NBA Season 15-16

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:45 am

…then refused to pass the baby to her, but shot it 23 feet at the crib. Rimmed out.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 11:50 am

howard wrote:…then refused to pass the baby to her, but shot it 23 feet at the crib. Rimmed out.

You're thinking of ShumpNYC, not ShumpCLE

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 12:19 pm

or JR CLE. Or JR anywhere. I still lump those two together.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 12:37 pm

Warriors may win by 60 tonight against Milwaukee.

DSafetyGuy · Post by **DSafetyGuy** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 4:29 pm

howard wrote:…then refused to pass the baby to her, but shot it 23 feet at the crib. Rimmed out.

He and his wife did name their daughter Iman Shumpert Jr.

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Dec 18, 2015 5:02 pm

I thought it was a girls name.

Rams Fanny · Post by **Rams Fanny** » Thu Dec 31, 2015 4:42 pm

Imagine the odds you could've gotten on a prop bet of GS losing and Philly winning on the same night.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Mon Jan 11, 2016 9:40 am

The 26-9 Cavs have a bigger lead in their conference than the 36-2 Warriors. Spurs may be historically good as well. Just nuts.

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Tue Jan 12, 2016 10:06 pm

God damn, the Knicks are actually fun. They have had good teams before (or so I'm told), but I can't think of a really fun Knicks team since 1989. And I'm not making up a random year there.

howard · Post by **howard** » Tue Jan 12, 2016 10:16 pm

What a weird game, Carmelo left with an injury in the first half; Porzingis fouls out with about three minutes left, and they played hard and smart to win. This rookie point guard Jerian Grant taking over like it was a Big East game. (Or whatever damn conference Notre Dame is in now.) Robin Lopez playing like his name is Brook. Porzingis is gonna be a star.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Thu Jan 14, 2016 10:43 pm

After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:01 am

Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.

So happy Morey decided to take Marcus Morris over him!

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:02 am

Giff wrote:
Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.
So happy Morey decided to take Marcus Morris over him!

Probably a chicken and egg thing, too. He got the time to develop in SA that he may not have gotten elsewhere (not just singling out Houston, mind you).

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:09 am

A_B wrote:
Giff wrote:
Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.
So happy Morey decided to take Marcus Morris over him!
Probably a chicken and egg thing, too. He got the time to develop in SA that he may not have gotten elsewhere (not just singling out Houston, mind you).

Well, whether it was the chicken or the egg, it sucked, so I'd like to find out about the other. That said, that's a very good point. I can't imagine wanting to play anywhere else if I was a mid-tier NBA prospect.

duff · Post by **duff** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 8:21 am

Giff wrote:
Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.
So happy Morey decided to take Marcus Morris over him!

As a Pacers fan, it pains me we traded him for George Hill. But at the time it was a good trade.

Post by **Shirley** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:00 pm

Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.

Let's not get carried away. If LeBron and Curry are the clear 1-2, you'd consider Kawhi ahead of Harden, Durant, Westbrook, and Davis? Not to mention Cousins, Paul, Griffin, etc?

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:07 pm

Shirley wrote:
Joe K wrote:After beating the Cavs tonight, the Spurs have joined Golden State in the on pace for 70 wins club. Kawhi Leonard has become an absolute monster. He's probably a top-5 player in the league right now, and maybe even top-3.
Let's not get carried away. If LeBron and Curry are the clear 1-2, you'd consider Kawhi ahead of Harden, Durant, Westbrook, and Davis? Not to mention Cousins, Paul, Griffin, etc?

Defense is half of the game, and Kawhi is the best defender in the NBA. He's also averaging 20.2 ppg with a 50.7% FG percentage, 48.3% 3-point percentage, and 88.2% FT percentage. Those are outrageously good shooting numbers. I'd easily put him ahead of everyone besides Curry, Durant, LeBron and Paul. And I think you could make the case that he's a top-3 player when you consider his impact on both ends of the court.

ETA: Kawhi is 5th in PER behind Curry, Westbrook, Durant and LeBron. Paul is 6th, but I think Paul is better than Westbrook.

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:15 pm

Barkley was running this Kawai Leonard line last night. I love Leonard, and I think it is entirely possible that, if you planted him on another team where he was the man, a la Harden to Houston, he would blossom like Harden. But it is also possible that he would not score 20/game as a stand-alone. (I hope I have managed to insult Dwight Howard in the above rant, because I think he is a 7ft pile of underachievement.)

Leonard is great, and may well become greater, and I hope he does. I don't intend to dog him at all; at 24yo he is great and getting better. He benefits tremendously from all that talent around him, on defense too. Right now, I'll pick from Shirley's list.

Barkley's best line from last night must be acknowledged. "The Lakers have no chance (against the Dubs tonight); the black girl on The Bachelor has more of a chance."

eta: more words. And to correct spelling; I missed 'Batchelor' on a spelling test in sixth grade, and haven't gotten it right since.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 2:41 pm

Yeah, but it's not just that Kawhi is scoring 20/game, it's how efficiently he does it. The only players averaging 20+ per game who score more efficiently are Curry and Durant. When you combine that with the fact that he's a great rebounder and the best defender in the league, I think he's a top-5 overall player.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:00 pm

Kawhi is fun to watch. Even when he is beat on defense he isn't beat. One of the coolest thing he does is waits for the pick, lets the guy set it, and then still somehow gets back to his man before he can do anything. He did it 4-5 times last night. Also a master of letting you get half a step and then making you look foolish by swiping/poking from behind or just blocking you and making you like a dumbass.

Looks effortless, but of course it isn't.

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:02 pm

And Westbrook and LeBron, according to: http://www.basketball-reference.com/lea ... aders.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . They list Kawhi #5.

I have no idea how well or poorly advanced stats reflect a player's performance. I also think Kawhi benefits greatly from his teammates, ain't nothing wrong with that. For example, while his defensive rating from the same website is second in the league, two teammates are in the top five (Timmay and Aldridge), and a third is #8 (Danny Green). A great defender benefits from great defensive teammates.

I don't want to dog him. I think he is great, and that he has had a fantastic half season. His defense makes me hard. And I don't watch that much, especially outside of the Dubs and the Knicks. I don't mean to shit on your opinion, I can't argue with top 5. There are lots of great players having great years. And he is younger than most of them.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:06 pm

howard wrote:And Westbrook and LeBron, according to: http://www.basketball-reference.com/lea ... aders.html" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; . They list Kawhi #5.

I have no idea how well or poorly advanced stats reflect a player's performance. I also think Kawhi benefits greatly from his teammates, ain't nothing wrong with that. For example, while his defensive rating from the same website is second in the league, two teammates are in the top five (Timmay and Aldridge), and a third is #8 (Danny Green). A great defender benefits from great defensive teammates.

I don't want to dog him. I think he is great, and that he has had a fantastic half season. His defense makes me hard. And I don't watch that much, especially outside of the Dubs and the Knicks. I don't mean to shit on your opinion, I can't argue with top 5. There are lots of great players having great years. And he is younger than most of them.

To clarify, when I said he was third-most efficient, I was talking about shooting efficiency, not PER. PER factors in a number of other non-shooting stats. But FWIW, I don't think PER reflects defense, other than rate stats. So if anything, it may understate Leonard's overall value.

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:12 pm

FWIW, he is 4th in offensive win shares; and #1 in defensive win shares, 2nd overall.

Post by **Shirley** » Fri Jan 15, 2016 3:34 pm

Yeah, I certainly didn't mean to say Kawhi sucks or anything. I'd certainly take him over Harden, for example.

I also love defense as well and hate how it's so often overlooked when rating players, even with advanced metrics. That said, individual defense is a very different thing than individual offense. Defense is (usually) much more of a team effort than offense is.

My hunch, and I may be wrong because I'm not watching the Spurs regularly or anything, is that Kawhi gets a lot of his offensive production because of the balanced team around him. I don't think he could pull a James Harden and go somewhere else to be the man and score 30ppg. I could be wrong though.

DC47 · Post by **DC47** » Sat Jan 16, 2016 4:12 pm

I think Leonard is very good, but not great. His stats benefit quite a bit from his brilliant coach and team, on both sides of the game.

However, he's just 24. When he came into the league he couldn't shoot a jumper. He's grown a lot. With his fundamentals, work ethic, and youth, who knows where he stops? If I was drafting an NBA team from scratch right now with everyone eligible, and with the first picks having the same maxed-out contracts, I'd have him right next to Durant, Davis and Curry on my list.

DSafetyGuy · Post by **DSafetyGuy** » Sat Jan 16, 2016 9:21 pm

A couple weeks ago on si.com:

Nothing is wasted in Leonard’s game. His current turnover rate (7.4%) is one of the best in the league, occupying a statistical space reserved largely for spot-up shooters and single-minded gunners. Leonard has seemingly merged those archetypes into something far more profound: A star who is both creator (given his elite efficiency in isolation situations) and destroyer (as a league-leading 50% shooter on three-pointers) without bothering to succumb to the limitations of either distinction.

--snip--

A vicious post-up game has allowed Leonard to bully the only defenders quick enough to stay in front of him. A tidy pull-up game demands honesty of his defender, then punishes them with physical advantage. Leonard is aces in isolation (where in 56 possessions he has scored 62 points and committed zero turnovers, per Synergy Sports) but not tethered to it; the way Leonard moves around the floor makes his touches all the more unpredictable to opposing defenders.

--snip--

Leonard’s defense is as obvious as defense gets; go-to scorers give up the ball rather than work against him, drives are blanketed from the start, shot attempts are snuffed out completely, and guards hesitate before even throwing passes in his general direction.

howard · Post by **howard** » Mon Jan 18, 2016 9:36 pm

JR Smith never disappoints. Down 30 to the Dubs, commits a flagrant 2. Not the worst or dirtiest foul ever, but sufficient to take the cowards way out of the game.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Mon Jan 18, 2016 9:42 pm

I wish there were somewhere I could bet on LeBron not winning any more titles in his career. The Cavs will likely make the Finals again this year, but I'm not sure if they could beat any of the top-4 West teams in a series. And with each year that passes, age will catch up to him a bit more.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Tue Jan 19, 2016 9:06 am

I was channel surfing, flipped to that game and it was like 17-12 or something like that, in the 1st quarter. Flipped back a couple of minutes later and it was 31-15 or something ridiculous. Then a few minutes later and it was 52-27 (all scores approximate). What an ass kicking.

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Tue Jan 19, 2016 9:56 am

Meanwhile the Rockets score 132 and lose. Howard's been playing on fire lately. Last night he became only the 2nd player since 1990 to have 35+ points and 26+ boards.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:04 pm

Blatt fired. Hmmmm.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:07 pm

God dammit, I wanted to start a "Blatt Goes Splatt" thread (and then never check it again).

howard · Post by **howard** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:13 pm

Bron player-coach?

eta: does Tyronn Lue still look like he's 14yo?

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:42 pm

howard wrote:Bron player-coach?

eta: does Tyronn Lue still look like he's Teresa Witherspoon?

FIFY.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 4:48 pm

This is a very interesting move to me. In my opinion, Blatt did a pretty masterful job getting that team to Game 6 of the NBA Finals last year, given all their injuries. (No, I don't buy into the narrative that LeBron was making all the coaching decisions.) And this year's team is on pace for 60 wins and is heavily favored to make the Finals. The fact that team management and/or LeBron nonetheless decided to make a move suggests desperation to me.

I don't think that they're necessarily wrong to feel desperate. With all the miles LeBron has on his legs, I think the Cavs' title window is actually rather narrow. With Golden State and San Antonio absolutely ripping shit up this season, I really didn't like the Cavs' chances of winning the Finals. I doubt that Tyrann Lue will put them over the top, but I understand the decision to shake things up and take a gamble.

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:21 pm

Xzibit, guys. Xzibit.

DSafetyGuy · Post by **DSafetyGuy** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:40 pm

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 6:48 pm

He must be so smart!

Johnny Carwash · Post by **Johnny Carwash** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:04 pm

Yeah, I don't get what he's trying to do there, other than grasping at some semantic detail to make himself look smart.

Johnny Carwash · Post by **Johnny Carwash** » Fri Jan 22, 2016 7:33 pm