The OFFICIAL Craft Beer Thread

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 3:51 pm

I have a hard time imagining a nitro IPA, just doesn't seem like it would work. Curious to try one, but expectations will be set low. Left Hand Nitro Milk Stout is good, not sure I've tried any other nitros.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:38 pm

I love nitros, but it's not really a fit for the IPA style. Had a nice IPA on cask last week, but it was English rather than American style, which makes a difference.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 4:53 pm

Good point. I forget which one it was, but I did once have an english IPA that I didn't like upgraded to "that's not so bad" on cask. But that's probably because english IPAs shouldn't really count as IPAs anymore.

Post by **Sabo** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 6:59 pm

Boddington's and Old Speckled Hen are pretty good English nitro ales, but I think they're regular pale ales and not IPAs.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Wed Nov 18, 2015 7:06 pm

ok, thanks for the info. I've drank many cans of Guinness and Boddington's over the years (rocket widget!). So, yes, to the degree I've had them, I guess I've enjoyed Nitros.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:35 pm

Sabo wrote:Boddington's and Old Speckled Hen are pretty good English nitro ales, but I think they're regular pale ales and not IPAs.

Good point. I used to drink a lot of Boddingtons in my bar going days. Used to like Old Speckled Hen, too. Meaning, I've had many nitros without realizing it. Thinking back to Boddington's, I don't think I'd like it much if I had it again. Curious to see how accurate my taste memory is.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:39 pm

That's Newcastle for me. One of my initial bridge beers which I bet now would taste really gross to me.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:43 pm

mister d wrote:That's Newcastle for me. One of my initial bridge beers which I bet now would taste really gross to me.

Totally agree, especially in a bottle. Always skunked. Bass was a big one for me in college, maybe just after I turned 21. Haven't had it in forever, but my memory is like a weakly flavored cream cheese. Funny looking back at the beers that seemed high end back in the day. Stella, Bass, Becks, basically anything foreign that wasn't Amstel. But we had this discussion already.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Thu Nov 19, 2015 2:46 pm

The Sybian wrote:
mister d wrote:That's Newcastle for me. One of my initial bridge beers which I bet now would taste really gross to me.
Totally agree, especially in a bottle. Always skunked. Bass was a big one for me in college, maybe just after I turned 21. Haven't had it in forever, but my memory is like a weakly flavored cream cheese. Funny looking back at the beers that seemed high end back in the day. Stella, Bass, Becks, basically anything foreign that wasn't Amstel. But we had this discussion already.

Agreed as well re: Newcastle. There was a Mexican joint in downtown Gainesville that had the coldest, freshest Newcastle tap. It went so well with the spicy food. Out of the bottle it sucks. Looking back, I bet that early Newcastle and Mexican combo led to me always going for Dos Equis Amber or Negra Modelo when I have Mexican food.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Wed Nov 25, 2015 11:07 pm

Totally psyched to get Dechutes Chasin' Freshies. This batch made with lemon drop hops, and trays like a really good macro. Totally underwhelming compared to the past offerings.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 6:59 am

It's my birthday today, and my son gave me a great gift - a fine selection of Ontario beers and tickets to a craft beer fest in January.

6:30 in the morning and this has already been an awesome day!

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 9:37 am

Pruitt wrote:It's my birthday today, and my son gave me a great gift - a fine selection of Ontario beers and tickets to a craft beer fest in January.

6:30 in the morning and this has already been an awesome day!

Happy birthday! It's also my father's birthday today. He says all great people are born in November so I suppose he's onto something.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:09 am

BSF21 wrote:
Pruitt wrote:It's my birthday today, and my son gave me a great gift - a fine selection of Ontario beers and tickets to a craft beer fest in January.

6:30 in the morning and this has already been an awesome day!

Happy birthday! It's also my father's birthday today. He says all great people are born in November so I suppose he's onto something.

Many great fathers have their birthday today - your Dad, me and Sean Kemp.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 10:15 am

Happy birthday guys

Post by **brian** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 12:22 pm

It's my dog's birthday today too.

bfj · Post by **bfj** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 1:48 pm

I'm thankful for Brown Shugga today. Tasty stuff.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 3:10 pm

Had my first two Surly beers, Furious and Overrated, and I'm not sure if it's the beer or them both being a bit on the old side of drinkable, but neither blew my dick off. Aside from Zombie Dust, which is elite-elite, the top Midwestern beers I've had have all disappointed to some extent.

Post by **Sabo** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 9:28 pm

mister d wrote:Had my first two Surly beers, Furious and Overrated, and I'm not sure if it's the beer or them both being a bit on the old side of drinkable, but neither blew my dick off. Aside from Zombie Dust, which is elite-elite, the top Midwestern beers I've had have all disappointed to some extent.

Even Great Lakes Brewing Co.'s Edmund Fitzgerald?

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Thu Nov 26, 2015 11:17 pm

The Edmund is decent at best.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Fri Nov 27, 2015 12:03 am

mister d wrote:Had my first two Surly beers,

The Darkness is what you want.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Fri Nov 27, 2015 7:52 pm

I should have clarified IPA/PA category. Edmund and Blackout are tremendous.

Post by **brian** » Fri Nov 27, 2015 8:07 pm

Shorts Huma Lupa Licious is my favorite Midwestern IPA these days.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Fri Nov 27, 2015 11:08 pm

mister d wrote:I should have clarified IPA/PA category. Edmund and Blackout are tremendous.

I saw Blackout just dropped. Fantastic stout. I think Edmund is a great beer, AB be damned!

I decided not to bother looking for BCBS this year, protesting the circus it has become. Reading about numerous stores around the country with people lining up at 9:00 pm on Thanksgiving for the stores' opening the following morning. This year they have a varietal called "Rare," which people are selling single bottles on Ebay for $300. The MSRP is $60, and people posting sales prices between $80 - $150 at stores. For one fucking bottle! It is aged in barrels previously used for aging Heaven Hill 30 year, or some shit. I was passed by a Shop Rite liquor store, then police barricades for the 5K my son was running, forced me to turn around and pass the store. Since it was fate and I was guaranteed to miss the start of the race due to having to park 2 fucking miles away, I popped in and bought a bottle. Then made my parents buy me another on their way out. I've read that most of NJ is getting it in next week or the week after, Last year we got it several weeks late for some reason.

Post by **Sabo** » Sun Nov 29, 2015 5:47 pm

A_B wrote:The Edmund is decent at best.

... says the guy wearing a mass-produced Samuel Adams hat.

devilfluff · Post by **devilfluff** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 11:58 am

The Sybian wrote:
mister d wrote:I should have clarified IPA/PA category. Edmund and Blackout are tremendous.
I saw Blackout just dropped. Fantastic stout. I think Edmund is a great beer, AB be damned!

I decided not to bother looking for BCBS this year, protesting the circus it has become. Reading about numerous stores around the country with people lining up at 9:00 pm on Thanksgiving for the stores' opening the following morning. This year they have a varietal called "Rare," which people are selling single bottles on Ebay for $300. The MSRP is $60, and people posting sales prices between $80 - $150 at stores. For one fucking bottle! It is aged in barrels previously used for aging Heaven Hill 30 year, or some shit. I was passed by a Shop Rite liquor store, then police barricades for the 5K my son was running, forced me to turn around and pass the store. Since it was fate and I was guaranteed to miss the start of the race due to having to park 2 fucking miles away, I popped in and bought a bottle. Then made my parents buy me another on their way out. I've read that most of NJ is getting it in next week or the week after, Last year we got it several weeks late for some reason.

I waited 20 minutes at Total Wine in Claymont, DE, then walked out with a case of BCBS

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:20 pm

devilfluff wrote:
The Sybian wrote:
mister d wrote:I should have clarified IPA/PA category. Edmund and Blackout are tremendous.
I saw Blackout just dropped. Fantastic stout. I think Edmund is a great beer, AB be damned!

I decided not to bother looking for BCBS this year, protesting the circus it has become. Reading about numerous stores around the country with people lining up at 9:00 pm on Thanksgiving for the stores' opening the following morning. This year they have a varietal called "Rare," which people are selling single bottles on Ebay for $300. The MSRP is $60, and people posting sales prices between $80 - $150 at stores. For one fucking bottle! It is aged in barrels previously used for aging Heaven Hill 30 year, or some shit. I was passed by a Shop Rite liquor store, then police barricades for the 5K my son was running, forced me to turn around and pass the store. Since it was fate and I was guaranteed to miss the start of the race due to having to park 2 fucking miles away, I popped in and bought a bottle. Then made my parents buy me another on their way out. I've read that most of NJ is getting it in next week or the week after, Last year we got it several weeks late for some reason.
I waited 20 minutes at Total Wine in Claymont, DE, then walked out with a case of BCBS

Damn, how many cases did they get? I'm surprised Total Wine didn't limit how many you could take? Did you line up Friday before the store opened? I don't get why people in NYC camp out, when BCBS is supposedly on the shelves for months in some places. Maybe they are just lining up for the variants. The Whole Foods stores in Manhattan apparently got mountains of the whole line. People saying they still had cases Sunday night. I stopped into Gary's in Madison this morning, he said they are expecting it on Friday. He said their wholesaler, who services most of this area, closes on Black Friday, which is why this area doesn't get it on time. Other regions get them earlier and some stores don't wait to release.

Carton had 2 big releases last week Epitome black IPA and SS Yirgacheffe. Both in cans, but extremely small quantities. I had Epitome on tap, and it is the best black IPA I've tried. I love black IPAs, and nothing was even close.

I picked up some Stone Xocoveza, which is one of them Mexican hot chocolate deals, a stout with cocoa nibs, chile peppers, vanilla, cinnamon, nutmeg. Love these, look forward to trying this one. Also picked up a Big Bad Baptist.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 3:49 pm

The Sybian wrote:Also picked up a Big Bad Baptist.

Love that beer. Epic makes really nice beers.

Not sure how far they distribute, but if you can find Copper Kettle's Mexican Chocolate Stout, it blows Stone away.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:05 pm

Rush2112 wrote:
The Sybian wrote:Also picked up a Big Bad Baptist.
Love that beer. Epic makes really nice beers.

Not sure how far they distribute, but if you can find Copper Kettle's Mexican Chocolate Stout, it blows Stone away.

Can't say I've ever seen Copper Kettle. Nothing can top Westbrook's Mexican Cake. Not possible.

devilfluff · Post by **devilfluff** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 4:17 pm

The Sybian wrote:
devilfluff wrote:
The Sybian wrote:
mister d wrote:I should have clarified IPA/PA category. Edmund and Blackout are tremendous.
I saw Blackout just dropped. Fantastic stout. I think Edmund is a great beer, AB be damned!

I decided not to bother looking for BCBS this year, protesting the circus it has become. Reading about numerous stores around the country with people lining up at 9:00 pm on Thanksgiving for the stores' opening the following morning. This year they have a varietal called "Rare," which people are selling single bottles on Ebay for $300. The MSRP is $60, and people posting sales prices between $80 - $150 at stores. For one fucking bottle! It is aged in barrels previously used for aging Heaven Hill 30 year, or some shit. I was passed by a Shop Rite liquor store, then police barricades for the 5K my son was running, forced me to turn around and pass the store. Since it was fate and I was guaranteed to miss the start of the race due to having to park 2 fucking miles away, I popped in and bought a bottle. Then made my parents buy me another on their way out. I've read that most of NJ is getting it in next week or the week after, Last year we got it several weeks late for some reason.
I waited 20 minutes at Total Wine in Claymont, DE, then walked out with a case of BCBS
Damn, how many cases did they get? I'm surprised Total Wine didn't limit how many you could take? Did you line up Friday before the store opened? I don't get why people in NYC camp out, when BCBS is supposedly on the shelves for months in some places. Maybe they are just lining up for the variants. The Whole Foods stores in Manhattan apparently got mountains of the whole line. People saying they still had cases Sunday night. I stopped into Gary's in Madison this morning, he said they are expecting it on Friday. He said their wholesaler, who services most of this area, closes on Black Friday, which is why this area doesn't get it on time. Other regions get them earlier and some stores don't wait to release.

Carton had 2 big releases last week Epitome black IPA and SS Yirgacheffe. Both in cans, but extremely small quantities. I had Epitome on tap, and it is the best black IPA I've tried. I love black IPAs, and nothing was even close.

I picked up some Stone Xocoveza, which is one of them Mexican hot chocolate deals, a stout with cocoa nibs, chile peppers, vanilla, cinnamon, nutmeg. Love these, look forward to trying this one. Also picked up a Big Bad Baptist.

I got to TW at 7:40am. They open at 8. They probably got 60 or 70 cases of base stout. It was 6 per person, but my wife is a trooper.

I swung by my local's big Black Friday blowout afterward. They open at 9, and I rolled up about 2 minutes before they opened. Got 2 4 packs of Epitome, a bottle of Avery Rumkin, a bottle of Allagash Farm to Face, and a bottle of Velvet Merkin.

Was a successful trip in my opinion.

Also, this year's Xocoveza is awesome. One of my favorite beers released in the last couple months.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Mon Nov 30, 2015 8:24 pm

devilfluff wrote: I got to TW at 7:40am. They open at 8. They probably got 60 or 70 cases of base stout. It was 6 per person, but my wife is a trooper.

I swung by my local's big Black Friday blowout afterward. They open at 9, and I rolled up about 2 minutes before they opened. Got 2 4 packs of Epitome, a bottle of Avery Rumkin, a bottle of Allagash Farm to Face, and a bottle of Velvet Merkin.

Was a successful trip in my opinion.

Also, this year's Xocoveza is awesome. One of my favorite beers released in the last couple months.

Damn. The TW here got a handful of cases last year, one coffee. Buy Rite got two cases base stout, one case barleywine. They hate NJ. I put my name in for a Velvet Merkin raffle at Buy Rite. They only expected a few bottles and didn't want to deal with the hassle. I didn't ask anywhere else I've been. Not sure if that is a hide in the back of the store beer, or if it hits shelves. Epitome was hidden at Joe Canals, one can limit, and gone in a few hours. I can't keep up with all the releases, and don't know when there are bound to be hidden beers.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Tue Dec 01, 2015 2:55 pm

Just got a call from Gary's, that they got the base stout this afternoon, limit of 3 bottles. They must have gotten a sizable shipment, as I've never seen anything other than one bottle. The beer guy told me yesterday they were doing a lottery, so maybe I was selected. Either way, the guy on the phone said he is saving me 3 bottles.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:46 pm

http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... -nbev.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:37 pm

mister d wrote:http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... -nbev.html

Michael Lalonde, president of Oregon-based craft brewery Deschutes, said Grey Eagle Distributing of St. Louis dropped Deschutes' brands last week because it "had to make a choice to go with the incentive program or stay with craft."

Well, feck. That's ominous. I was just enjoying a Deschutes last night, and I'd hate it if their shelf space was eliminated in favor of InBev. That incentive program is particularly evil, because it doesn't reward distributors on the basis of InBev volume, but rather on percentage of the total they handle.

Post by **brian** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:38 pm

mister d wrote:http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... -nbev.html

You already see this a lot in Saint Louis (perhaps unsurprisingly) though there's also a lot of places that flat out refuse to to have any A-B products on tap, perhaps as some kind of protest.

Post by **brian** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:39 pm

(But that said, in most places I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's supply and demand. Unless you're in a state where the laws restrict beer distribution (which isn't impossible, but isn't super common) someone will pop up to serve the market that wants to be served.)

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:42 pm

brian wrote:
mister d wrote:http://www.bizjournals.com/stlouis/morn ... -nbev.html
You already see this a lot in Saint Louis (perhaps unsurprisingly) though there's also a lot of places that flat out refuse to to have any A-B products on tap, perhaps as some kind of protest.

I was in Wentzville, MO for Thanksgiving and while we were at the mega grocer I thought I'd pick up some good beer. Maybe it was because it was Thanksgiving morning, but about 98% of what was available was macro brews. I bought their last sixer of Boulevard and their second last of Schlafly (and yes, I know they are both owned by larger organizations), but other than that it was all Bud/Miller/Coors, etc.

Post by **brian** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 5:47 pm

Never been to Wentzville, but I don't think that's out of the norm for a lot of small towns in the midwest, especially states without a strong micro brewing culture. Ironically, Missouri is a little late to the game there although it's better and better every time I go. Made it to the Four Hands brewhouse for the first time last week and was really impressed. Had some of their beers before, but only what was available at various restaurants.

Urban Chestnut is solid. Schlafly is...OK. Four Hands had just tapped a Four Hands/Stone collaboration called Sorry...Not Sorry and it was awesome.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 8:04 pm

brian wrote:(But that said, in most places I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's supply and demand. Unless you're in a state where the laws restrict beer distribution (which isn't impossible, but isn't super common) someone will pop up to serve the market that wants to be served.)

I don't really agree with this, because InBev's goal is to change the idea of supply from specific or wide-ranging IPAs to just craft IPAs in general. Some people care if its specifically Deschutes or true craft, but a lot of the market will see Ballast Point or Elysian and that'll satisfy their demand. Down the line, the next Deschutes isn't even a thing in the midwest and east and the present day new good beer drinker doesn't care because s/he can get Sculpin wherever and s/he's a loyal Sculpin drinker. I'm sure at some point in the past, the idea of just three light beers dominating the entire market would have sounded absurd as well.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:31 pm

mister d wrote:
brian wrote:(But that said, in most places I wouldn't worry about it too much. It's supply and demand. Unless you're in a state where the laws restrict beer distribution (which isn't impossible, but isn't super common) someone will pop up to serve the market that wants to be served.)
I don't really agree with this, because InBev's goal is to change the idea of supply from specific or wide-ranging IPAs to just craft IPAs in general. Some people care if its specifically Deschutes or true craft, but a lot of the market will see Ballast Point or Elysian and that'll satisfy their demand. Down the line, the next Deschutes isn't even a thing in the midwest and east and the present day new good beer drinker doesn't care because s/he can get Sculpin wherever and s/he's a loyal Sculpin drinker. I'm sure at some point in the past, the idea of just three light beers dominating the entire market would have sounded absurd as well.

Mr. D has converted me to his dystopian view of the future of the beer industry. I occasionally skim through Beer Advocate forums, and this topic came up. I was very surprised at the backlash of people towards the few saying they will boycott Ballast Point and every other brewery that sells to a big conglomerate. Most of the responses were saying if Sculpin tastes the same, who cares where the profits go? I don't think it is as simple as finding a way to meet the demand. If ABInBev and the 2 or 3 others are able to buy enough of the larger independent craft breweries, they will be able to squeeze out a lot of smaller breweries. If they can incentivize distributors and shops to push AB products, it will be harder to find, and more expensive to buy independant beers. If they start having a hard time distributing their products, it'll be hard to sell outside of their immediate vicinity.

My other concern is when AB and the others increase their portfolios to own a substantial portion of the current craft market. They will be able to drive the market for ingredients, particularly hops, driving up the costs for independants. Increased costs and limited distribution will make the price increase. I suspect AB will begin to temporarily lower their prices to further drive out competition. Independent breweries won't disappear, but the number of options available will dramatically decrease, with the prices rising.

As for the quality of the breweries purchased by AB, I highly doubt the quality will be the same. Almost every label bought by a corporate outfit suffers. The focus goes from pride in quality to maximizing profits. They will reduce the production costs to the point where quality drops to the point where they start losing profits. If they do this slow enough, people won't really notice the change. Also, moving to mass production inevitably decreases quality control.

Post by **brian** » Tue Dec 08, 2015 11:36 pm

I disagree. If someone's making a good beer it will almost always find a way to market. Some of the best craft beers are only available at the source. Some of the breweries hurt by this probably deserve to be out of business. Unless the distribution model changes if you're making a good product you'll be OK especially considering how discerning the market is now. Most even casual craft beer drinkers know Goose Island is crap. MolsonCoors can come up with 10 different kinds of BlueMoon but 90 percent of beer drinkers know it's essential Coors Light in drag.