Mandalay Bay Shooting

bfj · Post by **bfj** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:02 am

I know Brian wasn't at a country show, but I hope all are safe in Vegas.

Terrifying stuff. Suspect dead, 60 year old white male.

Couldn't remember the other Vegas Swamper's name. Hope all is ok for Rams Fanny and his family and friends.

Square Rob · Post by **Square Rob** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:52 am

50+ fatalities. The videos circulating are terrifying.

rass · Post by **rass** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:53 am

Latest reports are at least 50 dead and 200 injured.

I gave up on anything being done about horrors like this about 5 years ago, but holy shit.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 5:57 am

No doubt the weapon was legal as well.

What a nightmare.

rass · Post by **rass** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:08 am

Pruitt wrote:No doubt the weapon was legal as well.

What a nightmare.

Last report I heard on the radio on the way into work was that the shooter had no police record. If so, there's no reason why he couldn't have obtained it legally.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:09 am

He was apparently shooting from the 32nd floor of the Mandalay Bay.

rass · Post by **rass** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:23 am

Square Rob wrote:50+ fatalities. The videos circulating are terrifying.

The audio alone is terrifying.

bfj · Post by **bfj** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:31 am

rass wrote:
Square Rob wrote:50+ fatalities. The videos circulating are terrifying.

The audio alone is terrifying.

Jason Aldean is pretty bad, but terrifying?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:32 am

https://twitter.com/ABC/status/914826000692690946

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 7:37 am

So...metal detectors at every hotel now? We can just shift all TSA over to that since blowing up planes seems to be passe

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:14 am

we really need to have a conversation about using the words "radical caucasian terrorism"

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:25 am

Brontoburglar wrote:we really need to have a conversation about using the words "radical caucasian terrorism"

God help you on twitter today, Nick. Good luck.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:29 am

I suspect when all this is unpacked you'll find out this was economic terrorism. The fact that this guy lived in Pahrump is a big clue.

ETA: Just for those not familiar, it's an "exurb" about 45 minutes outside of Las Vegas filled with nut jobs of every stripe and persuasion but the main thread linking them together is that almost all of them hate Las Vegas, but have to live near Las Vegas. So racists, homophobes, people who think the moon landing was faked. The whole stripe of insanity and right-wing paranoia.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 8:30 am

He posted this after the Pulse shooting. And he was right.

https://twitter.com/anthonyjeselnik/sta ... 0374764544

DaveInSeattle · Post by **DaveInSeattle** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:12 am

brian wrote:I suspect when all this is unpacked you'll find out this was economic terrorism. The fact that this guy lived in Pahrump is a big clue.

ETA: Just for those not familiar, it's an "exurb" about 45 minutes outside of Las Vegas filled with nut jobs of every stripe and persuasion but the main thread linking them together is that almost all of them hate Las Vegas, but have to live near Las Vegas. So racists, homophobes, people who think the moon landing was faked. The whole stripe of insanity and right-wing paranoia.

Wasn't Pahrump the home base for the Art Bell radio show?

EnochRoot · Post by **EnochRoot** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:13 am

Wake me when they start live-feeding the mass shooting into living rooms across America..

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:15 am

DaveInSeattle wrote:
brian wrote:I suspect when all this is unpacked you'll find out this was economic terrorism. The fact that this guy lived in Pahrump is a big clue.

ETA: Just for those not familiar, it's an "exurb" about 45 minutes outside of Las Vegas filled with nut jobs of every stripe and persuasion but the main thread linking them together is that almost all of them hate Las Vegas, but have to live near Las Vegas. So racists, homophobes, people who think the moon landing was faked. The whole stripe of insanity and right-wing paranoia.

Wasn't Pahrump the home base for the Art Bell radio show?

Yeah, and that's not a coincidence.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:26 am

Ah yes, Pahrump...

http://gawker.com/215434/real-life-pahrumps-politics-let-aaron-sorkin-down

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:52 am

It is being called terrorism on the news?

By definition an act of terrorism means any act that involves the use or attempted use of sabotage, coercion or violence which is intended to cause great bodily harm or death to the general population. I took that from Nevada Law.

Also I hope and pray there are no copycats in the near future.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:52 am

So turns out he's from Mesquite, which is quite different from Pahrump in many ways, but similar in others. But not sure why he was IDed as being from Pahrump. Pahrump and Mesquite are both exurbs of Las Vegas and in the same county, but literally about three hours apart.

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:53 am

degenerasian wrote:By definition an act of terrorism means any act that involves the use or attempted use of sabotage, coercion or violence which is intended to cause great bodily harm or death to the general population. I took that from Nevada Law.

Needs a political motive.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:54 am

I'm going to throw something through my TV the first time I see someone try to litigate the use of the word terrorism. I think any situation in which you're trying to kill as large a group of people as possible is terrorism. Period. End stop. There needs no ideology necessary to qualify.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:03 am

A friend of mine is in Vegas for a wedding. He and his girlfriend were at the Mandelay Bay theatre watching Cirque du Soleil when the shooting happen. They were kept in the theatre for a few hours and then driven to the Thomas and Mack center. Finally they got back to the ARIA this morning.

They are a bit shaken but really appreciated how organized the Las Vegas PD were and to the volunteers driving people back and forth.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:06 am

brian wrote:So turns out he's from Mesquite, which is quite different from Pahrump in many ways, but similar in others. But not sure why he was IDed as being from Pahrump. Pahrump and Mesquite are both exurbs of Las Vegas and in the same county, but literally about three hours apart.

How is Mesquite different in many ways but similar in others? I've listened to the Art Bell show although it's taken many forms over the years. They used to play it live on Calgary radio but now have pushed later and later. I think 1am now.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:07 am

brian wrote:I'm going to throw something through my TV the first time I see someone try to litigate the use of the word terrorism. I think any situation in which you're trying to kill as large a group of people as possible is terrorism. Period. End stop. There needs no ideology necessary to qualify.

I used "full stop" in my terrorism definition to friends earlier. My definition was, "Kill anyone randomly, it's terrorism. Full stop. Not sure why we need more than that for the definition."

I'm including theoretical one at a time killings, as without motive, terror is felt by the populace. I guess that's likely more often described as serial killing, but whatevs.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:10 am

Turns out I have two facebook friends who were backstage at the time of the shooting. They travel for work a bit for video/sound work.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:16 am

degenerasian wrote:
brian wrote:So turns out he's from Mesquite, which is quite different from Pahrump in many ways, but similar in others. But not sure why he was IDed as being from Pahrump. Pahrump and Mesquite are both exurbs of Las Vegas and in the same county, but literally about three hours apart.

How is Mesquite different in many ways but similar in others? I've listened to the Art Bell show although it's taken many forms over the years. They used to play it live on Calgary radio but now have pushed later and later. I think 1am now.

They're both retirement communities (or at least there are a lot of retirees in both), but Mesquite is more upscale and contains the kind of retirees you stereotypically think of when you think of retirees. Wearing socks with sandals, playing golf, eating dinner at 4 p.m., complaining about anyone under 50, etc. Pahrump is definitely a more sinister place and has some of that crowd, but also the people who are trying to get off the grid and some -- hell, many -- who take that literally and generate all of their power from solar, etc. (Should note Pahrump is not in the same county as Mesquite, though it is close -- it's on the Nye/Clark County border). They are about 3 hours apart though.

Jerloma · Post by **Jerloma** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:23 am

govmentchedda wrote:
brian wrote:I'm going to throw something through my TV the first time I see someone try to litigate the use of the word terrorism. I think any situation in which you're trying to kill as large a group of people as possible is terrorism. Period. End stop. There needs no ideology necessary to qualify.

I used "full stop" in my terrorism definition to friends earlier. My definition was, "Kill anyone randomly, it's terrorism. Full stop. Not sure why we need more than that for the definition."

I'm including theoretical one at a time killings, as without motive, terror is felt by the populace. I guess that's likely more often described as serial killing, but whatevs.

So you apparently did need more.

howard · Post by **howard** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:30 am

Mesquite has golf courses. Parumph has the chicken ranch brothel. Pick your poison, I suppose.

Brian (or anyone), what used to be on that lot where this occurred? I haven't been to LV or stayed at the Mandalay in a number of years, I think I remember a building there.

brian wrote:I think any situation in which you're trying to kill as large a group of people as possible is terrorism. Period. End stop. There needs no ideology necessary to qualify.

I've tried my best to not let this drive me up a fucking wall, but to avail. There are lots of words whose meanings have been corrupted in drastic evil ways in our current political culture of fear, but terrorism is the one that still makes me want to go full J-Lo on my TV set too.

howard · Post by **howard** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:31 am

and I had to be the first to do this? man, you guys are slipping.

https://twitter.com/SwamperHoward/statu ... 1663516672

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:40 am

Jerloma wrote:
govmentchedda wrote:
brian wrote:I'm going to throw something through my TV the first time I see someone try to litigate the use of the word terrorism. I think any situation in which you're trying to kill as large a group of people as possible is terrorism. Period. End stop. There needs no ideology necessary to qualify.

I used "full stop" in my terrorism definition to friends earlier. My definition was, "Kill anyone randomly, it's terrorism. Full stop. Not sure why we need more than that for the definition."

I'm including theoretical one at a time killings, as without motive, terror is felt by the populace. I guess that's likely more often described as serial killing, but whatevs.

So you apparently did need more.

Fuck it, I'm sticking with my original statement.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:42 am

howard wrote:Mesquite has golf courses. Parumph has the chicken ranch brothel. Pick your poison, I suppose.

Brian (or anyone), what used to be on that lot where this occurred? I haven't been to LV or stayed at the Mandalay in a number of years, I think I remember a building there.

It used a be a busted-up old school motel and a couple of run-down liquor stores back in the day. Those were leveled I want to say about 5 or so years ago to create the festival grounds where the concert was.

howard · Post by **howard** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:43 am

got it, thanks. Not the Glass Pool motel, from Leaving Las Vegas? I stayed there once.

eta: never mind, googled it, that one was a bit further south.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:44 am

ISIS has claimed responsibility. What now?

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:45 am

degenerasian wrote:ISIS has claimed responsibility. What now?

Ignore their desperate pleas for attention since they weren't involved whatsoever?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:53 am

degenerasian wrote:ISIS has claimed responsibility. What now?

Oh jesus, go back to listening to Art Bell is you are buying that shit. For fuckssakes.

Post by **brian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 10:57 am

howard wrote:got it, thanks. Not the Glass Pool motel, from Leaving Las Vegaswas it? I stayed there once.

eta: never mind, googled it, that one was a bit further south.

Yeah, not a noteworthy motel. Just one of the old, old school types of motels that used to be up and down the Strip (and are still extant on LVB between the Strip and the downtown casinos.)

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:01 am

P.D.X. wrote:
degenerasian wrote:By definition an act of terrorism means any act that involves the use or attempted use of sabotage, coercion or violence which is intended to cause great bodily harm or death to the general population. I took that from Nevada Law.

Needs a political motive.

Back before "terrorism is literally everything that makes you feel terror," this was the correct answer.

Someone had to hate the government and decided to commit violence in the name of instilling fear to all citizens of said government.

But, like with everything, it's become a watered down term with a very wide net.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:02 am

brian wrote:
degenerasian wrote:ISIS has claimed responsibility. What now?

Ignore their desperate pleas for attention since they weren't involved whatsoever?

This. ISIS will claim responsibility for stubbed toes and hangnails if you let them.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Oct 02, 2017 11:46 am

I don't believe but it's being reported on some the media outlets. FBI has immediately dismissed it.