The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Fri Nov 13, 2020 3:58 pm

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by BSF21 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:01 pm

Yea I don't have a blue checkmark to shout into the void at. But that!
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by sancarlos » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:07 pm

BSF21 wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:01 pm
Yea I don't have a blue checkmark to shout into the void at. But that!
I see some folks in the twitterverse making a fuss about having the "verified" blue check mark.

So, somebody explain to me the (perceived) benefit of having the blue check mark?

I assumed it meant you were just recognized as an official celebrity?
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by brian » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:09 pm

sancarlos wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:07 pm
BSF21 wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:01 pm
Yea I don't have a blue checkmark to shout into the void at. But that!
I see some folks in the twitterverse making a fuss about having the "verified" blue check mark.

So, somebody explain to me the (perceived) benefit of having the blue check mark?

I assumed it meant you were just recognized as an official celebrity?
It's just a verification that the account is actually who it is purporting to be, but you also have to be famous enough to have that potentially be in doubt.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Pruitt » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:20 pm

brian wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:09 pm
sancarlos wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:07 pm
BSF21 wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 4:01 pm
Yea I don't have a blue checkmark to shout into the void at. But that!
I see some folks in the twitterverse making a fuss about having the "verified" blue check mark.

So, somebody explain to me the (perceived) benefit of having the blue check mark?

I assumed it meant you were just recognized as an official celebrity?
It's just a verification that the account is actually who it is purporting to be, but you also have to be famous enough to have that potentially be in doubt.
"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by mister d » Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:49 pm

rass wrote:
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I'm definitely known as "the boy who cried penis" in town.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by GoodKarma » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:06 pm

mister d wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 7:49 pm
Sirota became the biggest fucking crybaby since Bernie dropped out.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Steve of phpBB » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:56 pm

Yeah but that’s kinda funny.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:57 pm

Yea, even I had to unfollow him. Every fucking post was bitching and moaning to the point that it seemed like he'd rather have Trump out of spite.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Rush2112 » Fri Nov 13, 2020 11:26 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Fri Nov 13, 2020 9:56 pm
Yeah but that’s kinda funny.
funny cause it's sort of true.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Pruitt » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:35 am

Can't get enough of these...

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:39 pm

Really loving the bullshit taking point of "HoW mUcH fRaUd Is Ok WiTh YoU??!" amongst the Trump surrogates on TV.

Specifically Jenna Ellis last night on Real Time and Erin Perrine on Fox News today.

And it's slick they put women up there to argue it because the second a dude would raise his voice to someone like that he'll be labeled a misogynist immediately and then the talking point changes.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Rush2112 » Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:55 am

At the 100000 (actual numbers might vary) MAGA march today.

Image
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by EnochRoot » Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:07 am

The dull light in that kid’s eyes.

Manufacturing jobs and the promise of a middle class life they would provide have all but evaporated. Renewable energy jobs are great, but TBH, I could get behind an America-first initiative that basically says that if you're selling a car in this country, you better be producing x% of the parts here. How the hell did we let this happen?

The simple fact of the matter is you have got to have manufacturing in this country. Full scale, every city.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Steve of phpBB » Sun Nov 15, 2020 12:37 pm

EnochRoot wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:07 am
The dull light in that kid’s eyes.

Manufacturing jobs and the promise of a middle class life they would provide have all but evaporated. Renewable energy jobs are great, but TBH, I could get behind an America-first initiative that basically says that if you're selling a car in this country, you better be producing x% of the parts here. How the hell did we let this happen?

The simple fact of the matter is you have got to have manufacturing in this country. Full scale, every city.
Manufacturing output in the US has apparently gone up over the past years/decades, at least in raw value. As a percentage of GDP it dropped from the 90s to about 2009 and has remained steady since then.

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/U ... ing-output

But so much manufacturing has become automated, so in addition to manufacturing going overseas, there are fewer manufacturing jobs from the plants that have stayed here.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:47 pm

All of that is the reason why Andrew Yang wants UBI for everyone.

How the hell are you going to take care of a nation of 320+ million people when we've "leaned" the fuck out of everything? America put profits above people.

Despite having a redonkulous GDP and more millionaires and billionaires than ever before ("job creators"), people are going hungry, destitute, and living off of a program like Social Security that will get axed before I'm able to pull from it.

And the lack of education at the lowest level is so bad that people believe black and brown people are the culprits for their situation and not the concentration of wealth and the failed theory of "Trickle Down" economics from whites at the top.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by DSafetyGuy » Sun Nov 15, 2020 6:11 pm

Johnnie wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 1:47 pm
All of that is the reason why Andrew Yang wants UBI for everyone.

How the hell are you going to take care of a nation of 320+ million people when we've "leaned" the fuck out of everything? America put profits above people.

Despite having a redonkulous GDP and more millionaires and billionaires than ever before ("job creators"), people are going hungry, destitute, and living off of a program like Social Security that will get axed before I'm able to pull from it.

And the lack of education at the lowest level is so bad that people believe black and brown people are the culprits for their situation and not the concentration of wealth and the failed theory of "Trickle Down" economics from whites at the top.
Don't worry, California's Prop 22, which enables companies like Uber to keep their workers as independent contractors and not employees (meaning no minimum wage, overtime, paid sick leave, or unemployment insurance) will help keep everyone flailing for life.

But don't worry, it can't be overturned without seven-eighths approval.

Is it any wonder companies like Uber and Lyft, who have never come close to turning a profit, spent $205 million on trying to get it passed? It's been estimated those two companies will save a combined $115 million a year on unpaid employment due to Prop 22.

Laws just like it are already headed to other states (Hello, Illinois).
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Sun Nov 15, 2020 6:36 pm

There seriously needs to be a mass exodus of people from that state.

What shit.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by sancarlos » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:11 pm

Johnnie wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 6:36 pm
There seriously needs to be a mass exodus of people from that state.

What shit.
That’s a bad take.

Regardless of this setback, California is the most progressive state in the union. Or close to it.

I voted against the Uber Lyft prop, but I could see they were probably going to win. Every other commercial on television was a ad for that proposition. They got some drivers to appear in the commercials and make it seem like all the drivers were in favor of it. And Mothers Against Drunk Driving made some strong commercials endorsing the proposition (implying that if the prop failed you might not be able to get an Uber when you needed one.) Advertising is powerful.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by mister d » Sun Nov 15, 2020 7:15 pm

Seems like a good example of how things pass when the opposition party isn't really opposed?
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by HaulCitgo » Sun Nov 15, 2020 8:36 pm

It's an information (lack of) issue. Same thing years ago in georgia when they passed a constitutional amendment more or less allowing non compete provisions. In what world would the majority of the voting working class want this?

The wording and language of those referendum questions smells worse than the ads but seems like those challenges have generally come back against invalidity.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by mister d » Sun Nov 15, 2020 8:50 pm

Ok, so if the corporate side is putting out massive amounts of misleading information to further their cause, whose role is it to counter that so the voting public understands the potential harm to them?
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by DSafetyGuy » Sun Nov 15, 2020 8:55 pm

Spending on Prop 22 was $205 million for support and just under $20 million for opposition. The side in favor was distributing flyers with blatant misinformation, using their "independent contractors" to distribute them.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by degenerasian » Sun Nov 15, 2020 9:42 pm

I'm surprised Prop 16 lost in California. That was another 20 million spent by the yes side. I'm also always floored by how much money is in American politics.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Pruitt » Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:20 am

"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by tennbengal » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:06 am

Are we still sure the military won't need to get involved?

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Steve of phpBB » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:10 am

tennbengal wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:06 am
Are we still sure the military won't need to get involved?
Yes. States are going to start certifying results this week. Biden will announce various appointees. Trump will rant about Dominion and Venezuela and no one will listen. Then he’ll head down to Mar-a-lago and quite possibly not even come back to DC.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by tennbengal » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:38 am

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:10 am
tennbengal wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:06 am
Are we still sure the military won't need to get involved?
Yes. States are going to start certifying results this week. Biden will announce various appointees. Trump will rant about Dominion and Venezuela and no one will listen. Then he’ll head down to Mar-a-lago and quite possibly not even come back to DC.
Ok. Thanks. Every three days I think the nightmare is over but then it continues.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Square Rob » Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:22 am

God I hope so. I hate this so much. It has me raving insanely to myself as I drive.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Pruitt » Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:43 am

Square Rob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:22 am
God I hope so. I hate this so much. It has me raving insanely to myself as I drive.
The idiot isn't even pretending to work anymore. It's just insane.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by EnochRoot » Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am

How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by The Sybian » Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:58 am

EnochRoot wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am
How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.
Considering he is the President and Twitter is a private company, I think we are pretty safe on a 1A front.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by sancarlos » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:01 pm

Square Rob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:22 am
God I hope so. I hate this so much. It has me raving insanely to myself as I drive.
This.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Steve of phpBB » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:08 pm

EnochRoot wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am
How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.
I don’t see any way the constitution would allow governmental restrictions of “false speech,” except in the narrow areas that are actionable under the common law. On the other hand, Twitter legally could suspend Trump’s account any time.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:41 pm

If Twitter had the balls, they'd just fucking do it.

But they love hiding behind the fact he's president and placating him is more important.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by mister d » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:47 pm

Repeated suspensions would be a lot funnier.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by BSF21 » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:52 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:08 pm
EnochRoot wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am
How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.
I don’t see any way the constitution would allow governmental restrictions of “false speech,” except in the narrow areas that are actionable under the common law. On the other hand, Twitter legally could suspend Trump’s account any time.
At what point are we entering “yelling fire in a crowded theatre” level speech? I’d argue we’re well past that.
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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Johnnie » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:06 pm

LegalEagle just posted this. This guy is super awesome.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by Steve of phpBB » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:10 pm

BSF21 wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:52 pm
Steve of phpBB wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:08 pm
EnochRoot wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am
How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.
I don’t see any way the constitution would allow governmental restrictions of “false speech,” except in the narrow areas that are actionable under the common law. On the other hand, Twitter legally could suspend Trump’s account any time.
At what point are we entering “yelling fire in a crowded theatre” level speech? I’d argue we’re well past that.
Speech can be punished after the fact if it creates an imminent danger of serious physical violence - incitement to riot is one example. But even then it is very very very rare that a judge would issue an order directing someone to not say certain things.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: The WH Transition Thread --- all things Trump to Biden until Inauguration

Post by EnochRoot » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:53 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:08 pm
EnochRoot wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 11:53 am
How might the constitution protect against gaslighting and blatant mis/disinformation campaigns?

False Speech goes beyond a 1A issue. It tramples upon our digital rights, too, which aren’t really codified into the document as of yet.
I don’t see any way the constitution would allow governmental restrictions of “false speech,” except in the narrow areas that are actionable under the common law. On the other hand, Twitter legally could suspend Trump’s account any time.
Then perhaps the Constitution isn’t as omnipotent as we think it to be.

Elon University collected Qualified responses to the question: What civil liberties might be curtailed by acts to cut misinformation?

There are many good responses to the question, including the one I copy-pasta’d below.
Barry Chudakov, founder and principal, Sertain Research and StreamFuzion Corp. wrote:

“To preserve civil liberties while reducing fake and misleading information, we bump headlong into the need for information standards. We have a constitutional Bill of Rights not because one day in 1789 James Madison decided it might be nice to have; we have the Bill of Rights because our personal rights were being abused and early Americans needed to be persuaded that the federal government would respect their basic rights.

“We now need an Information Bill of Rights with international signatories.

“We need to take into account the ubiquity of personal information and tracking; we need to institutionalize information watchdogs who will review collection and revelation standards from both programmed AI and live captures. We are in a new world and we need new-world tools and standards to establish protocols and protections. Included in the Information Bill of Rights should be such protections as: freedom of the press’ sources named and unnamed; the right to both protect and disseminate information for the public good; the right to know who is collecting data on you, or anyone, and the right to see all levels of that data – to name a few.

“The democratization of data brings with it the responsibility to establish widely adopted governance protocols. According to EMC: “by 2020 [the digital universe will contain] nearly as many digital bits as there are stars in the universe. It is doubling in size every two years, and by 2020 the digital universe – the data we create and copy annually – will reach 44 zettabytes, or 44 trillion gigabytes.” While these sums are mind-boggling, even more boggling is that we are letting this information ship go without steering, without a rudder. We can preserve civil liberties once we establish a set of standards for collection, transparency, transmission, and other key issues.
This is a self-service data invasion “created by everyone using a digital camera, by the more than 2 billion people and millions of enterprises living their lives and doing their work online, and by the millions of sensors and communicating devices sending and receiving data over the Internet.” [EMC]

“Before we consider what, if any, rights might have to be curtailed, we should assess where we are – namely in the weeds. We have taken a laissez faire attitude to one of the most powerful forces ever unleashed by humans: exponentially multiplying information and information collection and manipulation systems.

“Once we have formulated, and there is broad adoption of, an Information Bill of Rights, the next step to reduce fake and misleading information is to educate as well as inform. Free citizens in the new information environment have a unique imperative: we all must be information omnivores because we now see clearly that information does not have a neutral intent; bad actors are using misinformation to effect their agendas. Just as we educate children about personal hygiene and proper nutrition, from an early age, we must teach our children – and then insist on adults in positions of authority – that they balance information sources and facts from a broad stream of media.

“Narrowcasting is the enemy of freedom. Broadcasting, and broad thinking, will preserve democratic perspectives and voices.”

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