved what HAM did on Sunday; but given the culture of team orders, I totally understand why Mercedes wanted him out of the way. (And also the fact that they wrecked each other at Barcelona)

I'm relatively new to being an F1 fan. Actually, part of what hooked me this season was watching the Barcelona race and seeing them knock each other out on the first lap. The fact the two best cars in the race were out made the race compelling.

But it was obvious that Rosberg and Hamilton didn't like each other. Their greeting after Rosberg won the title had all the warmth of a dead fish. But I get why Hamilton didn't follow orders. He's a racer, and all they want to do is win. Hamilton still had a chance to win the season title, but he had to win the race (and a few other things had to happen) in order to win it all. But the look on the Mercedes' camp when Hamilton refused to let Rosberg pass was rather comical.

Sabo wrote:

Brontoburglar wrote:the second line of your post is so, so, so F1. I loved what HAM did on Sunday; but given the culture of team orders, I totally understand why Mercedes wanted him out of the way. (And also the fact that they wrecked each other at Barcelona)

I'm relatively new to being an F1 fan. Actually, part of what hooked me this season was watching the Barcelona race and seeing them knock each other out on the first lap. The fact the two best cars in the race were out made the race compelling.

But it was obvious that Rosberg and Hamilton didn't like each other. Their greeting after Rosberg won the title had all the warmth of a dead fish. But I get why Hamilton didn't follow orders. He's a racer, and all they want to do is win. Hamilton still had a chance to win the season title, but he had to win the race (and a few other things had to happen) in order to win it all. But the look on the Mercedes' camp when Hamilton refused to let Rosberg pass was rather comical.

I'm fascinated to see if Mercedes can maintain the advantage going into the new technical regulations in 2017. And I'm a little scared to see how the bigger tires, etc, are going to affect the racing. If the cars are going faster and there's less space on the track, how are drivers going to be able to pass each other? It's not like passing is easy with all of the aerodynamic downforce at the moment anyway.

Also really excited to see who the new No. 2 (or No. 1B) is going to be for Merc. I wonder if they go get someone like Alonso who would probably drive for less money in exchange for a title shot vs. a guy like Ricciardo or Vettel.

I have no idea what his contract status is, but Max Verstappen to Mercedes would be fun to see.

Sabo wrote:I have no idea what his contract status is, but Max Verstappen to Mercedes would be fun to see.

I think he's a no-go given the new contract he got when they did the Toro Rosso/RBR swap with Kvyat earlier this year.

Maybe I can do it. I took Nico's seat for 2017 after driving for Haas F1 in 2016 in the latest F1 video game.

Lots of chatter Vegas is going to get a second NASCAR race as early as next year.
When are they going to move the second Daytona race to be the last race so site of the "Super Bowl of the sport" can actually be their Super Bowl? The bookends would seem to be a desirable symmetry.

Rams Fanny wrote:Lots of chatter Vegas is going to get a second NASCAR race as early as next year.
When are they going to move the second Daytona race to be the last race so site of the "Super Bowl of the sport" can actually be their Super Bowl? The bookends would seem to be a desirable symmetry.

no way in hell Daytona is going to ever be the final race of the year. way too random.

Brontoburglar wrote:

Rams Fanny wrote:Lots of chatter Vegas is going to get a second NASCAR race as early as next year.
When are they going to move the second Daytona race to be the last race so site of the "Super Bowl of the sport" can actually be their Super Bowl? The bookends would seem to be a desirable symmetry.

no way in hell Daytona is going to ever be the final race of the year. way too random.

Talladega and Martinsville are both in the Chase and have for their own reasons seem to have pretty random results. Also how is it good enough for the 'biggest' race but not the final one? Aren't they down to four drivers by the Miami race anyway and wouldn't randomness make it more exciting?

I'm sincerely trying to understand as a casual fan.

The recent decline of NASCAR from a commercial point of view seems dramatic. I can imagine many causes. I'd enjoy hearing or reading some thoughtful commentary about this.

Rams Fanny wrote:

Brontoburglar wrote:

Rams Fanny wrote:Lots of chatter Vegas is going to get a second NASCAR race as early as next year.
When are they going to move the second Daytona race to be the last race so site of the "Super Bowl of the sport" can actually be their Super Bowl? The bookends would seem to be a desirable symmetry.

no way in hell Daytona is going to ever be the final race of the year. way too random.

Talladega and Martinsville are both in the Chase and have for their own reasons seem to have pretty random results. Also how is it good enough for the 'biggest' race but not the final one? Aren't they down to four drivers by the Miami race anyway and wouldn't randomness make it more exciting?

I'm sincerely trying to understand as a casual fan.

there was a push by teams and manufacturers to move Talladega from an elimination race in the Chase (now playoffs) because of the randomness thing. Talladega and Kansas swapped dates for this year and now Kansas is the elimination race. Martinsville starts the third round with Texas and Phoenix.

And randomness is thankfully now considerably removed from the playoffs with the addition of the stages and bonus points. quite frankly, I have no hard feelings towards the stages and they made the Daytona 500 pretty awesomely quirky from a strategy perspective. as a part of the changes they made this year, the bonus points accumulated over the regular season carry for the first three rounds of the playoffs. previously your bonus points disappeared at the end of the first

this means there's a pretty good chance that the four drivers who were among the best throughout the entire season will be the ones at Homestead. and that's great, because Homestead is the perfect track to have a one-race-take-all finale (no matter how much I still don't like the concept). It's the type of track that dominates the schedule and it produces fantastic racing with multiple grooves.

personally, I would love to see Homestead also be the second race of the year. do a Daytona/Homestead/Vegas/Phoenix/Cali start to the season and ensure that you're in warm climates. Atlanta can then be in April or May and can replace the Dover spring race. I'm dreaming -- there are five year contracts with the tracks so there won't be many changes -- but I'd love to see that happen. Homestead deserves a second race more than any other track outside of a road course.

I'm also thinking the addition of Vegas in the playoffs would mean that New Hampshire loses its second date. both are owned by SMI, so it's an easy swap. and instead of having six 1.5-mile tracks in the 10 races of the playoffs, I'm betting/hoping that NASCAR will take the second CLT race and make it on the infield road course. it would satisfy the urges to add a road course to the playoffs as well as get Vegas a second date. we'll see if I'm right in the next few months.

DC47 wrote:The recent decline of NASCAR from a commercial point of view seems dramatic. I can imagine many causes. I'd enjoy hearing or reading some thoughtful commentary about this.

the same people who were impacted by the economic downturn and voted for Trump are NASCAR's primary fan base

and while that can explain attendance issues, it doesn't explain the problems with television attendance. though I think it's safe to say that NASCAR had a mortgage-type bubble in the early 2000s and is now back to a relatively stable base.

it's never going to be one of the two or three most popular sports in America. and that's fine. I got a bit frustrated when a prominent television figure said NASCAR was the No. 2 TV sport last week. that's bullshit. the 500 last year was the No. 31 rated sports program in 2016. that's not No. 2. and besides, NASCAR (and racing) is the only major sport when all of the competitors are facing each other in the same event on a weekly basis. if you're going to play the ratings comparison game you can't cherry pick and say "well it beat Spurs-Clippers."

Suck it, New Hampshire!

(Seriously though, aside from the economic advantages, not a fan of this. Already bad enough to have NASCAR fans in town for one weekend.)

Little E is a well known Washington fan....he will be driving an Eagles car at Pocono.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/dc- ... 8686492839

So we are heading down to Universal Studios Hollywood this Saturday for a week, then find out that the Long Beach Grand Prix will be happening.

My son really wants to go, but I think it would be a massive waste of time. The idea of a street course sounds cool, but I don't think you could really see anything of the race except for the part right in front of where you're sitting.

I would do a general admission ticket ($65 for you and free for your son if he qualifies as a junior) and two paddock passes Sunday ($27 each) if you did it. The garage would be a good place to see everything up close before the race and you can either stay there or wander around and find different places to sit during the race.

Brontoburglar wrote:I would do a general admission ticket ($65 for you and free for your son if he qualifies as a junior) and two paddock passes Sunday ($27 each) if you did it. The garage would be a good place to see everything up close before the race and you can either stay there or wander around and find different places to sit during the race.

He's 16, so probably not free.

I don't think we could commit to the whole day, since that is our first day in LA and we are supposed to be going to Universal that day. So I think it just isn't worth trying to squeeze it in.

But I could see making the trip next year if he is still into racing then.

Steve of phpBB wrote:

Brontoburglar wrote:I would do a general admission ticket ($65 for you and free for your son if he qualifies as a junior) and two paddock passes Sunday ($27 each) if you did it. The garage would be a good place to see everything up close before the race and you can either stay there or wander around and find different places to sit during the race.

He's 16, so probably not free.

I don't think we could commit to the whole day, since that is our first day in LA and we are supposed to be going to Universal that day. So I think it just isn't worth trying to squeeze it in.

But I could see making the trip next year if he is still into racing then.

yeah, if that's your first day and you don't have most of the day, don't do it.

The last few laps of the Russian Grand Prix was compelling. I was so locked in while watching it I pissed off Mrs. Sabo because I wasn't answering her questions.

Sabo wrote:The last few laps of the Russian Grand Prix was compelling. I was so locked in while watching it I pissed off Mrs. Sabo because I wasn't answering her questions.

It was the best F1 race of the year so far. I for sure thought VET was going to get a chance at BOT but MAS messed that up

(Using F1 abbreviations to throw people off)

Brontoburglar wrote:

Sabo wrote:The last few laps of the Russian Grand Prix was compelling. I was so locked in while watching it I pissed off Mrs. Sabo because I wasn't answering her questions.

It was the best F1 race of the year so far. I for sure thought VET was going to get a chance at BOT but MAS messed that up

(Using F1 abbreviations to throw people off)

My son is so bummed - he accidentally got spoiled of the results before he was able to watch. These damned 5 AM MDT start times.

I have to say, I am getting into MotoGP and Supercross. Those races don't last too long, and there seems to be more drama than in car racing. The Supercross was here last weekend, and the 450 final race may have been the most exciting sporting event I've ever seen.

This morning's Spanish Grand Prix has been fun. Force India could be the biggest winner even though neither car are likely to make the podium.

Question for Bronto. Is there a limit the number of times a racer can use the DRS? Because HAM only passed VET on that straightaway to take the lead because he used the DRS. I know the DRS can only be used on certain sections of the track, but if a racer could use it all the time, why wouldn't they so they can get that speed boost?

Sabo wrote:This morning's Spanish Grand Prix has been fun. Force India could be the biggest winner even though neither car are likely to make the podium.

Question for Bronto. Is there a limit the number of times a racer can use the DRS? Because HAM only passed VET on that straightaway to take the lead because he used the DRS. I know the DRS can only be used on certain sections of the track, but if a racer could use it all the time, why wouldn't they so they can get that speed boost?

You have to be within one second of a car ahead of you at a designated spot before the DRS zone. So say the DRS zone is the front straight at the Spanish Grand Prix, then the spot is probably right before that downhill chicane or just after it entering that longish corner onto the front straight.

The car ahead doesn't have to be for position. So if the leader is closing on a lapped car heading into the DRS zone, then he can use the flap if he's within the one-second mark.

But if the car is 1.5 or 10.5 or whatever, tough shit. No DRS for you.

Thanks for the explanation, bronto.

Also, do you have any recommendations for F1 reporters to follow on Twitter?

Guy I know from high school is racing in the same ARCA race as Kyle Busch Wednesday.

(As an aside, that dude (Kyle Busch) must really love racing because I swear it seems like he's racing in every penny-ante go-kart race from here to Chile.)

ETA: It's Wednesday, actually. Which makes more sense since Busch will be tied up with NASCAR stuff all weekend.

brian wrote:Guy I know from high school is racing in the same ARCA race as Kyle Busch this weekend.

(As an aside, that dude (Kyle Busch) must really love racing because I swear it seems like he's racing in every penny-ante go-kart race from here to Chile.)

I think you get a lot of that. A bunch of those guys do this. You see big names doing Sprint Cars, Baja, some autocross, and 24 hour endurance races. Maybe not as much as they used to (injuries, Stewart, more money, sponsor commitments, etc) but not uncommon.

The start of the Singapore F1 race this morning was bonkers. It's almost as if Jesus Christ Himself interfered to give Lewis Hamilton the lead. (Well, that and a ton of rain.)

Fantastic. Only thing better is if this was Florida or Ohio. Figure 8 racing is tough.

http://www.wcyb.com/news/must-watch-rac ... /638911018

Sabo wrote:The start of the Singapore F1 race this morning was bonkers. It's almost as if Jesus Christ Himself interfered to give Lewis Hamilton the lead. (Well, that and a ton of rain.)

MotoGP in the rain is a hell of a thing. Fantastic race yesterday.

Formula 1 is ridiculous. Lewis Hamilton starts in the last spot after crashing in qualifying, and is now leading the race after 37 laps in a 71-lap race. I know he’s a gifted racer but it shows the massive gulf between the top teams (Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull) and the also-rans.

Sabo wrote:Formula 1 is ridiculous. Lewis Hamilton starts in the last spot after crashing in qualifying, and is now leading the race after 37 laps in a 71-lap race. I know he’s a gifted racer but it shows the massive gulf between the top teams (Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull) and the also-rans.

He's also lucky there were 2 crashes at the start which brought out yellow and put him in 12th immediately.
God interfering to make Lewis win again.

Hamilton finished fourth. He had to pit sometime around lap 40 and dropped back to sixth. I think he would’ve caught Raikkinen for third if he had two more laps. Good race, though.

degenerasian wrote:

Sabo wrote:Formula 1 is ridiculous. Lewis Hamilton starts in the last spot after crashing in qualifying, and is now leading the race after 37 laps in a 71-lap race. I know he’s a gifted racer but it shows the massive gulf between the top teams (Mercedes, Ferrari, Red Bull) and the also-rans.

He's also lucky there were 2 crashes at the start which brought out yellow and put him in 12th immediately.
God interfering to make Lewis win again.

(He was in 14th when the race restarted)

((and would probably have finished fourth anyway had he been in 16th or 17th when the race restarted))