So first we are paying kids to play for us and now they pay us

[tennbengal]

Yeah. Part of me wondered if there's a personal connection somewhere there with the dad (or mom, I guess) and that's another reason they were willing to go to such lengths for this particular school

Her former husband, now a high up exec at Lionsgate, went to ASU... Current husband Mossimo Giannulli went to USC, but didn't graduate.

I don't swim in these waters (obviously), but I'm pretty sure among the elite/rich in SoCal, USC has become a fairly prestigious fall-back school. So, for the kids that don't get into, say, Stanford or the Ivies, if they can get into USC, they feel pretty OK with things. Again, as is often the case, it's the parents that have been paying a shitload for LA private schools since Suzy or Johnny was 3 years old that feel most of this high society pressure.

USC used to be kind of a joke, academically. It's not THAT long ago that they were just like ASU with an acceptance rate in the 70s. They now have a 17 percent admittance rate. That's not insane, compared to a lot of top 50-75 schools, but it's not like you can just show up like it's a CC.

Once known as the University of Spoiled Children, USC has done a remarkable job transforming into an almost elite school over the last 15-20 years or so.

I think I mentioned this at one point in the college visits thread, but a LOT of the schools you remember from your college searches as being easy fallback schools are far, far from that anymore. The average ACT/SATs are way up everywhere. As for why that crew HAD to make sure they their kids got into certain schools, just no fucking perspective . There are so many really good colleges out there if their kids really wanted to go to get an actually education, it is such a disservice as a parent to buy into the only elite schools are good crap.

[tennbengal]

Yeah. Part of me wondered if there's a personal connection somewhere there with the dad (or mom, I guess) and that's another reason they were willing to go to such lengths for this particular school

Her former husband, now a high up exec at Lionsgate, went to ASU... Current husband Mossimo Giannulli went to USC, but didn't graduate.

I don't swim in these waters (obviously), but I'm pretty sure among the elite/rich in SoCal, USC has become a fairly prestigious fall-back school. So, for the kids that don't get into, say, Stanford or the Ivies, if they can get into USC, they feel pretty OK with things. Again, as is often the case, it's the parents that have been paying a shitload for LA private schools since Suzy or Johnny was 3 years old that feel most of this high society pressure.

USC used to be kind of a joke, academically. It's not THAT long ago that they were just like ASU with an acceptance rate in the 70s. They now have a 17 percent admittance rate. That's not insane, compared to a lot of top 50-75 schools, but it's not like you can just show up like it's a CC.

Once known as the University of Spoiled Children, USC has done a remarkable job transforming into an almost elite school over the last 15-20 years or so.

I think I mentioned this at one point in the college visits thread, but a LOT of the schools you remember from your college searches as being easy fallback schools are far, far from that anymore. The average ACT/SATs are way up everywhere. As for why that crew HAD to make sure they their kids got into certain schools, just no fucking perspective . There are so many really good colleges out there if their kids really wanted to go to get an actually education, it is such a disservice as a parent to buy into the only elite schools are good crap.

We are working through Q’s initial suggested list from his college guidance counselor and his “reach” schools are those with acceptance rates around where USC is. And I don’t want him to apply at any of them - they are good schools but what is the real difference between those schools and the level that is still very good but not insanely hard to get into? Eh, probably worth it for Harvard or Stanford or Yale in terms of potential connections for later in life, but the others (even Georgetown), just , why?

[EdRomero]

I actually really truly think it does. There are millions and millions of people like me and the other dads on here that are either going through or have fairly recently gone through the admissions process. Which is the culmination of anywhere from 4 - 8 years (depending on how crazy pants the parents make it) of marching through a tricky and stressful academic landscape.

To see what these rich fucks did to subvert the process is infuriating. To the point bronto made earlier, this just furthers the increasing tension and anger over how this society increasingly just hands shit to the rich, while we all bust our ass just to tread water.

Seeing this Olivia Jade piece of trash shit on a college education while sitting in a dorm room outfitted by Amazon, with her Sephora make-up caked on her entitled face... Yeah, ryan, boston.com's gonna keep her up there all day. Not just because she's "cute" but for millions of people she's the symbol of rich Americans and their total lack of awareness of how shitty they look to the rest of us.

I agree with these points and the ones bronco and JoeK made earlier, so, yes it should be a big story for their reasons; however, I agree with Mr. D that it's also being driven by the Aunty Becky angle (especially when the likes of Trump Jr. are commenting on it.)

As for the millions and millions of people going through the admissions process, you could also say millions and millions like to drink tap water without lead in it, have cage free children, and air that isn't polluted with cancerous pesticides etc. Yes, these stories have gotten attention, but, not enough, in my opinion, so when I see Full House photos on the news, that's when I think about this. The Jussie Smollett story dominating the news would have been a better time to complain about this.

[The Sybian]

I think we can all agree, that Stuart Varney has the most insanely idiotic take imaginable on this. Sorry, i couldn't find an embeddable video, but I linked below. Varney's pro-Trump spin: These heinous people are the same Hollywood elites who called us deplorable, how dare anyone in Hollywood tell us (because Varney is a salt of the Earth working class Midwesterner) how to live. "And I don't even have to ask, but I know they all hate Trump!" Sooo, 2 out of 50+ people who did something immoral are actresses, so everyone involved is automatically Hollywood elite anti-Trumpers. Got it. And now we know that every uber-wealthy person who cheats the system is anti-Trump, because Trump defends us from these horrible people. You know, Trump, the guy who orders his Fixer to threaten every school he attended to keep his records hidden, because his father made a huge donation so he could get into Penn undergrad, so he can make a career out of constantly bragging that he went the Wharton Business School, but he didn't he went to Penn undergrad, not the Wharton school at Penn. The same guy who bought his children's way into Penn, and whose son-in-law who is in charge of everything from Middle East Peace to "fixing the economy" only got into Harvard because his father donated $2.5 million. Yep, I'm sure they hate Trump, so let's report that they do without bothering to even spend 1 second looking into it.

https://video.foxbusiness.com/v/6013483458001/

[The Sybian]

No it’s on Reddit so you can trust it more. That’s how it works.

Well, to be fair, other than Deadspin, I didn't see that level of detail anywhere else. And like I said, it might take until today/tomorrow for everyone to get past Full House and Desperate Housewives-level of coverage. But there's a lot of really fascinating shit in that indictment and 99 percent of the coverage either barely touched on it, or basically got a lot of the story wrong yesterday.

must. not. have. looked. too. hard.

You're really inviting an asshole response, but I'll just say I spent a pretty decent amount of time on mainstream sources yesterday and the level of coverage was thin.

you're really inviting an asshole response, but I'll just say I provided six links on the same mainstream source website today that has a very strong connection to the swamp

seriously, I'm not sure what the *appropriate* way is to tell someone "you're inviting an asshole response by saying I didn't see that level of detail anywhere else" to someone who works for a place in the "anywhere else" that did provide a pretty strong level of detail

Nonlinear says he didn't see any reporting with depth on the mainstream news outlets, so you give 6 links to one source? Respect to Yahoo Sports for actually going into depth (I'm trusting Bronto that the links did go into depth), but is Yahoo Sports really a mainstream news outlet for a major story that is very tangentially related to sports? I'm not knocking their sports coverage, but I don't think many people go to Yahoo Sports for non-sports news.

[Johnnie]

This bickering started because I dared to post a Reddit comment in the first place. Next time I'll go to Yahoo comments or something.

[Brontoburglar]

Nonlinear says he didn't see any reporting with depth on the mainstream news outlets, so you give 6 links to one source? Respect to Yahoo Sports for actually going into depth (I'm trusting Bronto that the links did go into depth), but is Yahoo Sports really a mainstream news outlet for a major story that is very tangentially related to sports? I'm not knocking their sports coverage, but I don't think many people go to Yahoo Sports for non-sports news.

I'm confused about why you are confused. But that aside, coaches and athletic department members taking bribes is pretty direct!

[The Sybian]

Nonlinear says he didn't see any reporting with depth on the mainstream news outlets, so you give 6 links to one source? Respect to Yahoo Sports for actually going into depth (I'm trusting Bronto that the links did go into depth), but is Yahoo Sports really a mainstream news outlet for a major story that is very tangentially related to sports? I'm not knocking their sports coverage, but I don't think many people go to Yahoo Sports for non-sports news.

I'm confused about why you are confused. But that aside, coaches and athletic department members taking bribes is pretty direct!

Sure, Yale's soccer coach and USC's Crew coach are implicated, but that is such a minute and irrelevant aspect. Maybe if I followed Ivy League soccer or NCAA Crew I'd care about that aspect, but from my perspective, I never considered this a sports story. Maybe it's me, because I haven't paid attention to college sports since I graduated 20 years ago, but I just never would have thought to look to a sports site for info on this.

[Nonlinear FC]

I actually really truly think it does. There are millions and millions of people like me and the other dads on here that are either going through or have fairly recently gone through the admissions process. Which is the culmination of anywhere from 4 - 8 years (depending on how crazy pants the parents make it) of marching through a tricky and stressful academic landscape.

To see what these rich fucks did to subvert the process is infuriating. To the point bronto made earlier, this just furthers the increasing tension and anger over how this society increasingly just hands shit to the rich, while we all bust our ass just to tread water.

Seeing this Olivia Jade piece of trash shit on a college education while sitting in a dorm room outfitted by Amazon, with her Sephora make-up caked on her entitled face... Yeah, ryan, boston.com's gonna keep her up there all day. Not just because she's "cute" but for millions of people she's the symbol of rich Americans and their total lack of awareness of how shitty they look to the rest of us.

I agree with these points and the ones bronco and JoeK made earlier, so, yes it should be a big story for their reasons; however, I agree with Mr. D that it's also being driven by the Aunty Becky angle (especially when the likes of Trump Jr. are commenting on it.)

As for the millions and millions of people going through the admissions process, you could also say millions and millions like to drink tap water without lead in it, have cage free children, and air that isn't polluted with cancerous pesticides etc. Yes, these stories have gotten attention, but, not enough, in my opinion, so when I see Full House photos on the news, that's when I think about this. The Jussie Smollett story dominating the news would have been a better time to complain about this.

I'm not trying to last word you, but unless you live in Flint, outside of chemical plant, or got caught crossing the border without proper papers with your kids in toe... You aren't going to have the kind of visceral reaction that this bribery/fraud story is kicking up. Not just for parents, but anyone that's gone through the process. That's a lot of fucking people with skin in the game.

[wlu_lax6]

I am sort of surprised that I have not seen lacrosse get caught up in this. I mean it just feels like bigger rosters (so easier to hide), affluent players, academically prestigious schools, lower paid coaches, but still preferred admissions slots. I mean some of the non-NCAA club teams get admissions help. And it would not have surprised me at some of the smaller d3 schools where coaches get paid less and the summer camp money is not there.

[mister d]

I'm not trying to last word you, but unless you live in Flint, outside of chemical plant, or got caught crossing the border without proper papers with your kids in toe... You aren't going to have the kind of visceral reaction that this bribery/fraud story is kicking up.

Having kids who drink water is pretty similar to having kids in the application process, no?

[Brontoburglar]

Sure, Yale's soccer coach and USC's Crew coach are implicated, but that is such a minute and irrelevant aspect. Maybe if I followed Ivy League soccer or NCAA Crew I'd care about that aspect, but from my perspective, I never considered this a sports story. Maybe it's me, because I haven't paid attention to college sports since I graduated 20 years ago, but I just never would have thought to look to a sports site for info on this.

Nine coaches across multiple schools and a senior member of the USC athletic department are in the indictment.

[Johnnie]

Well this should go over well:

Lori Loughlin Is Free After Posting $1 Million Bond, While Her Daughter Spent Last Night On A USC Official’s Yacht

It takes a whole lotta money to act this classless.

[Nonlinear FC]

I'm not trying to last word you, but unless you live in Flint, outside of chemical plant, or got caught crossing the border without proper papers with your kids in toe... You aren't going to have the kind of visceral reaction that this bribery/fraud story is kicking up.

Having kids who drink water is pretty similar to having kids in the application process, no?

Yeah... that's a good point. Schools have lingering issues. Thing is, that stuff does get covered extensively in local/regional coverage. Just tough to build national momentum around it.

[Brontoburglar]

Well this should go over well:

Lori Loughlin Is Free After Posting $1 Million Bond, While Her Daughter Spent Last Night On A USC Official’s Yacht

It takes a whole lotta money to act this classless.

So the daughter shouldn't have been on a spring break trip that started before the indictments came down with someone she's known before USC?

The timing is hilarious and too perfect, of course. And this family doesn't need or deserve much defending. But I'm not sure how that would add to the classlessness of this story.

[Nonlinear FC]

Regardless, it's fucking perfect that "Turn the yacht around!" is a thing associated with this story. Fucking hilarious.

[sancarlos]

Regardless, it's fucking perfect that "Turn the yacht around!" is a thing associated with story. Fucking hilarious.

Yeah, even with her having the out that Bronto noted, it is really so wonderfully poetic that she is on the USC administrator's yacht when the shit comes down.

[mister d]

Does this mean there's an admin with enough money for a goddamn yacht but without the requisite pull to just get her into the school?

[wlu_lax6]

So this case reminded me of this

This resurgence has had as much to do with support off the field as excellence on the field. For the past few years, the program's greatest benefactor has been best-selling author John Grisham, a noted baseball fan who lives with his family outside Charlottesville. His son, Ty, spent 2 1/2 seasons with the Cavaliers before deciding to leave the team this season to spend more time with other campus organizations, according to O'Connor.

Many observers in and around the Cavaliers suspect Grisham was the driving force behind the anonymous donation that allowed Virginia to begin construction of its $4 million baseball stadium in 2001, though few at the university know for certain. More than 2,000 seats, 1,500 of them under a new canopy, six luxury boxes and stadium lights were added. The bullpens are now bricked-in down the baselines and a team clubhouse and a pitching and hitting facility reside underneath the grandstand.


Grisham, who couldn't be reached for this story after a phone call to his publicist was not returned, has never addressed the topic publicly. He pours time, effort and likely money into local baseball but chooses to avoid any recognition.

"There is lots of speculation out there that Mr. Grisham has had much to do with that stadium," said Dennis Womack, who coached Virginia baseball for 23 years before becoming an assistant athletic director last June. "I would say the building of that stadium has been the single most influential thing, the best thing that's happened in the history of U-Va. baseball. . . . If he had a lot to do with that, you have to give him a big thank you, because it's the one thing that I think has really kind of gotten us off the mediocre track."

St. Anne's Belfield in Charlottesville, the high school that Grisham's two children attended, received anonymous donations in the late 1990s that enabled it to build baseball and softball fields that would be the envy of many college programs.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/ ... p?ID=40985

[sancarlos]

Does this mean there's an admin with enough money for a goddamn yacht but without the requisite pull to just get her into the school?

Well, he's on the Board of Trustees, so not an "administrator". He's basically a guy who inherited tons of money from his daddy.

Caruso was born in Los Angeles. His father, Henry Caruso, was the founder of Dollar Rent-A-Car and owner of many car dealerships in the Los Angeles area. His mother Gloria, a billboard model in her youth, was a homemaker and philanthropist.[6] Rick received a bachelor of science degree from the University of Southern California in 1980

[Nonlinear FC]

So this case reminded me of this

This resurgence has had as much to do with support off the field as excellence on the field. For the past few years, the program's greatest benefactor has been best-selling author John Grisham, a noted baseball fan who lives with his family outside Charlottesville. His son, Ty, spent 2 1/2 seasons with the Cavaliers before deciding to leave the team this season to spend more time with other campus organizations, according to O'Connor.

Many observers in and around the Cavaliers suspect Grisham was the driving force behind the anonymous donation that allowed Virginia to begin construction of its $4 million baseball stadium in 2001, though few at the university know for certain. More than 2,000 seats, 1,500 of them under a new canopy, six luxury boxes and stadium lights were added. The bullpens are now bricked-in down the baselines and a team clubhouse and a pitching and hitting facility reside underneath the grandstand.


Grisham, who couldn't be reached for this story after a phone call to his publicist was not returned, has never addressed the topic publicly. He pours time, effort and likely money into local baseball but chooses to avoid any recognition.

"There is lots of speculation out there that Mr. Grisham has had much to do with that stadium," said Dennis Womack, who coached Virginia baseball for 23 years before becoming an assistant athletic director last June. "I would say the building of that stadium has been the single most influential thing, the best thing that's happened in the history of U-Va. baseball. . . . If he had a lot to do with that, you have to give him a big thank you, because it's the one thing that I think has really kind of gotten us off the mediocre track."

St. Anne's Belfield in Charlottesville, the high school that Grisham's two children attended, received anonymous donations in the late 1990s that enabled it to build baseball and softball fields that would be the envy of many college programs.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/ ... p?ID=40985

Grisham also fully funds and runs the local little league, with a huge amount of teams and kids playing. Maybe he had a hand in getting his kid into UVa, but that kid being the son of John Grisham might have been enough in and of itself. Kind of like if the mayor's off-spring applied. That kid's getting a look.

[wlu_lax6]

So this case reminded me of this

This resurgence has had as much to do with support off the field as excellence on the field. For the past few years, the program's greatest benefactor has been best-selling author John Grisham, a noted baseball fan who lives with his family outside Charlottesville. His son, Ty, spent 2 1/2 seasons with the Cavaliers before deciding to leave the team this season to spend more time with other campus organizations, according to O'Connor.

Many observers in and around the Cavaliers suspect Grisham was the driving force behind the anonymous donation that allowed Virginia to begin construction of its $4 million baseball stadium in 2001, though few at the university know for certain. More than 2,000 seats, 1,500 of them under a new canopy, six luxury boxes and stadium lights were added. The bullpens are now bricked-in down the baselines and a team clubhouse and a pitching and hitting facility reside underneath the grandstand.


Grisham, who couldn't be reached for this story after a phone call to his publicist was not returned, has never addressed the topic publicly. He pours time, effort and likely money into local baseball but chooses to avoid any recognition.

"There is lots of speculation out there that Mr. Grisham has had much to do with that stadium," said Dennis Womack, who coached Virginia baseball for 23 years before becoming an assistant athletic director last June. "I would say the building of that stadium has been the single most influential thing, the best thing that's happened in the history of U-Va. baseball. . . . If he had a lot to do with that, you have to give him a big thank you, because it's the one thing that I think has really kind of gotten us off the mediocre track."

St. Anne's Belfield in Charlottesville, the high school that Grisham's two children attended, received anonymous donations in the late 1990s that enabled it to build baseball and softball fields that would be the envy of many college programs.

http://www.thebaseballcube.com/players/ ... p?ID=40985

Grisham also fully funds and runs the local little league, with a huge amount of teams and kids playing. Maybe he had a hand in getting his kid into UVa, but that kid being the son of John Grisham might have been enough in and of itself. Kind of like if the mayor's off-spring applied. That kid's getting a look.

I am not saying he did anything wrong either (and yes Grisham's baseball stuff is great for the community) but the implication is he made an anonymous donation to UVA to fund the cool baseball stadium right before his kid goes to UVA and rides the pine for 2 years (8 at bats)....which to me implies walk on. I am sure his son was equipped to get into UVA coming form STAB too.

However it is a slippery slope from "getting a look" to fraud in some cases (and yes his kid played baseball and did not just submit the rec league baseball card that our parents all paid for.....$1,000,000 swamp buck for the first person to post their youth baseball card photos in the swamp).

[A_B]

I don’t view his son riding the pine as much different that a coaches kid riding the pine. He’s a walk on, maybe not as good as another kid who could have walked on, but eh, business...

[Brontoburglar]

Does this mean there's an admin with enough money for a goddamn yacht but without the requisite pull to just get her into the school?

I had a similar thought (if you know a rich board member then you can have them help you out) but given how much ego plays into this, wondered if they didn't want their social circle to know

[sancarlos]

But i bet she'd probably settle for $200 billion...

[mister d]

I had a similar thought (if you know a rich board member then you can have them help you out) but given how much ego plays into this, wondered if they didn't want their social circle to know

There’s no demo I’m less like and less comfortable being around than the rich.

[Pruitt]

I had a similar thought (if you know a rich board member then you can have them help you out) but given how much ego plays into this, wondered if they didn't want their social circle to know

There’s no demo I’m less like and less comfortable being around than the rich.

That's the way they like it.

And yet the worship of the wealthy continues. I would never call my self a "Socialist" - perhaps a "Social Democrat" - but the fear engendered in so many Americans by that word is insane. People are comfortable with CEOs making 9 figure salaries while people are being bankrupted by medical bills or student debt.

[Nonlinear FC]

Well, this answers one of our burning questions:

https://jezebel.com/yale-dad-who-expose ... 1833310428

Yale soccer coach approached a guy that was already being investigated for a fraudulent investment scheme.

[wlu_lax6]

So Phil Mickelson and Joe Montana used the service but say no payoff.

[sancarlos]

We hired a lady to help my daughter get through the college application process. But she was extremely ethical and made my daughter do all the heavy lifting. She told us stories of entitled asshole parents/clients who were upset to find out she refused to actually write their child's application essays herself.

[Nonlinear FC]

Oh, yeah, full disclosure: We worked with a tutor to get my daughter's ACT score up. Paid off, as she really needed help with the math section. She ran the essay by this person (and me), but she's a killer writer so the tutor barely touched it in terms of edits.

I didn't really feel guilty about being able to give her that boost, but it sure says a lot about privilege that a lot of people in this country probably aren't even aware of as they push their kids through the application process.

[sancarlos]

[Johnnie]

The Defiant Ones was an incredible documentary. That center he helped open was a highlight of it. How he could completely forget that is ridiculous.

[Nonlinear FC]

https://www.theatlantic.com/ideas/archi ... ls/586468/

This former h.s. english teacher --> college counselor with some interesting points.

Ever since the scandal became public, two opinions have been widely expressed. The first is that the schemes it revealed are not much different from the long-standing admissions preference for big donors, and the second is that these admissions gained on fraudulent grounds have harmed underprivileged students. These aren’t quite right. As off-putting as most of us find the role that big-ticket fundraising plays in elite-college admissions, those monies go toward programs and facilities that will benefit a wide number of students—new dormitories, new libraries, enriched financial-aid funds are often the result of rich parents being tapped for gifts at admissions time. But the Singer scheme benefits no one at all except the individual students, and the people their parents paid off.

The argument that the scheme hurt disadvantaged applicants—or even just non-rich applicants who needed financial aid to attend these stratospherically expensive colleges—isn’t right either. Elite colleges pay deep attention to the issue of enrollment management; the more elite the institution, the more likely it is to be racially and socioeconomically diverse. This is in part because attaining this kind of diversity has become a foundational goal of most admissions offices, and also because the elite colleges have the money to make it happen. In 2017, Harvard announced with great fanfare that it had enrolled its first class in which white students were in the minority.

It's a longform article, so I just pulled out two paragraphs because I've heard those arguments a lot and she shoots some holes in the more prevalent theories or opinions.

[wlu_lax6]

Nothing strange here....
https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/05/us/harva ... index.html

[Ryan]

HOW FAR DOES THIS GO?!?

Other parents indicted on the new charge Tuesday include Michelle Janavs, whose family developed the microwave snack line Hot Pockets before selling their company

[Johnny Carwash]

HOW FAR DOES THIS GO?!?

Other parents indicted on the new charge Tuesday include Michelle Janavs, whose family developed the microwave snack line Hot Pockets before selling their company

That indictment seemed like it was cool at first but was then scorchingly hot once you got to the inside.

[brian]

If this is just a way to make sure all 1 percenters end up in prison, then I can live with that.

[Johnnie]

[rass]