Random Politics

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt » Mon Aug 24, 2020 5:14 pm

"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:22 pm

Anyone who embraced and repeated the “Bernie bro” nonsense needs to take a look at the Markey/Kennedy stuff today and decide if maybe you got played a bit.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie » Mon Aug 24, 2020 7:12 pm

What the fuck is it with Massachusetts and politicians named Kennedy?

Fuck that state.

And fuck Pelosi for endorsing him. Hypocrite asshole.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by The Sybian » Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:13 pm

DSafetyGuy wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:55 pm
The replies...
Yeah, this is my favorite:

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Re: Random Politics

Post by sancarlos » Tue Aug 25, 2020 6:47 pm

"What a bunch of pedantic pricks." - sybian

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie » Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:53 pm

FUCK THE KENNEDYS.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by govmentchedda » Tue Sep 01, 2020 8:56 pm

Fuck yeah
I took a two hour nap and cried during parks and Rec. it was awesome and terrifying.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Tue Sep 01, 2020 9:27 pm

Joe Can’tedy III.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Giff » Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:17 am

Nice!
Muh.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie » Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:53 am

mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie » Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:23 am

I didn't realize it violates a city rule still in San Francisco. (I'm able to get a haircut in New Mexico, so this would never occur to me.)

But yea, not a good look.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt » Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:21 pm

"But her hair do" could become 2020's "But her e-mails."
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Re: Random Politics

Post by sancarlos » Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:24 pm

Johnnie wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:23 am
I didn't realize it violates a city rule still in San Francisco. (I'm able to get a haircut in New Mexico, so this would never occur to me.)

But yea, not a good look.

It varies county by county. I’m in San Mateo county (just south of SF county). And activities like salons have closed and opened again two different times in my area.

This will piss people off enough that she might only get 70% of the votes in her next election instead of 80%.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:41 pm

Pruitt wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:21 pm
"But her hair do" could become 2020's "But her e-mails."
Your lips to god's ears.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by brian » Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm

Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:52 pm

Check again.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:00 pm

brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm
Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Just to play devil's advocate, let's say she does. To a moderate republican for X years until next election, is it 6? And then someone who is not Nancy Pelosi retakes the seat. Worst thing ever?
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Re: Random Politics

Post by brian » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:06 pm

BSF21 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:00 pm
brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm
Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Just to play devil's advocate, let's say she does. To a moderate republican for X years until next election, is it 6? And then someone who is not Nancy Pelosi retakes the seat. Worst thing ever?
There's two Dems running. I forgot that CA does that. Still, I don't have a major issue with Nancy Pelosi.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:13 pm

brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm
Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Not in her district - but the GOP has tried to demonize her repeatedly. Trump's posted two tweets about this and retweeted another one.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:23 pm

brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:06 pm
There's two Dems running. I forgot that CA does that. Still, I don't have a major issue with Nancy Pelosi.
Fuck that. Explain or defend publicly chastising AOC et all for supporting leftists who had primaried incumbent Dems then endorsing Kennedy.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by brian » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pm

She works for the whole party, not just the left-most faction. I agree the Democrats aren't as far left as I'd like but she makes a useful foil for Trump. If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Nonlinear FC » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:41 pm

I've been relatively OK with Pelosi, but the shit up in MASS is pretty inexcusable to me. WTF with going after Markey? Total bullshit.

BTW, the fact that Neal wasn't knocked off by Morse up in Wester MA is a bummer. Neal is a corporate piece of shit.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by brian » Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:47 pm

Nonlinear FC wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:41 pm
I've been relatively OK with Pelosi, but the shit up in MASS is pretty inexcusable to me. WTF with going after Markey? Total bullshit.

BTW, the fact that Neal wasn't knocked off by Morse up in Wester MA is a bummer. Neal is a corporate piece of shit.
Agree on both.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm

brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pm
If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:15 pm

It'll never happen, but I'd love to see AOC move to SF and successfully primary her. That would be hilarious.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:17 pm

mister d wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pm
If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:31 pm

BSF21 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:17 pm
mister d wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pm
If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
"anything remotely seen as progressiveness." JFC. Yeah, all the bills the Dem House passed this year are identical to what McConnell has allowed.

Pelosi pushed through the CARES Act, which was so effective it appears to have lowered the poverty rate - during the pandemic. Then she pushed through the HEROES Act.

But yeah, she's not progressive.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:38 pm

The vote on the CARES Act was 419-6 in the House and 96-0 in the Senate, so that’s a strange example to use of Pelosi “pushing through” legislation that would not otherwise be law.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:42 pm

I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm

If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by brian » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm

She's an absolute monster and has to be stopped at any cost. Totally a pedo.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 » Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:53 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:31 pm
BSF21 wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:17 pm
mister d wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pm
If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
"anything remotely seen as progressiveness." JFC. Yeah, all the bills the Dem House passed this year are identical to what McConnell has allowed.

Pelosi pushed through the CARES Act, which was so effective it appears to have lowered the poverty rate - during the pandemic. Then she pushed through the HEROES Act.

But yeah, she's not progressive.
No. She’s not a progressive. That’s my exact point. You know, that there’s this political spectrum and she falls on the “been there too long and likes things the way they are so let’s not upset the apple cart” Democrat side. I don’t care for it.

But yeah, I basically think she’s identical to McConnel like I said up there.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:01 pm

mister d wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:42 pm
I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
I'm not arguing that she's progressive because she hasn't done literally nothing. I think it's more accurate to say that you are defining her as non-progressive because she hasn't done literally everything. The CARES Act, like the ACA, Dodd-Frank, and countless other bills and laws, wasn't simply "not literally nothing." They were both massive progressive achievements - the problem was that they weren't literally everything.

Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm
If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.
The bill got all those votes *after* McConnell and Trump were forced to agree on it, which was *after* Pelosi held firm and forced them all to agree to supposedly non-progressive things like massive employment subsidies and massive unemployment insurance benefits, both of which kept millions out of poverty.

Those benefits went to small businesses and low-income tenants and people stuck with healthcare bills. But if you think she could have gotten more, can you tell me which 51 Senators would have voted for more?
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:01 pm
mister d wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:42 pm
I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
I'm not arguing that she's progressive because she hasn't done literally nothing. I think it's more accurate to say that you are defining her as non-progressive because she hasn't done literally everything. The CARES Act, like the ACA, Dodd-Frank, and countless other bills and laws, wasn't simply "not literally nothing." They were both massive progressive achievements - the problem was that they weren't literally everything.

Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm
If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.
The bill got all those votes *after* McConnell and Trump were forced to agree on it, which was *after* Pelosi held firm and forced them all to agree to supposedly non-progressive things like massive employment subsidies and massive unemployment insurance benefits, both of which kept millions out of poverty.

Those benefits went to small businesses and low-income tenants and people stuck with healthcare bills. But if you think she could have gotten more, can you tell me which 51 Senators would have voted for more?
Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:06 pm

Or business distribution oversight beyond media investigations and public shaming. Or an end-date tied to economic conditions and not the calendar.
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:12 pm

Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm
Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.

Anyway, I'll name one who was not going to agree to any more - Mitch McConnell.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:15 pm

Think the salon will agree to apologize to her, Steve?
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Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:17 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:12 pm
Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm
Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.
Basic logic? If you get a surplus of 45 votes beyond what’s needed to pass, it seems highly unlikely that you couldn’t have added a single thing more without losing all 45. Even if you think a veto-proof majority is needed, you still have 29 votes to spare.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:23 pm

Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:17 pm
Steve of phpBB wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:12 pm
Joe K wrote:
Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm
Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.
Basic logic? If you get a surplus of 45 votes beyond what’s needed to pass, it seems highly unlikely that you couldn’t have added a single thing more without losing all 45. Even if you think a veto-proof majority is needed, you still have 29 votes to spare.
But that's not how Congress works. McConnell controls what comes up for a vote, and he doesn't let a bill come up for a vote unless he either wants to or has to. Then, once it comes up for a vote, basically everyone votes for it because it's popular and no one wants to go on record as voting against pandemic relief

The bill that McConnell was going with wasn't nearly as good or generous - or progressive - as the one that Pelosi forced him to accept. Could she have forced him to accept more? You're arguing she could have, that McConnell would have been willing to allow a more progressive bill. I've been following McConnell for years, and I've never seen him do anything to suggest he'd agree to anything more progressive than the CARES Act.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.

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Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K » Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:31 pm

So you’re assuming that Pelosi is such an adept negotiator that she got the maximum amount of concessions from McConnell, even though by your admission “no one wants to go on the record as voting against pandemic relief” and the bill passed 96-0. Agree to disagree.

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