Happy Inauguration Day (and beyond- The Biden Presidency Thread part I)

[psunate77]

I'm thinking Manchin is probably being offered all sorts of shiny things by the GOP if he'd switch parties.

Looks like it

[Steve of phpBB]

[Johnnie]

Edit:

[Johnnie]

And on the heels of that news:



Glad I'm in the Not Middle East right now.

[psunate77]

Edit:

I hate when Republicans are in charge.

Anyways this should have never been on the COVID relief bill anyways.

[psunate77]

This will never pass.

[psunate77]

WTF Biden??? 6 weeks in and your dropping bombs.

[Johnnie]

Bad guys don't stop because America changed presidents.

You act like American imperialism is supposed to suddenly go away.

[Steve of phpBB]

Edit:

The Parliamentarian's ruling was pretty clearly obviously correct.

But do we even know if there are fifty votes in the Senate to raise the minimum wage to $15?

This gets us back to the fundamental problem where we all want Congress to do strongly liberal stuff when the strong majority of the country isn't liberal.

[EdRomero]

Can't they put up a simple the new minimum wage is $15 with nothing attached? It might not pass, but everyone who voted against it would then be on record for blocking something very popular.

[brian]

The $15 minimum wage isn't an extreme liberal position. It polls at something like 67 percent for Christ's sake.

[P.D.X.]

The $15 minimum wage isn't an extreme liberal position. It polls at something like 67 percent for Christ's sake.

RIght?

@Steve, I think you conflate the 'identify as a liberal' polls with actual policy polls when it's clear that there's a significant delta in like all of them.

[BSF21]

It's amazing you guys still suffer that fool upthread.

[Steve of phpBB]

Can't they put up a simple the new minimum wage is $15 with nothing attached? It might not pass, but everyone who voted against it would then be on record for blocking something very popular.

Yeah but I think the goal is to actually make it happen.

The $15 minimum wage isn't an extreme liberal position. It polls at something like 67 percent for Christ's sake.

Right?

@Steve, I think you conflate the 'identify as a liberal' polls with actual policy polls when it's clear that there's a significant delta in like all of them.

Sure, it's not that this particular issue might not be a crazy liberal idea. (Which itself is remarkable, since we're talking about more than doubling the minimum wage to a level that even accounting for inflation is the highest it's ever been.)

But the politicians themselves are not liberal, because the electorate that selects them is not liberal.

[serrano]

Can't they put up a simple the new minimum wage is $15 with nothing attached? It might not pass, but everyone who voted against it would then be on record for blocking something very popular.

Yeah but I think the goal is to actually make it happen.

The $15 minimum wage isn't an extreme liberal position. It polls at something like 67 percent for Christ's sake.

Right?

@Steve, I think you conflate the 'identify as a liberal' polls with actual policy polls when it's clear that there's a significant delta in like all of them.

Sure, it's not that this particular issue might not be a crazy liberal idea. (Which itself is remarkable, since we're talking about more than doubling the minimum wage to a level that even accounting for inflation is the highest it's ever been.)

But the politicians themselves are not liberal, because the electorate that selects them is not liberal.

The words “voter suppression” are flashing in my head right now.

[Steve of phpBB]

It's not about voter suppression. It's about the fact that 3/4 of Americans identify as moderate or conservative rather than liberal.

[mister d]

“Yes, the polls show 2/3 of the country is in favor of the $15 minimum wage, but if you told them their coffee would cost 35 cents more every week? The entire country would be against it. Debate over. Trust me, I want it as much as anyone (if not more!), but it’s a terrible idea that we really need to never talk about ever again.”

[Johnnie]

This $15 minimum wage increase looks an awful lot like Florida's.

https://www.natlawreview.com/article/fl ... o-increase

Manchin and Sinema are just trash human beings for the sake of being trash human beings at this point.

[Johnnie]

America, fuck yea!

Everyone flipped out over the Trump Administration cover up and dismissal of the murder, but when the Biden Administration is in power, he...does nothing.

Seems appropriate. This administration is going to right no real wrongs from the last one. It's kinda why people look at both parties as "the same." Sure, they're different on social issues, but on the world stage? Business as usual.

[serrano]

It's not about voter suppression. It's about the fact that 3/4 of Americans identify as moderate or conservative rather than liberal.

Why would the GOP be doing shit like this if they had, say, 3/5 of the electorate you mention? Because self-identified political ideology doesn’t quite translate to positions on pubic policy. Republicans know that the policies that are popular with the majority of the electorate come at the expense of
Large concentrations of wealth and power and instead of adapting to the new tempo of the game, they’re trying to
cange the rules by which it’s played so they can be the Greenwich Globetrotters to the liberal’s Washington Generals. .

[serrano]

I also don’t know how to embed tweets. Sorry. I can’t figure out why I’m so dumb.

[Johnnie]

I also don’t know how to embed tweets. Sorry. I can’t figure out why I’m so dumb.

Are you looking at tweets from a webpage or an app?

If it's from Chrome or whatever I think you should just be able to copy the URL of the direct link of the tweet.

If it's from an app, there's a "share tweet" icon that you click and it should give you the option of sharing a link.

https://help.twitter.com/en/using-twitter/share-a-tweet

The Swamp's software recognizes that it's a tweet and embeds the tweet. Same for Instagram, Facebook, Amazon, etc.. links.

[serrano]

I also don’t know how to embed tweets. Sorry. I can’t figure out why I’m so dumb.

Are you looking at tweets from a webpage or an app?

If it's from Chrome or whatever I think you should just be able to copy the URL of the direct link of the tweet.

If it's from an app, there's a "share tweet" icon that you click and it should give you the option of sharing a link.

https://help.twitter.com/en/using-twitter/share-a-tweet

The Swamp's software recognizes that it's a tweet and embeds the tweet. Same for Instagram, Facebook, Amazon, etc.. links.

Tweetbot. Thanks, Airman!

[Steve of phpBB]

It's not about voter suppression. It's about the fact that 3/4 of Americans identify as moderate or conservative rather than liberal.

Why would the GOP be doing shit like this if they had, say, 3/5 of the electorate you mention? Because self-identified political ideology doesn’t quite translate to positions on pubic policy. Republicans know that the policies that are popular with the majority of the electorate come at the expense of
Large concentrations of wealth and power and instead of adapting to the new tempo of the game, they’re trying to
cange the rules by which it’s played so they can be the Greenwich Globetrotters to the liberal’s Washington Generals. .

The GOP doesn’t have 3/5 of the electorate.

America is 3/8 conservative, 3/8 moderate, and 1/4 liberal. The GOP engages in voter suppression because they’ve gotten *so* batshit crazy that moderates generally prefer the Democrats right now.

Here’s the latest Gallup article on political identification. You can see from the chart that this basic breakdown has been pretty consistent for 25-30 years.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/328367/ame ... -2020.aspx

[Steve of phpBB]

“Yes, the polls show 2/3 of the country is in favor of the $15 minimum wage, but if you told them their coffee would cost 35 cents more every week? The entire country would be against it. Debate over. Trust me, I want it as much as anyone (if not more!), but it’s a terrible idea that we really need to never talk about ever again.”

See, the fact that you had to make this up instead of quoting anything anyone has actually said about the minimum wage issue should tell you something.

[serrano]

It's not about voter suppression. It's about the fact that 3/4 of Americans identify as moderate or conservative rather than liberal.

Why would the GOP be doing shit like this if they had, say, 3/5 of the electorate you mention? Because self-identified political ideology doesn’t quite translate to positions on pubic policy. Republicans know that the policies that are popular with the majority of the electorate come at the expense of
Large concentrations of wealth and power and instead of adapting to the new tempo of the game, they’re trying to
cange the rules by which it’s played so they can be the Greenwich Globetrotters to the liberal’s Washington Generals. .

The GOP doesn’t have 3/5 of the electorate.

America is 3/8 conservative, 3/8 moderate, and 1/4 liberal. The GOP engages in voter suppression because they’ve gotten *so* batshit crazy that moderates generally prefer the Democrats right now.

Here’s the latest Gallup article on political identification. You can see from the chart that this basic breakdown has been pretty consistent for 25-30 years.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/328367/ame ... -2020.aspx

That’s fine and Gallup is very reputable, but self-identification on ideology can differ from policy preferences. I looked to see if there was a link to the questions on the gallup poll to see whether they did anything there with policy preferences. With 63% of Americans prefer a single government-run program to provide health care, on top of thing like growing support for raising the minimum wage, and other liberal programs, suppressing blocs of voters who would most likely elect liberal/democratic representative isn’t crazy. It’s entirely pragmatic.

https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/ ... -coverage/

[mister d]

So if M4A is a liberal policy that fully half of non-liberals also approve of?

[P.D.X.]

Yeah it's weird to gauge policy on how people identify rather than what they actually support or vote for.

[Steve of phpBB]

So if M4A is a liberal policy that fully half of non-liberals also approve of?

Unfortunately no. Serrano misread that.

36% support the creation or existence of a single government-run program. And it’s not clear that those 36% support the end of private health insurance, which is what the Sanders M4A proposal involves. Rather that’s the system they want the government to use.

When asked how the government should provide health insurance coverage, 36% of Americans say it should be provided through a single national government program, while 26% say it should continue to be provided through a mix of private insurance companies and government programs. This is a change from about a year ago, when nearly equal shares supported a “single payer” health insurance program (30%) and a mix of government programs and private insurers (28%).

63% is the number of people believing that the government has a responsibility to provide health care coverage for all. So they support universal health care but not necessarily single payer / M4A.

[serrano]

So if M4A is a liberal policy that fully half of non-liberals also approve of?

Unfortunately no. Serrano misread that.

36% support the creation or existence of a single government-run program. And it’s not clear that those 36% support the end of private health insurance, which is what the Sanders M4A proposal involves. Rather that’s the system they want the government to use.

When asked how the government should provide health insurance coverage, 36% of Americans say it should be provided through a single national government program, while 26% say it should continue to be provided through a mix of private insurance companies and government programs. This is a change from about a year ago, when nearly equal shares supported a “single payer” health insurance program (30%) and a mix of government programs and private insurers (28%).

63% is the number of people believing that the government has a responsibility to provide health care coverage for all. So they support universal health care but not necessarily single payer / M4A.

I did misread that (my bad), but on policy, people are still moving towards more “liberal” positions even if they don’t think of them as such.

[Steve of phpBB]

This is pretty good.

[mister d]

[EnochRoot]

That’s a fair response to a loaded question.

[mister d]

Well ... its not a loaded question if the answer is "of course a policy that would affect tens of millions is more important than any singular nominee", is it?

[brian]

Administrations can do multiple things at once. I don’t imagine many of us work on one project at a time. If the choice were Tanden or $15/hr somehow and they chose the latter than get the pitchforks. But I imagine Biden and the Dems would gleefully reject her 100-0 if it was the quid pro quo for a minimum wage deal.

[mister d]

I think that would have been a much better answer than indignation it was even asked.

[EnochRoot]

Well ... its not a loaded question if the answer is "of course a policy that would affect tens of millions is more important than any singular nominee", is it?

So give a loaded answer to a non-loaded question?

[EnochRoot]

Administrations can do multiple things at once. I don’t imagine many of us work on one project at a time. If the choice were Tanden or $15/hr somehow and they chose the latter than get the pitchforks. But I imagine Biden and the Dems would gleefully reject her 100-0 if it was the quid pro quo for a minimum wage deal.

But this is too much of a response to the question. "He's also pushing back against Jill's insistence on 2% milk. The president has a lot on his plate, and room for more. Next question..."

[Steve of phpBB]

Well ... its not a loaded question if the answer is "of course a policy that would affect tens of millions is more important than any singular nominee", is it?

It's not just about how important the policy is, but how possible it would be to persuade a Senator to change his or her mind, and what it would take to make that happen.

Because Neera Tanden versus another liberal at OMB is really not that big of a deal, it's probably more within the realm of possibility that a GOP senator or two could be persuaded to vote for her. There's no way any Republican will agree to a nationwide minimum wage that's 20% above its previous all-time high and significantly higher than countries like Germany, France, New Zealand, the Netherlands, etc.

[P.D.X.]

I guess this is where we compare minimum wage rates with countries whose workers aren't paying out of pocket for healthcare.