The Swamp

tennbengal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 2:08 pm

The Sybian wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:52 pm

tennbengal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:40 pm

It’s anecdotal- but I’ve seen that first hand at my workplace.

Very curious, was there a final straw moment? Or one line crossed that triggered this person? I fear there might be a large contingent of people voting for Trump, but afraid to admit it. I think that's a large part of the polls showing Hillary so far ahead in 2016.

Several persons, actually. Accumulation. SO much that they just trail off or admit that there's problems.

ETA - I am not talking about the core who would have marched in Charlottsville - I am talking about the ones at the edges that pretend their silence isn't complicity - that crew is finding it harder to pretend. And some of them around my workplace won't vote for him again. I think there's others out there.

Thanks, I'm completely fascinated by the psychology of anyone who stuck with him for 3 years but could be persuadable. I have a hard time believing these people exist, but I trust you, and I would love to sit down with these people for a couple hours.

I gave up talking to my intelligent friend who is still backing Trump. He fully acknowledges Trump is a horrible person, but he is so focused on the Clintons being evil, he doesn't care. If anything, he thinks Trump is hilarious and thinks the batshit cray stuff is intentional and meant to be funny. I haven't gotten him to answer many questions, because he is so riled up over BLM being founded by admitted Marxists and the shortcomings of Biden, that I can't fight my way through his questions to change the topic. The problem is, he'll call me with 20 topics wanting to understand how a Liberal could believe or support something, because his Liberal friends are basically brainwashed cultists. I've met some, those are my words and assessment, not his. He went silent on FB for years, but now is hellbent on proving the MSM have been hellbent on destroying Trump since before he ran, posting positive stories or Trump achievement the MSM doesn't cover, or stuff like the black guy who killed the white child, or a white guy who killed a black cop. The closest I get to an answer is that the Russia hoax was started by two FBI agents who lied because they admittedly wanted to take down Trump, and that's all the Left have and can't let it go. I did get him to admit he was duped by the antifa.com website leading to a Biden site when I got him to concede it was a fake site created by Russian intelligence. He just laughed and went on to the next thing.

psunate77 wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:17 pm Honestly, is he going to bankrupt his campaign?

I think he already has...

Trump’s campaign is in financial distress — like everything else he touches

The New York Times’s Shane Goldmacher and Maggie Haberman report that Trump and the Republican National Committee squandered their $200 million cash advantage, spent $800 million of the $1.1 billion raised and now face the possibility of a “cash crunch.” The culprit: “profligate habits” such as a car and driver for the now-former campaign manager, payments to Trump businesses, and a “vanity splurge” on Super Bowl ads.

ETA: There's also this: Biden campaign out-raised Trump by over $150 million in August

The Trump campaign and its joint fundraising committees with the Republican National Committee raised over $210 million in August, they announced Wednesday.

Why it matters: Joe Biden and the Democratic National Committee raised $364.5 million in the same period, dwarfing Trump's total fundraising haul by over $150 million. It is believed to be the most ever raised by a presidential candidate in a single month.

Thinking about this Woodward stuff, isn't he kind of complicit in waiting until now to announce Trump was lying about COVID?

I don't think he was sitting on any piece of information that would have made a difference. Basically the info he sat on is that Trump is an asshole, and everybody already knows that.

tennbengal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:56 am

A_B wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 11:15 am Does the woodward stuff move the needle?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/09/09/politics ... index.html

It will move it some. We're on the margins, but it will move it on the margins. Even if it means less people going to the polls and voting for him and just sitting it out.

While it's nice that it's on the record, it was obvious he was lying at the time. You have seen multiple that are STILL ON THE TASK FORCE who have been putting out warnings constantly. He knew what they were saying and he just doubled-, triple-, etc-down on it every damn day.

The cult members don't care. Will it matter on the margins? I think reasonable people already knew he's been lying for months. But, by all means, the more this type of stuff is confirmed... I don't see how it hurts.

Rex wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:41 pm I don't think he was sitting on any piece of information that would have made a difference. Basically the info he sat on is that Trump is an asshole, and everybody already knows that.

Trump was just giving a presser, saying 'I didn't want people to panic'.

Umm...most everyone I know has been freaked out and panicked since March. So the dumb ass MF'er can't even do that right.

The Sybian wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:52 pm

tennbengal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:40 pm

It’s anecdotal- but I’ve seen that first hand at my workplace.

Very curious, was there a final straw moment? Or one line crossed that triggered this person? I fear there might be a large contingent of people voting for Trump, but afraid to admit it. I think that's a large part of the polls showing Hillary so far ahead in 2016.

While I think that was absolutely what was going in 2016, I really don't think that's at play here.

1) Trump is what he is now. There's no RATIONAL person that is looking at this tire fire and expecting it to get better. In 2016, he was going to Build the Wall and Drain the Swamp and repeal Obamacare and replace it with something better. Those voting for Trump in 2016 could allow themselves some optimism/delusion. At this point, everyone, on both sides, knows he's just full of bullshit/bluster. You either like him and his shitshow antics or you don't. But there's not a bunch of people with expectations he's going to be something different now.

2) The vibe that people were holding their nose and voting for Hillary was massive. People didn't want to admit they didn't want to vote for "that woman." I'd also say that, despite the constant bickering on this board, because of the stakes... There's very little residual "fuck the establishment" vibe going on this year. I think the polls just didn't capture how disaffected so many Dems were with the process and with the result.

People are pissed, scared and more pissed off right now. There's going to be massive turnout, especially with early in-person and drop off ballot voting. I know I'm a broken record, but I actually think the polls are showing more positively for Trump than will actually turnout.

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:54 pm

The Sybian wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:52 pm

tennbengal wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 1:40 pm

It’s anecdotal- but I’ve seen that first hand at my workplace.

Very curious, was there a final straw moment? Or one line crossed that triggered this person? I fear there might be a large contingent of people voting for Trump, but afraid to admit it. I think that's a large part of the polls showing Hillary so far ahead in 2016.

While I think that was absolutely what was going in 2016, I really don't think that's at play here.

1) Trump is what he is now. There's no RATIONAL person that is looking at this tire fire and expecting it to get better. In 2016, he was going to Build the Wall and Drain the Swamp and repeal Obamacare and replace it with something better. Those voting for Trump in 2016 could allow themselves some optimism/delusion. At this point, everyone, on both sides, knows he's just full of bullshit/bluster. You either like him and his shitshow antics or you don't. But there's not a bunch of people with expectations he's going to be something different now.

2) The vibe that people were holding their nose and voting for Hillary was massive. People didn't want to admit they didn't want to vote for "that woman." I'd also say that, despite the constant bickering on this board, because of the stakes... There's very little residual "fuck the establishment" vibe going on this year. I think the polls just didn't capture how disaffected so many Dems were with the process and with the result.

People are pissed, scared and more pissed off right now. There's going to be massive turnout, especially with early in-person and drop off ballot voting. I know I'm a broken record, but I actually think the polls are showing more positively for Trump than will actually turnout.

I agree with all of this. I also think a lot of people just didn't think a Trump presidency could be *that* bad. Hell, I didn't figure it would be nearly this bad; I figured Trump would mostly be bored and be less intent on doing real harm. That "how bad could it really be" notion gave cover both to the "reasonable" Republican folks and to the folks on the left who really didn't want to vote for Hillary. Now both groups know, for the most part, that it really *is* that bad, and that it will just get worse if he is re-elected.

And while it's hard to believe that there can be people who are undecided or still persuadable, it's always surprising how many people just don't pay attention, or pay attention but are really dumb.

The one-issue anti-abortion people will never come around. The idea of Tom Cotton or Ted Cruz on the SCOTUS is a wet dream they believe (perhaps correctly) that a re-elected Trump will fulfill.

Nonlinear FC wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 3:54 pm There's very little residual "fuck the establishment" vibe going on this year.

Very odd and unexplainable that they can't build the same furor against Joe Biden that they did against Obama and Hillary (and starting to build against Kamala Harris).

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:11 pm The one-issue anti-abortion people will never come around. The idea of Tom Cotton or Ted Cruz on the SCOTUS is a wet dream they believe (perhaps correctly) that a re-elected Trump will fulfill.

Trump’s 20-person “shortlist” of potential Supreme Court nominees that he announced today was absolutely meant to signal to the religious right that if they help him get re-elected, then Roe v. Wade will be overturned.

Joe K wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:59 pm

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Sep 09, 2020 6:11 pm The one-issue anti-abortion people will never come around. The idea of Tom Cotton or Ted Cruz on the SCOTUS is a wet dream they believe (perhaps correctly) that a re-elected Trump will fulfill.

Trump’s 20-person “shortlist” of potential Supreme Court nominees that he announced today was absolutely meant to signal to the religious right that if they help him get re-elected, then Roe v. Wade will be overturned.

Transparently so.

I mean, WTF?

Right? Take heavens the murderous dictator who is constantly threatening to nuke our allies in the South and is working to achieve a nuke that can reach the United States is doing OK.

This goes back to what SC posted the other day.

Making an outrageous statement he knows is going to "upset the MSM and Libtards."

It's pretty remarkable in its simplicity.

God, I am nervous as hell.. His crowds are always huge.

psunate77 wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:01 pm


God, I am nervous as hell.. His crowds are always huge.

From Michelle Goldberg in the Times today:

Despite knowing that the virus was airborne, he mocked mask-wearing and held several large indoor rallies.

I think he hates his supporters as much as we do.

He absolutely does. It’s not even a debate. He would have nothing to do with 90 percent of his voters. They can’t do anything for him except vote.

A_B wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:52 pm He absolutely does. It’s not even a debate. He would have nothing to do with 90 percent of his voters. They can’t do anything for him except vote.

That number is probably being overly generous to him frankly. I'm not convinced he's capable of even feeling anything for his own family beyond whatever they can do for him.

I'm getting fucking anxiety from those pictures.

brian wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:00 pm

A_B wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 5:52 pm He absolutely does. It’s not even a debate. He would have nothing to do with 90 percent of his voters. They can’t do anything for him except vote.

That number is probably being overly generous to him frankly. I'm not convinced he's capable of even feeling anything for his own family beyond whatever they can do for him.

I'm convinced the only feelings he has towards his family annoyance and contempt for Melania and the older boys, and lust for Ivanka. Not sure about Tiffany and Baron, but I am positive he is incapable of love, compassion, empathy or any similar emotions. I don't think there is any doubt he is a sociopath. All actions are cold calculations on how it effects him with no regard to others, and his attempts at appearing compassionate turn into him throwing paper towels in Puerto Rico and bragging about his TV ratings for COVID press conferences.

Johnnie wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:25 pm I'm getting fucking anxiety from those pictures.

Does anyone else do the thing where you'll watch TV and when two characters get close you subconsciously think something is wrong before snapping back?

I don't think there is any doubt he is a sociopath.

Literally. DSM IV literally.

tennbengal wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:05 am

I don't think there is any doubt he is a sociopath.

Literally. DSM IV literally.

DSM IV is soooo 2012, get with the DSM V, my man!

Here is the official diagnosis criterion for Antisocial Personality Disorder, which is the diagnosis for sociopathy. Really seems to describe the man. Keep in mind, a subject only need to exhibit one of the 7 traits, I think Trump exhibits all 7!

A. Disregard for and violation of others rights since age 15, as indicated by one of the seven sub features:

1.) Failure to obey laws and norms by engaging in behavior which results in criminal arrest, or would warrant criminal arrest
2.) Lying, deception, and manipulation, for profit or self-amusement,
3.) Impulsive behavior
4.) Irritability and aggression, manifested as frequently assaults others, or engages in fighting
5.) Blatantly disregards safety of self and others,
6.) A pattern of irresponsibility and
7.) Lack of remorse for actions (American Psychiatric Association, 2013)
The other diagnostic Criterion are:

B. The person is at least age 18,

C. Conduct disorder was present by history before age 15

D. and the antisocial behavior does not occur in the context of schizophrenia or bipolar disorder (American Psychiatric Association, 2013).

I mean - he fits it all. And #7 should be bolded in his case.

mister d wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 10:12 am

Johnnie wrote: ↑Thu Sep 10, 2020 6:25 pm I'm getting fucking anxiety from those pictures.

Does anyone else do the thing where you'll watch TV and when two characters get close you subconsciously think something is wrong before snapping back?

Yes. All the fucking time.

tennbengal wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 11:44 am I mean - he fits it all. And #7 should be bolded in his case.

One website had examples of all the traits, and it could have been describing Trump. Down to making up names and fake identities to bolster themselves, like when Trump made up the name John Baron for himself, and would make calls as John Baron touting how great Trump was. Making decisions only concerned with the present and no thought of future consequences. So many examples were straight Trump. And for all the criticism of psychologists making a diagnosis without treating him, it's actually easy to diagnose sociopathy and psychopathy from a distance, and many sociopaths and psychopaths are able to fake it when they are being evaluated. Although Trump is horrible at feigning compassion and empathy because he is disgusted by those attributes. Some sociopaths can fake it because they know it'll benefit them to seem like they care about other people.

And just for fun, check out the first response...

Pruitt wrote: ↑Fri Sep 11, 2020 12:35 pm

And just for fun, check out the first response...

There are noted Trump twitter bots, I Believe that is one.. The other is William Sholes or something, and a third one I don't remember its name. They answer each other all the time.

This kind of shit scares me to death..

It scares you so much you needed to post it multiple threads?

Jesus

I was hoping for another dissertation on Finland (or was it Norway?) raking the forests.

It's hilarious imagining the game of telephone that goes though his wet brain to his mouth because you know he's been briefed on this stuff and the officials try to explain it to him like the idiot he is and then he still somehow still ends up sounding like a moron when he tries to relay the information that's passed through his wet noodle of a brain.

OMG!!

brian wrote: ↑Mon Sep 14, 2020 3:08 pm It's hilarious imagining the game of telephone that goes though his wet brain to his mouth because you know he's been briefed on this stuff and the officials try to explain it to him like the idiot he is and then he still somehow still ends up sounding like a moron when he tries to relay the information that's passed through his wet noodle of a brain.

I don't think he's that far off. Trees are known to explode in high-intensity wildfires - though I think it's standing trees, and I'm not sure if it's more likely to happen to dead trees or living ones. And of course dead trees on a forest floor contribute to making fires strong enough to explode trees.

This is all very awkward for me, because I've been in a dispute with our local county rec department for doing a massive "fuels reduction" project in the nearby open space despite it being subject to a conservation easement.

Jesus H Motherhumping Christ