Moderators: Shirley, Sabo, brian, rass, DaveInSeattle
Can you imagine the reaction on the Right if Obama had done a press conference with his staff and family standing there cheering him on and laughing at his jokes?Nonlinear FC wrote:You don't have a fucking cheering section at a press conference. There should be no fucking ovation and scattered applause.
Great post, DaveInSeattle!DaveInSeattle wrote:Can you imagine the reaction on the Right if Obama had done a press conference with his staff and family standing there cheering him on and laughing at his jokes?Nonlinear FC wrote:You don't have a fucking cheering section at a press conference. There should be no fucking ovation and scattered applause.
Sean Hannity's head would have exploded....which might not be a bad thing.
As I keep saying to my GF, "You will not be able to be cynical enough over the next 4 years".
This made me laugh, but Dave makes a good point. I saw a clip of Chuck Todd after the press conference. He said something about being shocked how normal Trump made crazy seem. The applauds, the constant hyperbole, the renunciation of the entire intelligence community, the ripping on the media, the bizarre speech from the lawyer, which I only saw 2 minutes of. I should go back and watch the rest, but that was odd. It's pretty clear we are never going to get an answer to anything, ever. Just lies, and 180 reversals on lies, saying he never said the original lie, while having his team spinn his reversal into meaning something completely unrelated to the actual words of what he says.EnochRoot wrote:Great post, DaveInSeattle!DaveInSeattle wrote:Can you imagine the reaction on the Right if Obama had done a press conference with his staff and family standing there cheering him on and laughing at his jokes?Nonlinear FC wrote:You don't have a fucking cheering section at a press conference. There should be no fucking ovation and scattered applause.
Sean Hannity's head would have exploded....which might not be a bad thing.
As I keep saying to my GF, "You will not be able to be cynical enough over the next 4 years".
Way to go!
If he likes press conferences so much, he wouldn't have gone six months since the last one.P.D.X. wrote:Well, the point is is that they can (ideally) get things on record. And the press conference is a format that DJT has the least control over. I think he'd be perfectly fine if the press didn't show up. (Some would and toss softballs)
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
I don't think you understand the importance the role of the media in American politics and how ingrained it is in the creation of our government. The Founding Fathers gave great weight to the press as the "Fourth Estate" to hold the government accountable. What better way for a dictator or tyrant to take over than have the press refuse to show up to ask him questions? That leaves Trump with nothing but puppet media outlets reporting how everything he does is incredible, the best in history, nobody has ever seen anything this great. His farts are the best smelling farts, tremendous. If all of the legitimate journalists in the WH Press Corp no showed, Trump would fill the room with lackeys and Breitbart writers. They created the monster, but he is now President Elect, if you stop feeding it, the monster isn't going away.degenerasian wrote:which is why the media should no longer show up. They created this monster. Attending would just feed it.
Then the other journalists should have asked Acostas question until he answered it. Make him ban then all.The Sybian wrote:I don't think you understand the importance the role of the media in American politics and how ingrained it is in the creation of our government. The Founding Fathers gave great weight to the press as the "Fourth Estate" to hold the government accountable. What better way for a dictator or tyrant to take over than have the press refuse to show up to ask him questions? That leaves Trump with nothing but puppet media outlets reporting how everything he does is incredible, the best in history, nobody has ever seen anything this great. His farts are the best smelling farts, tremendous. If all of the legitimate journalists in the WH Press Corp no showed, Trump would fill the room with lackeys and Breitbart writers. They created the monster, but he is now President Elect, if you stop feeding it, the monster isn't going away.degenerasian wrote:which is why the media should no longer show up. They created this monster. Attending would just feed it.
"As I listened, my jaw dropped. Trump's workaround is a totally fraudulent runaround," tweeted Professor Laurence Tribe of Harvard University, one of the leading constitutional lawyers in the US.
"Trump's announced structure is cleverly designed to dazzle and deceive, but it solves none of the serious ethical or legal issues. Trump's lawyer would flunk constitutional law at any halfway decent law school. At least if the lawyer wasn't just joking."
Professor Richard Painter, who was President George W Bush's chief ethics lawyer, stated frankly: "The plan we heard today does not comply with the law."
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
That is a huge point, and I think that thoughtful people do see it as a subtext to what is going on. (Sadly, this is a group that gets smaller seemingly on a daily basis.)Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
I suggest the bolded part, with accompanying grammar adjustments.Pruitt wrote:That is a huge point, and I think that thoughtful people do see it as a subtext to what is going on. (Sadly, this is a group that gets smaller seemingly on a daily basis.)Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
Even W. who, let's face it, was an intellectual weakling, projected that strength as he spoke with the authority of the American government. It seems that Trump is going to be embroiled in legal issues and will have tremendous doubts as to both his fitness to lead and whether or not he even cares to be representing the best interest of the country.
It's terrifying.
Can you elaborate? I would argue that half this country (incorrectly) thinks the office has done nothing but project weakness the past eight years and Trump is the antidote to that.Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
To your point, I think a lot of the country is somewhat ignorant about history and foreign policy and views the USA as the greatest country that has ever existed and one that single handedly saved the world in WWI,WWII and the Cold War. The idea that we, by ourselves,"saved the world" is a gross oversimplification but it's been part of our national self image for a long time. In the wake of it, when faced with a President like Obama who correctly understands the limits of American power, and is thus willing to negotiate (even with evil Muslims like Iran!), people see weakness. But to Rex's point, Trump will have far less credibility -- and thus leverage -- on the international stage than any other modern President.GoodKarma wrote:Can you elaborate? I would argue that half this country (incorrectly) thinks the office has done nothing but project weakness the past eight years and Trump is the antidote to that.Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
tennbengal wrote:Counterpoint, Johnnie:
/finThe Sybian wrote:You know Trump will go after any Republican who attempts to stand up to him. I just hope they have the courage and integrity to stand up to Trump.
Yet, I hear so many people saying Obama was a joke in the rest of the world, and Trump will be seen as a force to be reckoned with, who will negotiate the BEST deals, and we will start winning again. In the rare case you can get someone to look at the actual opinions, like the front page of newspapers around saying the US elected a buffoon, they will say "who cares, we don't want other countries to like our President, that means he is weak and they can walk all over him." FFS, so many people in the UK signed a petition to ban Trump from entering the UK, the House of Commons was forced to address the issue. I think someone posted a video, but it was a first class roast of Trump. Our biggest ally held a televised roast of our President by a House of Parliament, except it wasn't a friendly chiding. Yet, people believe Trump is respected by the rest of the world.Joe K wrote: But to Rex's point, Trump will have far less credibility -- and thus leverage -- on the international stage than any other modern President.
This goes to my point that many Americans mistakenly believe that our power is limitless such that we can just walk over any country. If we saved the world 3 times in the last 100 years what's so tough about renegotiating trade deals? When I hear Trump talk about magically getting better deals with China I just shake my head. China has over 20% of the world's population -- so they do (and should) have a shitload of economic leverage over any country, including the US.The Sybian wrote:Yet, I hear so many people saying Obama was a joke in the rest of the world, and Trump will be seen as a force to be reckoned with, who will negotiate the BEST deals, and we will start winning again. In the rare case you can get someone to look at the actual opinions, like the front page of newspapers around saying the US elected a buffoon, they will say "who cares, we don't want other countries to like our President, that means he is weak and they can walk all over him." FFS, so many people in the UK signed a petition to ban Trump from entering the UK, the House of Commons was forced to address the issue. I think someone posted a video, but it was a first class roast of Trump. Our biggest ally held a televised roast of our President by a House of Parliament, except it wasn't a friendly chiding. Yet, people believe Trump is respected by the rest of the world.Joe K wrote: But to Rex's point, Trump will have far less credibility -- and thus leverage -- on the international stage than any other modern President.
Pruitt wrote:That is a huge point, and I think that thoughtful people do see it as a subtext to what is going on. (Sadly, this is a group that gets smaller seemingly on a daily basis.)Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
Even W. who, let's face it, was an intellectual weakling, projected that strength as he spoke with the authority of the American government. It seems that Trump is going to be embroiled in legal issues and will have tremendous doubts as to both his fitness to lead and whether or not he even cares to be representing the best interest of the country.
It's terrifying.
Joe K wrote:To your point, I think a lot of the country is somewhat ignorant about history and foreign policy and views the USA as the greatest country that has ever existed and one that single handedly saved the world in WWI,WWII and the Cold War. The idea that we, by ourselves,"saved the world" is a gross oversimplification but it's been part of our national self image for a long time. In the wake of it, when faced with a President like Obama who correctly understands the limits of American power, and is thus willing to negotiate (even with evil Muslims like Iran!), people see weakness. But to Rex's point, Trump will have far less credibility -- and thus leverage -- on the international stage than any other modern President.GoodKarma wrote:Can you elaborate? I would argue that half this country (incorrectly) thinks the office has done nothing but project weakness the past eight years and Trump is the antidote to that.Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
But I can't imagine very many world leaders perceive Trump as anything but the clown he is. As bad as W's cabinet was, they were experienced, highly competent and understood the departments and agencies they ran. Cunning and sometimes evil, but they understood how government and international politics work. The team Trump is assembling is a shitshow of businessmen and political hacks who jumped on his train early. Now that Trump is firing so many top level civil servants on day one, in many cases without replacements in place, who is going to train the appointees/nominees or direct the actual work? I guess it doesn't matter in agencies like the EPA, or the Dept of Labor or the Dept. of Education, since the nominees have no interest in enforcing the actual mission of those agencie. I'm bummed my extremely political work friend left my company, as her daughter works for the EPA, and her don-in-law is a high level manager at the EPA. I would love some inside knowledge on what is going to happen inside the EPA. I imagine Congress is going to dismantle laws prohibiting pollution, and cut funding to EPA enforcement of the laws that remain. I assume the same is going to happen with the Dept of Labor. Energy will likely turn into a giveaway to the fossil fuel industry, and shutting down efforts to develop alternate renewable energy. Maybe I'll invest the sizable tax cuts coming my into funding Elon Musk or someone similar, willing to eat enormous losses while developing technology to a point where it becomes practicable.Rex wrote:Joe K wrote:To your point, I think a lot of the country is somewhat ignorant about history and foreign policy and views the USA as the greatest country that has ever existed and one that single handedly saved the world in WWI,WWII and the Cold War. The idea that we, by ourselves,"saved the world" is a gross oversimplification but it's been part of our national self image for a long time. In the wake of it, when faced with a President like Obama who correctly understands the limits of American power, and is thus willing to negotiate (even with evil Muslims like Iran!), people see weakness. But to Rex's point, Trump will have far less credibility -- and thus leverage -- on the international stage than any other modern President.GoodKarma wrote:Can you elaborate? I would argue that half this country (incorrectly) thinks the office has done nothing but project weakness the past eight years and Trump is the antidote to that.Rex wrote:I feel like people are missing the larger point here. The office of the U.S. president has projected strength for as long as any of us have been alive. Now, it will project weakness.
Perception is reality when you are talking about the projection of power. And it's not the perception of Americans that counts here.
P.D.X. wrote:I don't know what you people criticizing the press over that conference wanted them to do. They asked pointed, appropriate questions that Trump repeatedly dodged, Acosta was freaking yelling at the PEOTUS and even told him he was being inappropriate. The media may have failed during the election but they were digging in during that presser.
There's also not much you can do when accurate reporting is immediately countered with "fake news."Nonlinear FC wrote:P.D.X. wrote:I don't know what you people criticizing the press over that conference wanted them to do. They asked pointed, appropriate questions that Trump repeatedly dodged, Acosta was freaking yelling at the PEOTUS and even told him he was being inappropriate. The media may have failed during the election but they were digging in during that presser.
Yeah, I don't really understand those criticizing the press on this. As I stated earlier, this was a circus from the beginning with staff in the back emulating a peanut gallery and a 20 minute filibuster from his lawyer. Shitshow.
Brontoburglar wrote:There's also not much you can do when accurate reporting is immediately countered with "fake news."Nonlinear FC wrote:P.D.X. wrote:I don't know what you people criticizing the press over that conference wanted them to do. They asked pointed, appropriate questions that Trump repeatedly dodged, Acosta was freaking yelling at the PEOTUS and even told him he was being inappropriate. The media may have failed during the election but they were digging in during that presser.
Yeah, I don't really understand those criticizing the press on this. As I stated earlier, this was a circus from the beginning with staff in the back emulating a peanut gallery and a 20 minute filibuster from his lawyer. Shitshow.
Meh, Shep Smith strays from the company line pretty frequently. When Hannity says that, I'll be impressed, but I'm sure he will jump on it, arguing that CNN was in the bag for Clinton and sore losers. I could possibly see O'Reilly saying something in a very mild, "oh, Donald" sort of way. He criticized Trump's campaign strategy at times. Well, more like gave him advice while interviewing him.
The Sybian wrote:Meh, Shep Smith strays from the company line pretty frequently. When Hannity says that, I'll be impressed, but I'm sure he will jump on it, arguing that CNN was in the bag for Clinton and sore losers. I could possibly see O'Reilly saying something in a very mild, "oh, Donald" sort of way. He criticized Trump's campaign strategy at times. Well, more like gave him advice while interviewing him.
They are asking questions that they know he isn't going to answer...and the answers he does give will be exaggerated lies, quarter truths and misdirections at level we have not seen. I understand that they do it to get it "on the record"...but so what? We don't need the record to confirm this guy is a buffoon. It's time to spend your time, energy and resources into true investigative reporting and tearing apart of his plans or claims. Post your stories (not on Buzzfeed) with the last sentence being "President Trumps staff refused to comment/allow access" or "President Trumps staff provided ______ in response." This is what I mean by covering him in a traditional manner will do nothing but result in what happened yesterday and ultimately prove pointless.Nonlinear FC wrote:P.D.X. wrote:I don't know what you people criticizing the press over that conference wanted them to do. They asked pointed, appropriate questions that Trump repeatedly dodged, Acosta was freaking yelling at the PEOTUS and even told him he was being inappropriate. The media may have failed during the election but they were digging in during that presser.
Yeah, I don't really understand those criticizing the press on this. As I stated earlier, this was a circus from the beginning with staff in the back emulating a peanut gallery and a 20 minute filibuster from his lawyer. Shitshow.
GoodKarma wrote:They are asking questions that they know he isn't going to answer...and the answers he does give will be exaggerated lies, quarter truths and misdirections at level we have not seen. I understand that they do it to get it "on the record"...but so what? We don't need the record to confirm this guy is a buffoon. It's time to spend your time, energy and resources into true investigative reporting and tearing apart of his plans or claims. Post your stories (not on Buzzfeed) with the last sentence being "President Trumps staff refused to comment/allow access" or "President Trumps staff provided ______ in response." This is what I mean by covering him in a traditional manner will do nothing but result in what happened yesterday and ultimately prove pointless.Nonlinear FC wrote:P.D.X. wrote:I don't know what you people criticizing the press over that conference wanted them to do. They asked pointed, appropriate questions that Trump repeatedly dodged, Acosta was freaking yelling at the PEOTUS and even told him he was being inappropriate. The media may have failed during the election but they were digging in during that presser.
Yeah, I don't really understand those criticizing the press on this. As I stated earlier, this was a circus from the beginning with staff in the back emulating a peanut gallery and a 20 minute filibuster from his lawyer. Shitshow.
If his comments and behavior weren't bad enough to keep him from getting elected then what makes anyone think his actual presidency will be any different? Trump was 100% right when he said he could shoot someone on 5th Ave. and not lose any support.
