Racism

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Re: Racism

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Two thoughts:
1) [orange]so crazy that a Cyrus would culturally appropriate something [/orange]
2) my kids LOVE that song
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Re: Racism

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Re: Racism

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So there was a tweet that made the rounds over the weekend. Maybe you saw it, maybe you didn't. It was a guy who got a lot of comments and retweets asking people to reply with the first time they had a teacher of color. The tweet itself was innocuous/fine, that's not why I mention it.

But I started to think. OK, when was the first time I had a teacher of a different ethnicity than me?

So I'm going through and going through and going through and I get to high school and still nothing. My high school not only didn't have any black teachers, we only had like three black students (out of 700 students).

So I'm thinking OK, I surely must have had a black professor in college. Central Michigan, especially in the 90s, wasn't exactly a bastion of diversity, but there were black, Latinx and Native profs. But nope, I don't think I ever had one (there definitely wasn't any in the journalism school at the time -- that's changed since as well.)

Basically, I've never took a class at any point in my education from a teacher of a different ethnicity of me and that really shook me for a bit, because it's not something I've ever really considered. If I had it all to do over again I probably would have taken better advantage of some different courses/classes in college to get a more-rounded education (CMU in particular has a great Native American studies curriculum because of the Saginaw Chippewa Tribe being a major presence in the area.)

Don't know why I mention it, but like I said -- it's kind of been bothering me especially since Trump's racist tweets started coming out.
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Re: Racism

Post by A_B »

Definitely not until college. My second year I took a class on The History of Islam, and that professor was from Egypt I believe. Then I had scads of Asian professors in engineering classes, then later in the analytical Finance courses. So my experience was largely along the presumed stereotypical lines...a Muslim for a Islam class, then asians for technical/analytical courses. I'm struggling to recall any black professors, though my advisor when I went back to school was black (that dude no joke changed my life just by giving me information that my previous advisers had failed to give me about how to go about getting back in to finish my degree).
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Re: Racism

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Freshman college for me, and I grew up in a town where they bused in a few students from Boston and a air force base used our high school, so there were a few black students. I remember hearing a Gladwell podcast saying that one result of desegregating schools was that all the black teachers lost their jobs, which he claimed had a drastic affect on academic performance of African American students.
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Re: Racism

Post by Sabo »

brian wrote: Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:01 am So there was a tweet that made the rounds over the weekend. Maybe you saw it, maybe you didn't. It was a guy who got a lot of comments and retweets asking people to reply with the first time they had a teacher of color. The tweet itself was innocuous/fine, that's not why I mention it.

But I started to think. OK, when was the first time I had a teacher of a different ethnicity than me?

So I'm going through and going through and going through and I get to high school and still nothing. My high school not only didn't have any black teachers, we only had like three black students (out of 700 students).

So I'm thinking OK, I surely must have had a black professor in college. Central Michigan, especially in the 90s, wasn't exactly a bastion of diversity, but there were black, Latinx and Native profs. But nope, I don't think I ever had one (there definitely wasn't any in the journalism school at the time -- that's changed since as well.)

Basically, I've never took a class at any point in my education from a teacher of a different ethnicity of me and that really shook me for a bit, because it's not something I've ever really considered. If I had it all to do over again I probably would have taken better advantage of some different courses/classes in college to get a more-rounded education (CMU in particular has a great Native American studies curriculum because of the Saginaw Chippewa Tribe being a major presence in the area.)

Don't know why I mention it, but like I said -- it's kind of been bothering me especially since Trump's racist tweets started coming out.
Junior high for me. My junior high and high school were pretty much half black and half white, so I had a lot of exposure to minority teachers.
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Re: Racism

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Fifth grade for me.
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Re: Racism

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Freshman year of college. Sociology class. Dude was prepping for a run against Julia Carson. He didn't win.
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Re: Racism

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duff wrote: Tue Jul 16, 2019 10:31 am Freshman year of college. Sociology class. Dude was prepping for a run against Julia Carson. He didn't win.
Nor did anyone else against that family for 30 years.
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Re: Racism

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I had a music teacher in elementary school... He was pretty harsh, but he also introduced us to Chic, which was bad ass. He made me solo on the Five Golden Rings part of 12 Days of Xmas which I simply couldn't do and it was pretty traumatizing.

Anyways, beyond that, even in hippy haven where I grew up, I don't recall any other black teachers. Nor were there any when I moved to MD. And come to think of it, I don't recall any in college either.
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Re: Racism

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You know, I never thought about this before.

In terms of a visible minority, had to be Mr. Singh in grade 8. Wild, thinking of my Junior High and High Schools, there were a couple East Asian teachers - including the smoking hot Ms. Chung, a couple South Asian teachers but that was it.

None in university either.
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Re: Racism

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Third grade, but she was the only African-American teacher in the school. My favorite story about her happened the one and only time I was taken to the principal's office in elementary. One of my best friends and I (still great friends to this day) got in a scuffle playing basketball and he ended up sitting on me when I wouldn't give him the ball. As we're halfway to the office, she stops, turns around and goes, "you two are friends, you don't really want to go to the principal's office, do you?" We both enthusiastically say no and she responds, "well TOO BAD!", and lead us the rest of the way.
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Re: Racism

Post by phxgators »

Damn, that's something I never thought of.

Freshman year of college.

Looked it up, the county I grew up in (in Indiana) is currently 88% white. Higher than I thought, I know our high school was more mixed than that. But on further consideration... I suspect it was just my school's district that had a higher concentration of minorities. We still had plenty of confederate flag worshiping rednecks at our school. With the occasional before-school rally at a nearby store's parking lot.
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Re: Racism

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phxgators wrote: Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:12 pm Damn, that's something I never thought of.

Freshman year of college.

Looked it up, the county I grew up in (in Indiana) is currently 88% white. Higher than I thought, I know our high school was more mixed than that. But on further consideration... I suspect it was just my school's district that had a higher concentration of minorities. We still had plenty of confederate flag worshiping rednecks at our school. With the occasional before-school rally at a nearby store's parking lot.
Holy shit. My home county is 97.6% white. I was assuming something close to your number, but dang.
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Re: Racism

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79.8 percent white here, but segregated in such a way that would make Strom Thurmond proud.
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Re: Racism

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Really interesting, I never realized it until now, but my entire elementary school was all white female teachers, except for the one white male 6th grade teacher. Not just my teachers, but every single teacher in the school! We had 2 or 3 black kids in my grade, probably about the same for every grade, and a decent number of Asian and Indian kids (India, not Native American), mostly because of the University, engineering jobs and hospitals. Probably close to 50% of the kids I knew growing up had fathers who worked at IBM, GE, Singer Link or were doctors of professors. The gym teacher, in retrospect, was very clearly a lesbian, so that's the breadth of diversity. Oh, the principal was a white man, of course, and I was recently telling my daughter, he would smoke cigarettes in his office while disciplining kids. Hilarious seeing the shock on my kid's face. If she sees a neighbor sneaking a cigarette, she thinks it's time to call 911.

Started thinking about HS, and couldn't think of a single non-white teacher. Dug up my yearbook, and I'll be damned. Not only is there not a single non-white teacher, but even the lunch aides, cafeteria staff and custodial staff were 100% white! Race never occurred to me much, because the few black and latino kids in school were all middle class, with parents who were engineers, professors or doctors, so despite different skin colors, they were in the same socio-economic class, and race just wasn't an issue.

College I had a few minority professors, and my favorite law professor by miles is black, but it is actually disturbing that I never had a non-white teacher prior to college. Looking at my kids' schools, I think it is almost exclusively white teachers there, too. When they were in daycare at a fairly large school, most of the teachers and employees were Afro-Brazilian, Dominican or Puerto Rican, so I loved that my kids were immersed with people of different races before they were old enough to understand racism existed. And at age 3, my son's Puerto Rican teacher was thrilled that he was learning Spanish words with a perfect Puerto Rican accent.
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Re: Racism

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County: 83.7%
City: 52.9%

Grade school maybe 80% and HS way worse. City league baseball was the only representative demo I was a part of.
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Re: Racism

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Spent my early years growing up in Southern California towns that skirted both edges of middle class, with demographics that roughly matched the country overall. Had a fair number of black/Hispanic/Asian teachers in elementary and junior high school. Moved to a Colorado suburb before high school and drawing a blank on any non-white teachers there. Had a few in college.
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Re: Racism

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phxgators wrote: Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:12 pm Damn, that's something I never thought of.

Freshman year of college.

Looked it up, the county I grew up in (in Indiana) is currently 88% white. Higher than I thought, I know our high school was more mixed than that. But on further consideration... I suspect it was just my school's district that had a higher concentration of minorities. We still had plenty of confederate flag worshiping rednecks at our school. With the occasional before-school rally at a nearby store's parking lot.
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Re: Racism

Post by Johnnie »

3rd grade when I moved to California. The only full time teacher I had who was a minority. Other than that, white men and women only. Though I did learn later my religion teacher from high school is gay.

I do remember a substitute in freshman year of high school once though. He stapled paper in the center of the page instead of the top corner. Kinda funny seeing the regular English teacher come back and going "WTF is this shit?"
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Re: Racism

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I do have a remarkable streak of having gay superiors at work, interestingly enough. I've worked for four companies since graduating college and have had gay bosses at three of them, including two different gay bosses at the company Sabo and I worked at together. My boss in my current position is gay as well. All told in the almost 25 years I've been in the workforce, I've had gay superiors for about 20+ years of them.
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Re: Racism

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I had a Spanish teacher in high school who was from Spain. That was it, as far as I can remember. Things may be changing now, because I know that daughter had a few hispanic teachers growing up.
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Re: Racism

Post by teeteebee »

Not sure why this is in the racism thread but I went through public school from 1st to 12th grade. 3rd grade (BF), 6th grade (BM) (same school) and 7th grade (BF) (different school). That's almost half my teachers before High School. I had a mix in HS. FWIW, I graduated from HS 27 years ago.
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Re: Racism

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Nine is super young to be dating a teacher.
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Re: Racism

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First ethnic teacher was an older Spanish woman who taught 6th grade Spanish language. She infused her lessons with Mexican geographical history, to help with syntax and pronunciation. Which looking back, was sorta bad-ass.

First black teacher was in HS Geometry as a sophomore. Well, technically it was freshman English, but once she read my first assignment she bumped me into Honors English and out of her class. Next I had a civics class taught by some black dude. Forget his name, but it was an easy A. My Chemistry teacher junior year was also black. Mr. Reed.
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Re: Racism

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Pretty fascinating and meaningful question.

I had an African American (male) math teacher in either 6th grade (I think, might have been 5th, and as an aside that school has a thread-relevant backstory), and a male African American science teacher in 7th grade. I had spent 3rd-6th in a gifted and talented program where we were pretty much ensconced in our own classes for the vast majority of the school day. So between being released back into genpop, hormones and probably a lack of challenge in some of the classes, that was a really bad year for me scholastically. I can recall that particular science teacher sticking me in the corner at some point during class, in retrospect almost certainly rightfully so.

I can't recall a HS teacher who wasn't white (even the Spanish teacher was a white woman). Might need to look through a yearbook.

I majored in math/comp sci, and had a bunch of older, white professors (though one was openly gay, and we had an adjunct who was a Muslim woman my senior year). My one semester of Spanish, I think my professor was actually from Spain (and sexy!), but I took some art and philosophy courses and definitely had multiple WOC professors along the way there.
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Re: Racism

Post by phxgators »

rass wrote: Wed Jul 17, 2019 8:15 am I can't recall a HS teacher who wasn't white (even the Spanish teacher was a white woman). Might need to look through a yearbook.
Ha, yes... Our was too. She married a Colombian and would mention it roughly twice every class. She got married during my freshman year and could not wait to change her name.
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Re: Racism

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Nothing in HS, unless you count French-Canadians.

College, had a couple of Navajo instructors, a couple of Asian instructors, some Hispanics, and a SPANISH instructor (he made sure we knew he was Spanish, lots of gripes between the former Spanish colonies and Spain,) an African-American TA. History and PolSci in NM. Not many African-Americans in the state as a whole. Lots of Hispanics and Natives.
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Re: Racism

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I went to Detroit public schools and had a fair number of black teachers and a couple of Asian teachers, but I’m willing to bet that the majority of my teachers were still white women despite a significant majority of the city being black. I don’t remember ever having a Latinx teacher- my Spanish teachers were a black African man and two very white women.

My favorite teacher was the black man I had in 8th grade for homeroom, which included English, Science, and Social Studies. He got me involved in his Optimist Club’s speech contest, and got me reinvested in school after some traumatic ears in 6th and 7th grade. Mr. Adams was good people.
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Re: Racism

Post by TT2.0 »

phxgators wrote: Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:12 pm Damn, that's something I never thought of.

Freshman year of college.

Looked it up, the county I grew up in (in Indiana) is currently 88% white. Higher than I thought, I know our high school was more mixed than that. But on further consideration... I suspect it was just my school's district that had a higher concentration of minorities. We still had plenty of confederate flag worshiping rednecks at our school. With the occasional before-school rally at a nearby store's parking lot.
how do you look up the racial breakdown of where you grew up? I had the opposite educational experience. Most of my teachers had a different skincolor. I made it all the way to kindergarten before i had a teacher a different color than me. made it to 3rd grade before I had a white teacher actually
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Re: Racism

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I googled my county + demographics. Took me to wikipedia.
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Re: Racism

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I will say this, Ann Arbor-at least where lived-had a pretty integrated school system. I grew up with at least a quarter of my classes having black kids. Mostly middle class, but not all (and that was across the board, shit I got free lunches for many of those years.)

And when I got older, my best friend went to a different middle school and they had closer to 60-40. And his other good friends were both black, so I got pulled into that group and it was REALLY cool getting to know them and eventually be accepted.

Fast forward to where I work now, which is probably 50-50 (well, there's a lot of other ethnicities, but you get the gist.) Over the years, I've had a number of black co-workers tell me the reason they like working with me is that I seem so comfortable.

That's not a humblebrag, it's just to say I don't think I'd be so comfortable without my experiences growing up. One of the things I learned to erase from my vernacular is "I don't see color, I just see people."

Well, fuck you dude, because blacks and other POC sure do feel the effects of their skin tone EVERY DAY. You are dismissing their life experience in one shitty statement. Intentions may be good, but hoo boy is that a loaded phrase white people use.
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Re: Racism

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"I imagine one of the reasons people cling to their hate so stubbornly is because they sense, once hate is gone, they will be forced to deal with pain."
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Re: Racism

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I dont see color is the same as I have black friends. It should immediately raise red flags.
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Re: Racism

Post by Johnnie »

She actually pinned this tweet.



And that's how you create more Trump supporters.

I can absolutely decide what is racist. Statements like this insult the intelligence of people that actually use their brains to think. This woman is clearly off the deep end liberal to a point where if tell her to go to hell with a statement like that.
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Re: Racism

Post by A_B »

I think you are missing the point.

Just saying two weeks ago I thought the Betsy Ross flag was innocuous. Now I know there are reasons some view it as racist.
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Re: Racism

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A_B wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 12:58 pm I think you are missing the point.

Just saying two weeks ago I thought the Betsy Ross flag was innocuous. Now I know there are reasons some view it as racist.
Yeah if you give her the benefit of the doubt I don’t think she’s saying white people are incapable of determining if something is racist or not but we should also trust black people if they think something is racist.
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Re: Racism

Post by Johnnie »

Throwing out a one line statement of fact in a condescending tone without a fully fleshed out thread by which to get your point across is exactly the problem of the internet.

How am I supposed to next level think what she means by that? The burden is on me now? No. That's not how arguments work.
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Re: Racism

Post by Johnnie »

brian wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 1:50 pm
A_B wrote: Sun Jul 21, 2019 12:58 pm I think you are missing the point.

Just saying two weeks ago I thought the Betsy Ross flag was innocuous. Now I know there are reasons some view it as racist.
Yeah if you give her the benefit of the doubt I don’t think she’s saying white people are incapable of determining if something is racist or not but we should also trust black people if they think something is racist.
Then write that out.

"White people alone don't get to decide what's racist."

Is that too tough?
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Re: Racism

Post by A_B »

So I think you are perfectly capable of knowing that certain, even a majority of, things are racist. But there are also likely to be some blind spots that a person of a different race - not just black, mind you - might see things you don't.

ETA: I've put it inelegantly, but maybe a better way to think about is that you aren't really allowed to decide what ISN'T racist.


Also ETA: I somehow missed Brian's point, which said what i did.
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