Random Politics

Okay . . . let's try this again.

Moderators: Shirley, Sabo, brian, rass, DaveInSeattle

User avatar
Pruitt
The Dude
Posts: 18105
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:02 am
Location: North Shore of Lake Ontario

Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt »

"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Anyone who embraced and repeated the “Bernie bro” nonsense needs to take a look at the Markey/Kennedy stuff today and decide if maybe you got played a bit.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
Johnnie
The Dude
Posts: 16730
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 pm
Location: TUCSON, BITCH!

Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie »

What the fuck is it with Massachusetts and politicians named Kennedy?

Fuck that state.

And fuck Pelosi for endorsing him. Hypocrite asshole.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
User avatar
The Sybian
The Dude
Posts: 18865
Joined: Tue Mar 19, 2013 10:36 am
Location: Working in the Crap Part of Jersey

Re: Random Politics

Post by The Sybian »

DSafetyGuy wrote: Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:55 pm The replies...
Yeah, this is my favorite:

An honest to God cult of personality - formed around a failed steak salesman.
-Pruitt
User avatar
sancarlos
The Dude
Posts: 18060
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:46 pm
Location: NorCal via Colorado

Re: Random Politics

Post by sancarlos »

"What a bunch of pedantic pricks." - sybian
Johnnie
The Dude
Posts: 16730
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 pm
Location: TUCSON, BITCH!

Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie »

FUCK THE KENNEDYS.

mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
User avatar
govmentchedda
The Dude
Posts: 12672
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 4:36 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by govmentchedda »

Fuck yeah
Until everything is less insane, I'm mixing weed with wine.
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Joe Can’tedy III.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
User avatar
Giff
The Dude
Posts: 10794
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2013 3:26 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Giff »

Nice!
well this is gonna be someone's new signature - bronto
Johnnie
The Dude
Posts: 16730
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 pm
Location: TUCSON, BITCH!

Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie »

mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
Johnnie
The Dude
Posts: 16730
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 pm
Location: TUCSON, BITCH!

Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie »

I didn't realize it violates a city rule still in San Francisco. (I'm able to get a haircut in New Mexico, so this would never occur to me.)

But yea, not a good look.

mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
User avatar
Pruitt
The Dude
Posts: 18105
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:02 am
Location: North Shore of Lake Ontario

Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt »

"But her hair do" could become 2020's "But her e-mails."
"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."
User avatar
sancarlos
The Dude
Posts: 18060
Joined: Fri Mar 15, 2013 1:46 pm
Location: NorCal via Colorado

Re: Random Politics

Post by sancarlos »

Johnnie wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 11:23 am I didn't realize it violates a city rule still in San Francisco. (I'm able to get a haircut in New Mexico, so this would never occur to me.)

But yea, not a good look.

It varies county by county. I’m in San Mateo county (just south of SF county). And activities like salons have closed and opened again two different times in my area.

This will piss people off enough that she might only get 70% of the votes in her next election instead of 80%.
"What a bunch of pedantic pricks." - sybian
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Pruitt wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:21 pm "But her hair do" could become 2020's "But her e-mails."
Your lips to god's ears.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
User avatar
brian
The Dude
Posts: 27740
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 am
Location: Downtown Las Vegas

Re: Random Politics

Post by brian »

Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Bandwagon fan of the 2023 STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS!
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Check again.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
User avatar
BSF21
The Dude
Posts: 5261
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:08 pm
Location: Playing one off the Monster

Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 »

brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Just to play devil's advocate, let's say she does. To a moderate republican for X years until next election, is it 6? And then someone who is not Nancy Pelosi retakes the seat. Worst thing ever?
Dances with Wolves (1) - BSF

"This place was rockin'," said BSF21.

"There is nothing ever uncommon about BSF21."
User avatar
brian
The Dude
Posts: 27740
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 am
Location: Downtown Las Vegas

Re: Random Politics

Post by brian »

BSF21 wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:00 pm
brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Just to play devil's advocate, let's say she does. To a moderate republican for X years until next election, is it 6? And then someone who is not Nancy Pelosi retakes the seat. Worst thing ever?
There's two Dems running. I forgot that CA does that. Still, I don't have a major issue with Nancy Pelosi.
Bandwagon fan of the 2023 STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS!
User avatar
Pruitt
The Dude
Posts: 18105
Joined: Tue Jun 04, 2013 10:02 am
Location: North Shore of Lake Ontario

Re: Random Politics

Post by Pruitt »

brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 12:44 pm Yes, let's hope a Republican beats Nancy Pelosi in one of the most liberal districts in the country. That will bode well.
Not in her district - but the GOP has tried to demonize her repeatedly. Trump's posted two tweets about this and retweeted another one.
"beautiful, with an exotic-yet-familiar facial structure and an arresting gaze."
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:06 pmThere's two Dems running. I forgot that CA does that. Still, I don't have a major issue with Nancy Pelosi.
Fuck that. Explain or defend publicly chastising AOC et all for supporting leftists who had primaried incumbent Dems then endorsing Kennedy.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
User avatar
brian
The Dude
Posts: 27740
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 am
Location: Downtown Las Vegas

Re: Random Politics

Post by brian »

She works for the whole party, not just the left-most faction. I agree the Democrats aren't as far left as I'd like but she makes a useful foil for Trump. If she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Bandwagon fan of the 2023 STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS!
User avatar
Nonlinear FC
The Dude
Posts: 10739
Joined: Mon Apr 01, 2013 2:09 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Nonlinear FC »

I've been relatively OK with Pelosi, but the shit up in MASS is pretty inexcusable to me. WTF with going after Markey? Total bullshit.

BTW, the fact that Neal wasn't knocked off by Morse up in Wester MA is a bummer. Neal is a corporate piece of shit.
You can lead a horse to fish, but you can't fish out a horse.
User avatar
brian
The Dude
Posts: 27740
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 am
Location: Downtown Las Vegas

Re: Random Politics

Post by brian »

Nonlinear FC wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:41 pm I've been relatively OK with Pelosi, but the shit up in MASS is pretty inexcusable to me. WTF with going after Markey? Total bullshit.

BTW, the fact that Neal wasn't knocked off by Morse up in Wester MA is a bummer. Neal is a corporate piece of shit.
Agree on both.
Bandwagon fan of the 2023 STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS!
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pmIf she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
Johnnie
The Dude
Posts: 16730
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 7:31 pm
Location: TUCSON, BITCH!

Re: Random Politics

Post by Johnnie »

It'll never happen, but I'd love to see AOC move to SF and successfully primary her. That would be hilarious.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
User avatar
BSF21
The Dude
Posts: 5261
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:08 pm
Location: Playing one off the Monster

Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 »

mister d wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pmIf she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
Dances with Wolves (1) - BSF

"This place was rockin'," said BSF21.

"There is nothing ever uncommon about BSF21."
User avatar
Steve of phpBB
The Dude
Posts: 8434
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:44 am
Location: Feeling gravity's pull

Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB »

BSF21 wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:17 pm
mister d wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pmIf she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
"anything remotely seen as progressiveness." JFC. Yeah, all the bills the Dem House passed this year are identical to what McConnell has allowed.

Pelosi pushed through the CARES Act, which was so effective it appears to have lowered the poverty rate - during the pandemic. Then she pushed through the HEROES Act.

But yeah, she's not progressive.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Joe K
Walter Sobchak
Posts: 4754
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:37 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K »

The vote on the CARES Act was 419-6 in the House and 96-0 in the Senate, so that’s a strange example to use of Pelosi “pushing through” legislation that would not otherwise be law.
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
Joe K
Walter Sobchak
Posts: 4754
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:37 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K »

If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.
User avatar
brian
The Dude
Posts: 27740
Joined: Mon Mar 18, 2013 10:52 am
Location: Downtown Las Vegas

Re: Random Politics

Post by brian »

She's an absolute monster and has to be stopped at any cost. Totally a pedo.
Bandwagon fan of the 2023 STANLEY CUP CHAMPIONS!
User avatar
BSF21
The Dude
Posts: 5261
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 2:08 pm
Location: Playing one off the Monster

Re: Random Politics

Post by BSF21 »

Steve of phpBB wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:31 pm
BSF21 wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:17 pm
mister d wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:11 pm
brian wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 1:38 pmIf she gets beat in her district, who is the next Speaker going to be? Because it isn't going to be AOC or Ayanna Pressley as much as you'd like that to be so.
Doesn't overly matter; Pelosi has become an active roadblock in the party even inching left. And a lot of very wise people here have told me that just because I can't have my first choice, it doesn't mean I shouldn't strive for a lesser choice that's better than the current situation ; )
That's my problem. It's not like she's ideologically worse than McConnel but she's a hell of a similar politician in the grand scheme of anything remotely seen as progressiveness.
"anything remotely seen as progressiveness." JFC. Yeah, all the bills the Dem House passed this year are identical to what McConnell has allowed.

Pelosi pushed through the CARES Act, which was so effective it appears to have lowered the poverty rate - during the pandemic. Then she pushed through the HEROES Act.

But yeah, she's not progressive.
No. She’s not a progressive. That’s my exact point. You know, that there’s this political spectrum and she falls on the “been there too long and likes things the way they are so let’s not upset the apple cart” Democrat side. I don’t care for it.

But yeah, I basically think she’s identical to McConnel like I said up there.
Dances with Wolves (1) - BSF

"This place was rockin'," said BSF21.

"There is nothing ever uncommon about BSF21."
User avatar
Steve of phpBB
The Dude
Posts: 8434
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:44 am
Location: Feeling gravity's pull

Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB »

mister d wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:42 pm I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
I'm not arguing that she's progressive because she hasn't done literally nothing. I think it's more accurate to say that you are defining her as non-progressive because she hasn't done literally everything. The CARES Act, like the ACA, Dodd-Frank, and countless other bills and laws, wasn't simply "not literally nothing." They were both massive progressive achievements - the problem was that they weren't literally everything.

Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.
The bill got all those votes *after* McConnell and Trump were forced to agree on it, which was *after* Pelosi held firm and forced them all to agree to supposedly non-progressive things like massive employment subsidies and massive unemployment insurance benefits, both of which kept millions out of poverty.

Those benefits went to small businesses and low-income tenants and people stuck with healthcare bills. But if you think she could have gotten more, can you tell me which 51 Senators would have voted for more?
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Joe K
Walter Sobchak
Posts: 4754
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:37 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K »

Steve of phpBB wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:01 pm
mister d wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:42 pm I'll never understand your "this person hasn't done literally nothing as a Democrat so how can you complain" as a rebuttal strategy. Just unbelievably low standards. And it could, again, very easily be used to prove I should be all-in on Romney.
I'm not arguing that she's progressive because she hasn't done literally nothing. I think it's more accurate to say that you are defining her as non-progressive because she hasn't done literally everything. The CARES Act, like the ACA, Dodd-Frank, and countless other bills and laws, wasn't simply "not literally nothing." They were both massive progressive achievements - the problem was that they weren't literally everything.

Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 3:52 pm If anything, Pelosi dropped the ball on the CARES Act by not getting more relief for vulnerable groups like small businesses, low-income tenants, and people stuck with healthcare bills. The fact that the bill got 419 votes in the House and 96 in the Senate would seem to indicate that Pelosi had a lot more room to work with both her own caucus and with the Senate GOP.
The bill got all those votes *after* McConnell and Trump were forced to agree on it, which was *after* Pelosi held firm and forced them all to agree to supposedly non-progressive things like massive employment subsidies and massive unemployment insurance benefits, both of which kept millions out of poverty.

Those benefits went to small businesses and low-income tenants and people stuck with healthcare bills. But if you think she could have gotten more, can you tell me which 51 Senators would have voted for more?
Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Or business distribution oversight beyond media investigations and public shaming. Or an end-date tied to economic conditions and not the calendar.
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
User avatar
Steve of phpBB
The Dude
Posts: 8434
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:44 am
Location: Feeling gravity's pull

Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB »

Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.

Anyway, I'll name one who was not going to agree to any more - Mitch McConnell.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
User avatar
mister d
The Dude
Posts: 29045
Joined: Tue Mar 12, 2013 8:15 am

Re: Random Politics

Post by mister d »

Think the salon will agree to apologize to her, Steve?
Johnnie wrote: Sat Sep 10, 2022 8:13 pmOh shit, you just reminded me about toilet paper.
Joe K
Walter Sobchak
Posts: 4754
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:37 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K »

Steve of phpBB wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:12 pm
Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.
Basic logic? If you get a surplus of 45 votes beyond what’s needed to pass, it seems highly unlikely that you couldn’t have added a single thing more without losing all 45. Even if you think a veto-proof majority is needed, you still have 29 votes to spare.
User avatar
Steve of phpBB
The Dude
Posts: 8434
Joined: Mon Mar 11, 2013 10:44 am
Location: Feeling gravity's pull

Re: Random Politics

Post by Steve of phpBB »

Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:17 pm
Steve of phpBB wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:12 pm
Joe K wrote: Wed Sep 02, 2020 4:04 pm Why don’t you instead name the 45 Senators who voted for
the bill that were at their absolute breaking point and wouldn’t have agreed to any further relief efforts?
You're asserting she could've gotten more. I'm simply asking for the basis of that assertion.
Basic logic? If you get a surplus of 45 votes beyond what’s needed to pass, it seems highly unlikely that you couldn’t have added a single thing more without losing all 45. Even if you think a veto-proof majority is needed, you still have 29 votes to spare.
But that's not how Congress works. McConnell controls what comes up for a vote, and he doesn't let a bill come up for a vote unless he either wants to or has to. Then, once it comes up for a vote, basically everyone votes for it because it's popular and no one wants to go on record as voting against pandemic relief

The bill that McConnell was going with wasn't nearly as good or generous - or progressive - as the one that Pelosi forced him to accept. Could she have forced him to accept more? You're arguing she could have, that McConnell would have been willing to allow a more progressive bill. I've been following McConnell for years, and I've never seen him do anything to suggest he'd agree to anything more progressive than the CARES Act.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Joe K
Walter Sobchak
Posts: 4754
Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 4:37 pm

Re: Random Politics

Post by Joe K »

So you’re assuming that Pelosi is such an adept negotiator that she got the maximum amount of concessions from McConnell, even though by your admission “no one wants to go on the record as voting against pandemic relief” and the bill passed 96-0. Agree to disagree.
Post Reply