The Indictment Thread (Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part II)

Post by **brian** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 7:41 pm

I mean like legitimately sad. Like I probably should have kept my mouth shut about it if you don’t know you’re doing it. Like I’m the asshole here.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:12 pm

I’m sorry I made you sad, Brian.

Post by **brian** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:21 pm

See now I’m glad things are back to normal. Let’s talk about something other than Trump. Though not in this thread I guess since it kind of is supposed to be about Trump.

How many pages would the Hillary thread be to by now in that alternate universe? Knowing some of you guys it might be just as many. There would be pages upon pages about Fox News complaining about her brooches and spirited debates here about how she shouldn’t be wearing brooches when meeting other world leaders.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:26 pm

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:38 pm

I do NOT want malaria

rass · Post by **rass** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:17 am

brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:21 pm See now I’m glad things are back to normal. Let’s talk about something other than Trump. Though not in this thread I guess since it kind of is supposed to be about Trump.

How many pages would the Hillary thread be to by now in that alternate universe? Knowing some of you guys it might be just as many. There would be pages upon pages about Fox News complaining about her brooches and spirited debates here about how she shouldn’t be wearing brooches when meeting other world leaders.

Is howard Swamp-active in this alternate timeline?

Post by **brian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 7:39 am

rass wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 6:17 am
brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 8:21 pm See now I’m glad things are back to normal. Let’s talk about something other than Trump. Though not in this thread I guess since it kind of is supposed to be about Trump.

How many pages would the Hillary thread be to by now in that alternate universe? Knowing some of you guys it might be just as many. There would be pages upon pages about Fox News complaining about her brooches and spirited debates here about how she shouldn’t be wearing brooches when meeting other world leaders.
Is howard Swamp-active in this alternate timeline?

Heh.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:11 am

Frustration boiling over.

https://www.vox.com/explainers/2018/7/5 ... popularity

Pretty good, straight down the line analysis of Trump and why his numbers aren't higher (3.9 unemployment rate, over 60 on the consumer confidence meter) or lower (fucking moron, Twitter, Russia, porn star affair, fucking moron.)

Nothing in this forum matters. At all. Go do something -- I give small donations whenever I get really pissed. Like, I've probably donated south of 200 dollars since 2016 happened, but it's in 10 and 20 dollar pops to guys like Beto in Texas, and some of the special election campaigns. It absolutely makes me feel better.

Post by **Sabo** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:47 am

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 9:11 amGo do something -- I give small donations whenever I get really pissed. Like, I've probably donated south of 200 dollars since 2016 happened, but it's in 10 and 20 dollar pops to guys like Beto in Texas, and some of the special election campaigns. It absolutely makes me feel better.

Yep. I've never donated to a political campaign in my life, but I plan to give money to Sherrod Brown. Pretty sure the Republicans are going to go hot and heavy at his Senate seat, so he'll need all the money he can get.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:22 am

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:25 pm
Rams Fanny wrote: ↑Wed Jul 25, 2018 2:19 pm Another thing. At the slightest disagreement with Obama, Boenher and Mcconnell would elbow their way to a camera like Trump at a photo op. Ted Cruz and Rand Paul would hold near daily press conferences and introduce legislation knowing it wouldn't pass but felt it was necessary to be the face of the Opposition.

Democrats now? In the face of a cartoonish buffoon who should be shown the Fool with a calm logical response, near crickets. I flip daily between CNN and MSNBC and I can't recall seeing Pelosi or Schumer in weeks. I see a Democrat every once in a while but usually it's a one off and they disappear. Especially in an election year, you would think there would be a couple faces of the Democratic Opposition. And this isn't really about elections. Why isn't there someone consistently out there simply on principle?

If he's not in jail, Trump will win in 2020. The Democratic lack of action these first two years will be a fairly large factor in that.

Because Schumer and Pelosi are reviled even within a good chunk of the Dem base. Because they have, and I'll 100 percent guarantee this, conducted focus groups and private polls that says their best bet is to just let Trump and his minions to pile up L after L... The R's are backing a fucking colossal loser, he is going to be a huge anchor around their neck.

Midterms, as you guys know, are almost ALWAYS a loser for the incumbent party. There's absolutely nothing to be gained by trying to insert themselves into this media mix. It's a disaster for the Republicans. The media is, FINALLY, doing their job and just blasting these guys daily.

I agree with Nonlinear, just wanted to add that some Dems like Ted Lieu, Adam Schiff, Chris Murphy, Richard Blumenthal... are getting on the news networks frequently calling out Trump and Republicans. It's important to let the public know what is going on, but they aren't going to sway one Trump supporter. Anyone who stood a chance of leaving Trump already has. Republicans hate Schumer and Pelosi almost as much as they hate Hillary. Hell, half of the GOP House candidates run exclusively on an anti-Pelosi platform, and it's successful. Schumer and Pelosi aren't swaying any votes, and only going to give fodder for Fox and the GOP to distract their base from the real stories. I think there is a danger to constantly calling out every single thing Trump does, as the truly horrific things get watered down. I've also heard a lot people complaining that the the Dems and the media attack Trump constantly, no matter what he does. On a daily basis, he does something that would have been a scandal in any other administration, so yeah, he gets criticized constantly. What the fuck can the Dems and the media do? You have to call out his shit, yet it distracts from the actual horrible policies and decisions going quietly unnoticed.

To Degen's point, since the Helsinki Summit, Trump has somehow risen in the polls. Approval ratings going from the mid 30s to the mid 40s. Nothing makes sense!

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:18 pm

I think it's fine to call Trump out for his idiocy. Even the Republicans were not happy with the Helsinki summit, at first. Now they have of course switched over.

The Democrats could have gone on the news networks and supported those Republicans who were concerned and joined in expressing similar concerns such as, not believing Us intelligence, or being too close to Putin, or why are we treating Russia as an ally and Germany as an enemy etc... Instead the Democrats went way over the top.

This was treason!
This was worse than 9/11!
This was worse than the Holocaust!
This was worse than Pearl Harbour!

Guess what Fox News is going to run over and over again?

Post by **brian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:22 pm

degenerasian wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:18 pm I think it's fine to call Trump out for his idiocy. Even the Republicans were not happy with the Helsinki summit, at first. Now they have of course switched over.

The Democrats could have gone on the news networks and supported those Republicans who were concerned and joined in expressing similar concerns such as, not believing Us intelligence, or being too close to Putin etc... Instead the Democrats went way over the top.

This was treason!
This was worse than 9/11
This was worse than the Holocaust
This was worse than Pearl Harbour!

Guess what Fox News is going to run over and over again?

C'mon, what the fuck, dude. Give me some specific examples of what you think was over the top enough to get you to hyperbolize this bullshit:

This was worse than 9/11
This was worse than the Holocaust
This was worse than Pearl Harbour!

You're one of the worst offenders of spouting off all kinds of bullshit you know nothing about and it's worse from you because you're not even an American. We have to actually live through this fucking nightmare. You get to sit up in your fucking ivory tower and lecture us. Fuck off.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:43 pm

So was it really because of my poopin' joke?

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 12:52 pm

I am genuinely frightened that we will either be entering a world war that will result in a nuke being detonated at some point or that Trump will do everything he can to deligitimize any election that doesn't result in him winning. So much so on the former that I think there's a chance if he loses in 2020 he will not concede. That said, I've never thought nor heard anyone seriously say anything has been worse than 9/11, the Holocaust, or Pearl Harbor.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:06 pm

Degen, this is his base, they are unreachable, and I don't give a shit about "making them mad" or whatever the fuck you are on about that you think the Dems/left are doing. Fuck that noise.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:17 pm

The only argument for reaching out to his base is if you're childish enough to believe external pressures can convert an adult bigot.

Post by **brian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:23 pm

Or if reaching out to his base is a euphemism for extending your arm with a fist and throwing it with a violent motion into their faces.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:28 pm

yeah, degen, sorry to pile on but we've been telling you for YEARS that you're wrongheaded with worrying about what Fox News has decided to distort on any given day.

WE DON'T GIVE A SHIT. Those people are lost causes.

And moderates and independents don't get their fucking news from Fox.

I'm at the point where this the last time I'm going to engage on this with you. Not all politics, but when it comes to this point you've made over and over again about reaching into the 30/40 percent base that's never EVER going to be convinced.

Fuck those people.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 1:30 pm

Yup. Defeat them now, fully and completely and without apology, and then if you regain power work to rebuild the lives they should have been on track for a generation or two ago.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:21 pm

Louisiana is shaped like a toilet bowl for a reason.

Living in that state (and constantly dialoguing on here) made me turn towards blue instead of red. I couldn't, in good conscience, side with people that pathetically stupid. And when they have a drink the overt racism bigotry comes out. And when those people are in the military... I'm done.

"Lost cause" is an excellent descriptor.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 2:25 pm

You can change like 2 or 3 words there and it describes why I stopped being an Eagles fan.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:19 pm

Ok.

I am naively still reaching over to the other side but if you guys have concluded that the group is lost I won't bring it up again.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:34 pm

Look, it's not even that you're necessarily "wrong"... I worked for 4 years at a think tank that thought the country might be headed into place were non-partisan politics could produce results that blended progressive and pragmatic policy solutions. It was all leading to Obama coming into office and there was actually real optimism in DC in those years.

Despite all I'd seen and learned about the Conservative echo chamber, I thought reasonable people were winning the day.

Well, I was wrong, and here we are.

So, I can speak for myself, I don't come lightly to a position of "fuck those people." That's actually counter to what I believed and actually spent years working to avoid.

That's where the frustration comes in. I'm not just popping off on a message board. I lived this shit for 15 years.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:04 pm

Let's follow the money.

Trump Org. CFO mentioned in Michael Cohen tape called by grand jury to testify: WSJ

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:15 pm

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:19 pm

degenerasian wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:19 pm Ok.

I am naively still reaching over to the other side but if you guys have concluded that the group is lost I won't bring it up again.

Covington, LA or Kingman, AZ, these are the types of people America has in it. They are worthless scum and lost causes.

They are the base Republican voter, extremely easy to manipulate with dog whistles and fear based tactics. Donald Trump could piss on them and tell them it's lemonade. They'd believe it and drink every drop.

Post by **brian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:28 pm

Kingman is an unbelievable shithole. It makes Barstow seem like Paris by comparison.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:38 pm

degenerasian wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:19 pm Ok.

I am naively still reaching over to the other side but if you guys have concluded that the group is lost I won't bring it up again.

Please don;t think I'm being condescending, but your naivety is kind of touching.

First year US Poli Sci class, the Professor laid it out that 40% in the US votes Republican and 40% votes Democrats, every single time.

the billions and billions that are spent in each election cycle is in an effort to sway the remaining 20%.

Also, the bottom 9 states in GDP per capita are - Kentucky, Montana, Arizona, South Carolina, Alabama, Arkansas, West Virginia, Idaho and Mississippi

Add Tennessee, Kentucky, Louisiana, Oklahoma and the Dakotas and you pretty much have the bottom third in education.

That's a lot of red states. You can't apply the ability to think to the majority of voters in states such as these.

Post by **Shirley** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:43 pm

Wow, that was masterful by Cohen. That might have been his best work. He maintained composure and just let the room say the crazy stuff without really leading them much at all.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:04 pm

Shirley wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:43 pm Wow, that was masterful by Cohen. That might have been his best work. He maintained composure and just let the room say the crazy stuff without really leading them much at all.

As much as I know I live in my Northeastern bubble, and I understand that 40+% of Americans still support Trump, and racism is alive and well, shit like that still deeply shocks and disturbs me. When Cohen twisted the guy's words and said, "yes, you are lucky to have blacks living here," that was sheer brilliance, but the response was sickening. I still can't comprehend proudly declaring in a public meeting that you "don't want the blacks" living in your town, but you "tolerate" them. If I'm Cohen in that room, my adrenaline is off the charts and I'm terrified I'm getting savagely beaten by a mob of toothless rednecks.

Degen, I don't mean this to pile on, but take a look at the people in that room. Logic, reason and facts are not getting through to them. Ever.

Gunpowder · Post by **Gunpowder** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:06 pm

We're talking about a group of people who are pissed that their wages aren't rising and they've been so convinced that it's because of dark people that they keep voting in all the union-busting types who ensure that their wages stay low.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:38 pm

Gunpowder wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 5:06 pm We're talking about a group of people who are pissed that their wages aren't rising and they've been so convinced that it's because of dark people that they keep voting in all the union-busting types who ensure that their wages stay low.

Yeah... after a while, you can't feel sorry for them any more.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:34 pm

Man, this ride is wild.

Cohen claims Trump knew in advance of 2016 Trump Tower meeting

DaveInSeattle · Post by **DaveInSeattle** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 12:04 am

Johnnie wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 11:34 pm Man, this ride is wild.

Cohen claims Trump knew in advance of 2016 Trump Tower meeting

Is that collusion? Because it sure sounds like collusion to me...

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:11 am

Now is it treason?

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:57 am

Pruitt wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:38 pm
degenerasian wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:19 pm Ok.

I am naively still reaching over to the other side but if you guys have concluded that the group is lost I won't bring it up again.
Please don;t think I'm being condescending, but your naivety is kind of touching.

First year US Poli Sci class, the Professor laid it out that 40% in the US votes Republican and 40% votes Democrats, every single time.

the billions and billions that are spent in each election cycle is in an effort to sway the remaining 20%.

Also, the bottom 9 states in GDP per capita are - Kentucky, Montana, Arizona, South Carolina, Alabama, Arkansas, West Virginia, Idaho and Mississippi

Add Tennessee, Kentucky, Louisiana, Oklahoma and the Dakotas and you pretty much have the bottom third in education.

That's a lot of red states. You can't apply the ability to think to the majority of voters in states such as these.

Your double dipping on Kentucky there....

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 7:23 am

Baloney wrote: ↑Fri Jul 27, 2018 6:57 am
Pruitt wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 4:38 pm
degenerasian wrote: ↑Thu Jul 26, 2018 3:19 pm Ok.

I am naively still reaching over to the other side but if you guys have concluded that the group is lost I won't bring it up again.
Please don;t think I'm being condescending, but your naivety is kind of touching.

First year US Poli Sci class, the Professor laid it out that 40% in the US votes Republican and 40% votes Democrats, every single time.

the billions and billions that are spent in each election cycle is in an effort to sway the remaining 20%.

Also, the bottom 9 states in GDP per capita are - Kentucky, Montana, Arizona, South Carolina, Alabama, Arkansas, West Virginia, Idaho and Mississippi

Add Tennessee, Kentucky, Louisiana, Oklahoma and the Dakotas and you pretty much have the bottom third in education.

That's a lot of red states. You can't apply the ability to think to the majority of voters in states such as these.
Your double dipping on Kentucky there....

It's the long-standing Canada-Kentucky feud rearing its ugly head again.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:50 am

Proof reading is for pussies.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:54 am

tennbengal wrote: ↑Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:11 am Now is it treason?

You know I'm generally on board with collusion. But I don't see how you get to treason on any of this. Is it impeachable? Absolutely.

We are not at war with Russia. What am I missing?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:56 am

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Fri Jul 27, 2018 8:54 am
tennbengal wrote: ↑Fri Jul 27, 2018 4:11 am Now is it treason?
You know I'm generally on board with collusion. But I don't see how you get to treason on any of this. Is it impeachable? Absolutely.

We are not at war with Russia. What am I missing?

My totally favorite thing is people on the left arguing and making sure to be so circumspect about the President selling out the country that they go to the mats to argue it isn't literally treason...frosted with treason. Treasonish. Treason'y. But not, you know, TREASON. Heaven forbid.