The Swamp

Rush2112 wrote:

Pruitt wrote:My daughter has accepted an offer from Ryerson

DOWNTOWN YYZ.

I'm taking a web accessibility class from Ryerson currently.

Congrats to her!

Thanks!

Both kids attending Toronto universities.

My son is at the highly-regarded but awkwardly named Ontario College of Art and Design University (OCAD).

Each school has a landmark building - at Ryerson, it's Maple Leaf Gardens (or as mentioned, the top third of the Gardens)



At OCAD, it's the main building -

That building looks awkward to get into...

tennbengal wrote:That building looks awkward to get into...

It's actually connected to the other building.

Who was the Architect on that, looks a like Will Alsop Peckham Library

A_B wrote:Anyone know anything about Arcadia?

I hope their mascot is the Flycatchers.

I've been in that OCAD building. When my wife and I were in Toronto for our anniversary in 2006 we somehow stumbled across it walking around town and checked it out.

Baloney wrote:Who was the Architect on that, looks a like Will Alsop Peckham Library

Very nice, Baloney.

"Through Rod Robbie of Robbie/Young + Wright Architects, Will Alsop of Alsop Architects was made aware of the project and was eventually selected in 2002."

Baloney wrote:Who was the Architect on that, looks a like Will Alsop Peckham Library

Good eye - it was will Alsop.

Peckham

Cool library.

The Alsop building in Toronto became an instant landmark and immediately gave the university an identity with the outside world. (Amazing what that and a massive bequest can do for a school's image!)

I've wandered around the building with my son. It seems to suit its purpose very well - unlike other recent "starchitect" buildings in the city. He says that the students love it.

Worked on a few 'starchitects' projects over the years Hadid, Calatrava, Foster, Koolhaus, RAMSA, Gehry

Of the many conventional things my oldest daughter has already passed on, college visits is high on the list for the smartest decision. My guess is that they are worthless or worse (actively deceptive) for 70-90% of high school students. Also high on the list is GRE prep classes.

So the college admissions season was a summer breeze in our household. And we witnessed some real hurricanes in our daughter's peer group.

She's now technically a senior at an elite university. Last time we discussed the college admissions game, she was quite convinced that her very happy life would be roughly as good if she had gone to UC Boulder or Washington (she's big on mountaineering) or an equivalent less-prestigious and less-expensive school. That choice would have been fine with me when she was 17, and we discussed how it would be reasonable to consider transferring even now as a senior.

She has absolutely loved her experience at Elite School X. But she sees through the mystique. All the effort she saw expended to optimize college admissions and then find exactly the "right match?" From her point of view it is largely, in almost every case, a pointless joke that teenagers and their clueless parents painfully and expensively enact year after year like lemmings going off a cliff.

In my experience, it's pretty much pointless to share this view with others, much less the details that drive the conclusion. The brainwashing is just too strong. So I offer it as a thought that might someday prove mildly enlightening to those who are, for other reasons, starting to see the light.

DC47 wrote:Of the many conventional things my oldest daughter has already passed on, college visits is high on the list for the smartest decision. My guess is that they are worthless or worse (actively deceptive) for 70-90% of high school students. Also high on the list is GRE prep classes.

So the college admissions season was a summer breeze in our household. And we witnessed some real hurricanes in our daughter's peer group.

She's now technically a senior at an elite university. Last time we discussed the college admissions game, she was quite convinced that her very happy life would be roughly as good if she had gone to UC Boulder or Washington (she's big on mountaineering) or an equivalent less-prestigious and less-expensive school. That choice would have been fine with me when she was 17, and we discussed how it would be reasonable to consider transferring even now as a senior.

She has absolutely loved her experience at Elite School X. But she sees through the mystique. All the effort she saw expended to optimize college admissions and then find exactly the "right match?" From her point of view it is largely, in almost every case, a pointless joke that teenagers and their clueless parents painfully and expensively enact year after year like lemmings going off a cliff.

In my experience, it's pretty much pointless to share this view with others, much less the details that drive the conclusion. The brainwashing is just too strong. So I offer it as a thought that might someday prove mildly enlightening to those who are, for other reasons, starting to see the light.

My wife and I have had numerous conversations about college even though our son is 3. We hope he does want to choose higher education but we have decided if he wants help he can go to an in state public school. My education was excellent for the money. If he wants to go to said private school that charges big $, he better get a big scholly. Just no reason to dish out that money. I am very happy with my MAC education.

Mulligan wrote:I am very happy with my MAC education.

Hell yeah.

But wait, you did go to an expensive private school after getting your MAC education. So you got the best of both worlds.

satisMACtion

Sabo wrote:

Mulligan wrote:I am very happy with my MAC education.

Hell yeah.

But wait, you did go to an expensive private school after getting your MAC education. So you got the best of both worlds.

True. Considering that only private schools offered my degree, I had little choice.

Mulligan wrote:My wife and I have had numerous conversations about college even though our son is 3. We hope he does want to choose higher education but we have decided if he wants help he can go to an in state public school. My education was excellent for the money. If he wants to go to said private school that charges big $, he better get a big scholly. Just no reason to dish out that money. I am very happy with my MAC education.

I wish you the best in holding the line, if that's in the best interest of your child and family when the time comes to consider college.

In my experience, most who say this kind of thing when their kids are young will bail out when they are college juniors, if they have a decent chance to get into schools that are "better" than the state college that's available. There are tremendous social pressures at play, both on parents and children. Generally, the smarter the kid (per conventional measures) and the higher the social class of the family, the greater the pressure to play the elite college admissions game, with attendant financial and time costs, as well as potentially great stress on all involved.

I've witnessed this process costing $10-20K all included, plus 500-1000 hours of parent and child time. The stress can't be quantified, but can be quite extreme (including parent-child conflict). Just my opinion of course, but I think that the actual value added only rarely falls in an equivalent range.

My favorite pair of stories are about families who were in the high end of those ranges, but in the end -- after all the elite school visits, interviews, essays, test prep, etc. -- the kid went to the highly-regarded home-town state school. And seems to be thriving in both cases.

I live in a public school district significantly above my pay grade and my kids all know the drill about college financing. I will help as much as I can, but that help is extremely limited. So, they've so far made very financially sound decisions about college. My daughter is going to a local community college with plans to transfer to a local quality state school. She is likely to graduate with zero debt thanks to the help I can provide, her job, and scholarships. Some of her high school friends came over last night- one Stanford, one Yale, one Columbia, one Michigan (on campus). I'm so glad she doesn't feel the need to keep pace with her wealthier friends.

Moreta wrote:I live in a public school district significantly above my pay grade and my kids all know the drill about college financing. I will help as much as I can, but that help is extremely limited. So, they've so far made very financially sound decisions about college. My daughter is going to a local community college with plans to transfer to a local quality state school. She is likely to graduate with zero debt thanks to the help I can provide, her job, and scholarships. Some of her high school friends came over last night- one Stanford, one Yale, one Columbia, one Michigan (on campus). I'm so glad she doesn't feel the need to keep pace with her wealthier friends.

That's a great story. Sounds like a sensible girl. (And fancy friends!)

Well. It's looking like BU, sight unseen. On one hand, it was a school she was very interested in from the jump (it's in the first post) but I have some trepidation about never having been there. They gave a much more generous aid package than we were expecting, so it is surprisingly close to UK if she lived on campus here. We are going to try to get up there, but it doesn't look like it will be before she has to make a decision. She had a couple of other options, but the ones that would have beaten BU declined her admission.

Thanks to all of you, and I know it sounds like BU might not have been the swamp's first choice, but she is excited so we are going to try to be excited, too.

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:24 am Well. It's looking like BU, sight unseen. On one hand, it was a school she was very interested in from the jump (it's in the first post) but I have some trepidation about never having been there. They gave a much more generous aid package than we were expecting, so it is surprisingly close to UK if she lived on campus here. We are going to try to get up there, but it doesn't look like it will be before she has to make a decision. She had a couple of other options, but the ones that would have beaten BU declined her admission.

Thanks to all of you, and I know it sounds like BU might not have been the swamp's first choice, but she is excited so we are going to try to be excited, too.

Better start her on enjoying hockey. I suggest adopting the Golden Knights for the NHL playoffs as a start. (That's only like 25 percent of a joke. BU hockey comprises pretty much the only major varsity sport there, but it is in fact a VBFD there.)

I'm sure she'll probably love it. Most important thing is she'll be getting a great education. Can't fault the academics at BU one bit.

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:24 am Well. It's looking like BU, sight unseen. On one hand, it was a school she was very interested in from the jump (it's in the first post) but I have some trepidation about never having been there. They gave a much more generous aid package than we were expecting, so it is surprisingly close to UK if she lived on campus here. We are going to try to get up there, but it doesn't look like it will be before she has to make a decision. She had a couple of other options, but the ones that would have beaten BU declined her admission.

Thanks to all of you, and I know it sounds like BU might not have been the swamp's first choice, but she is excited so we are going to try to be excited, too.

Syb and I know a thing about BU. It's definitely a city school. I enjoyed my year there. Other than its insane sports fans, Boston is a great, liveable town. She's probably going to stick out a bit, coming from Kentucky, just like I did, coming from Florida.

I'm going to charge you $15,000 for move-in day services. You're going to think that's a lot, but when traffic starts at my house you'll be glad you're in line early

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:31 amOther than its insane sports fans, Boston is a great, liveable town.

And you can mostly avoid them if you don't go into the outer suburbs or their small pockets of Southie and Somerville.

mister d wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:37 am

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:31 amOther than its insane sports fans, Boston is a great, liveable town.

And you can mostly avoid them if you don't go into the outer suburbs or their small pockets of Southie and Somerville.

This is good to know. I was a bit worried about the stereotypical masshole.

Yeah, the stereotype will only infiltrate her world 81 times per year if she happens to take the green line at just the wrong time.

Funny, my daughter is/was very interested in Boston University, too. She got accepted, but they didn't offer any scholarship money, so that looks like it is out for us. Flying to Seattle on Saturday to check out U Washington. That looks to be a top contender, along with University of California-Davis, and UC Santa Barbara. She got in to a few other schools that she has crossed off her list (sniff... Colorado and Colorado State, included...sniff).

I am really frustrated, though. Not meaning to brag here but she has had all A's in her life, took a mostly AP/IB classes, got in the 99% percentile on SAT and ACT, killed the math subject matter test. Yet, got declined by Berkeley and MIT, waitlisted at UCLA. My daughter doesn't really care, as far as I can tell, but it pisses me off.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:49 am Funny, my daughter is/was very interested in Boston University, too. She got accepted, but they didn't offer any scholarship money, so that looks like it is out for us. Flying to Seattle on Saturday to check out U Washington. That looks to be a top contender, along with University of California-Davis, and UC Santa Barbara. She got in to a few other schools that she has crossed off her list (sniff... Colorado and Colorado State, included...sniff).

I am really frustrated, though. Not meaning to brag here but she has had all A's in her life, took a mostly AP/IB classes, got in the 99% percentile on SAT and ACT, killed the math subject matter test. Yet, got declined by Berkeley and MIT, waitlisted at UCLA. My daughter doesn't really care, as far as I can tell, but it pisses me off.

I'm assuming you might rather she do UC-Davis because of (relative) proximity? I really liked my time in Davis, I would totally see myself going to school there if I were in a similar situation. Really cool town, great school, still fairly close to get back to the Bay Area. One of the reasons I went to Central Michigan is I needed to get at least a couple of hours away from my parents, but it was close enough to drive back whenever I wanted to.

Yeah, I'd rather she go to Davis than Washington for the proximity reason. But, we will let her make that call, since the scholarship-weighted cost would be about the same.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:49 am

I am really frustrated, though. Not meaning to brag here but she has had all A's in her life, took a mostly AP/IB classes, got in the 99% percentile on SAT and ACT, killed the math subject matter test. Yet, got declined by Berkeley and MIT, waitlisted at UCLA. My daughter doesn't really care, as far as I can tell, but it pisses me off.

My daughter chose to not apply to too many schools, most of them higher end and with lower acceptance rates. She got into UK, Macalester, BU and likely will be accepted at a smaller college here in Kentucky but rejected at a few we thought she had a shot at and a couple that were reaches. We haven't heard from Reed in Portland yet, but she knows that would be a long shot unless they gave her a full ride somehow. She also did an aggressive AP class courseload and had a 35 ACT. But in the end she's going to a school she was high on from the start so it's Kool and the Gang

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:58 am

sancarlos wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:49 am

I am really frustrated, though. Not meaning to brag here but she has had all A's in her life, took a mostly AP/IB classes, got in the 99% percentile on SAT and ACT, killed the math subject matter test. Yet, got declined by Berkeley and MIT, waitlisted at UCLA. My daughter doesn't really care, as far as I can tell, but it pisses me off.

My daughter chose to not apply to too many schools, most of them higher end and with lower acceptance rates. She got into UK, Macalester, BU and likely will be accepted at a smaller college here in Kentucky but rejected at a few we thought she had a shot at and a couple that were reaches. We haven't heard from Reed in Portland yet, but she knows that would be a long shot unless they gave her a full ride somehow. She also did an aggressive AP class courseload and had a 35 ACT. But in the end she's going to a school she was high on from the start so it's Kool and the Gang

I hear you. In the end, it's about the kid not the parent.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:59 am

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:58 am

sancarlos wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:49 am

I am really frustrated, though. Not meaning to brag here but she has had all A's in her life, took a mostly AP/IB classes, got in the 99% percentile on SAT and ACT, killed the math subject matter test. Yet, got declined by Berkeley and MIT, waitlisted at UCLA. My daughter doesn't really care, as far as I can tell, but it pisses me off.

My daughter chose to not apply to too many schools, most of them higher end and with lower acceptance rates. She got into UK, Macalester, BU and likely will be accepted at a smaller college here in Kentucky but rejected at a few we thought she had a shot at and a couple that were reaches. We haven't heard from Reed in Portland yet, but she knows that would be a long shot unless they gave her a full ride somehow. She also did an aggressive AP class courseload and had a 35 ACT. But in the end she's going to a school she was high on from the start so it's Kool and the Gang

I hear you. In the end, it's about the kid not the parent.

Until Parent's Weekend...then it is all about the parent. We expect stories of sancarlos going face down because he drank too much of the fruit punch from the trashcanat the frat party with the cool funk band they remembered from college. Oh maybe that was a few of the dads of my friend at W&L.

Man, forgot this thread existed... Here's my April:

Sat, April 7 - Philly for Drexel's admitted student day

Th-Sat, April 12-14 - U. of Denver

Th - April 19 fly into Burlington for Fri UVM admitted kids day
Sat - Boston - Emerson's student

She also got into Fordham, but that's just not a great fit.

Wait-listed at Wisconsin, NYU and Boston U.

She got nice financial aid packages to all these joints, which means it really comes down to what school is the best fit.

She is a big college hockey fan and had her heart set on BU, but she didn't slam dunk this semester and she was already borderline for that joint. Tough life lesson for her, getting rejected by some of her top choices. It's hard to convince her that these other schools are great and that getting the scholarships and grants speaks to how great a kid she is... I think she's coming around as we plan these trips.

Like, Drexel wasn't on her radar at all, even as late as last week while we were away on Spring Break. We get back and they have a fancy "admitted student" package and now she's really excited to go check it out.

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:48 pm Man, forgot this thread existed... Here's my April:

Sat, April 7 - Philly for Drexel's admitted student day

Th-Sat, April 12-14 - U. of Denver

Th - April 19 fly into Burlington for Fri UVM admitted kids day
Sat - Boston - Emerson's student

She also got into Fordham, but that's just not a great fit.

Wait-listed at Wisconsin, NYU and Boston U.

She got nice financial aid packages to all these joints, which means it really comes down to what school is the best fit.

She is a big college hockey fan and had her heart set on BU, but she didn't slam dunk this semester and she was already borderline for that joint. Tough life lesson for her, getting rejected by some of her top choices. It's hard to convince her that these other schools are great and that getting the scholarships and grants speaks to how great a kid she is... I think she's coming around as we plan these trips.

Like, Drexel wasn't on her radar at all, even as late as last week while we were away on Spring Break. We get back and they have a fancy "admitted student" package and now she's really excited to go check it out.

Have a few friends who went to Drexel. Everyone of them LOVED IT because of the fairly unique requirement to spend time actually doing real work in the industry. The campus is not pretty and basically gets short-shift in attention because it shares the neighborhood with Penn. But everyone I know had a great experience and launch into their career from going their (note: They were all engineers of some nature).

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:48 pm She is a big college hockey fan

DU is pretty darn good, UVM goes up and down. Both are nice places to live, Burlington is quite a bit colder in winter, but also a little "nicer" in it still has some college town feel.

wlu_lax6 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:22 pm

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:48 pm Man, forgot this thread existed... Here's my April:

Sat, April 7 - Philly for Drexel's admitted student day

Th-Sat, April 12-14 - U. of Denver

Th - April 19 fly into Burlington for Fri UVM admitted kids day
Sat - Boston - Emerson's student

She also got into Fordham, but that's just not a great fit.

Wait-listed at Wisconsin, NYU and Boston U.

She got nice financial aid packages to all these joints, which means it really comes down to what school is the best fit.

She is a big college hockey fan and had her heart set on BU, but she didn't slam dunk this semester and she was already borderline for that joint. Tough life lesson for her, getting rejected by some of her top choices. It's hard to convince her that these other schools are great and that getting the scholarships and grants speaks to how great a kid she is... I think she's coming around as we plan these trips.

Like, Drexel wasn't on her radar at all, even as late as last week while we were away on Spring Break. We get back and they have a fancy "admitted student" package and now she's really excited to go check it out.

Have a few friends who went to Drexel. Everyone of them LOVED IT because of the fairly unique requirement to spend time actually doing real work in the industry. The campus is not pretty and basically gets short-shift in attention because it shares the neighborhood with Penn. But everyone I know had a great experience and launch into their career from going their (note: They were all engineers of some nature).

My son is at Northeastern, which operates on the same unique "co-op" model. That's what has her intrigued.

Rush2112 wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 4:27 pm

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 3:48 pm She is a big college hockey fan

DU is pretty darn good, UVM goes up and down. Both are nice places to live, Burlington is quite a bit colder in winter, but also a little "nicer" in it still has some college town feel.

Oh, believe me, she's fully aware of both programs and could tell you what NHL teams have prospects (if any) on those respective teams.

We've actually spent a fair amount of time in Burlington, a couple of ski trips to Smugs and Stowe and another couple of trips in the summer as part of swings through Maine. We love it up there.

I really don't know where this is gonna land. Denver is a great city and we've heard great things about the campus, but there's a possibility that place is too Greek-heavy. Emerson is a quirky joint, but it is spot on with her major and she is close to BU, BC and Northeastern if she wants to get her hockey fix in. Vermont has hockey and it is gorgeous up there. Drexel is an outlier that kind of snuck in under the wire. (I forgot she even applied there.)

She should go to Vermont and then boo the shit out of BU when they come to town. BU fucking sucks!

My father went to Denver (and played hockey there). 2017 National champs. And recently, as soon as they were eliminated from the NCAA playoffs, four of their players signed with the NHL teams that had drafted them. So, yeah, big-time hockey.

But, it is a rich kid school, with a prominent greek culture.

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Apr 03, 2018 10:24 am Well. It's looking like BU, sight unseen. On one hand, it was a school she was very interested in from the jump (it's in the first post) but I have some trepidation about never having been there. They gave a much more generous aid package than we were expecting, so it is surprisingly close to UK if she lived on campus here. We are going to try to get up there, but it doesn't look like it will be before she has to make a decision. She had a couple of other options, but the ones that would have beaten BU declined her admission.

Thanks to all of you, and I know it sounds like BU might not have been the swamp's first choice, but she is excited so we are going to try to be excited, too.

I was hoping this was Butler so I could see AB a little more....