Random Politics

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Wed Sep 13, 2017 5:07 pm

Ummm... how the hell did a Black guy get elected President?

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Sep 14, 2017 4:56 pm

Pruitt wrote:Ummm... how the hell did a Black guy get elected President?

It was America's equivalent of being that white girl in college that was curious and just had to find out. For 8 years.

Also, speaking of white girls...

https://www.instagram.com/p/BZCEIBsF67s/

Post by **brian** » Fri Sep 15, 2017 10:03 am

As bad as it is here (and it is bad), at least the government wasn't covering up top elected officials secretly pardoning child molesters (I hope):

https://twitter.com/AndriErlingsson/sta ... 8888724480

Crazy thread.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:25 pm

Sarah Palin at her folksy gibberish best. Great follow up to Taibbi's article in the Taibbi thread about how the Alabama Senate primary could tear apart the GOP, with Bannon, Palin, Gorka and other Trump supporters backing the racist, homophobe "10 Commandment Judge" Roy Moore, while Trump is backing his opponent, Luther Strange.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_cont ... CGSE_p7vJg

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:48 am

Made it to 26 seconds.

God I hate that idiot.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:21 am

The Sybian wrote:Sarah Palin at her folksy gibberish best. Great follow up to Taibbi's article in the Taibbi thread about how the Alabama Senate primary could tear apart the GOP, with Bannon, Palin, Gorka and other Trump supporters backing the racist, homophobe "10 Commandment Judge" Roy Moore, while Trump is backing his opponent, Luther Strange.

If Trump himself didn't tear apart the GOP, the Alabama Senate primary won't. They'll all fall in line behind whoever wins.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:50 am

Trump is more deeply committed to his lunch order than whoever he's currently backing in Alabama.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:14 am

What do you guys think of the notion I've heard in many places that there are 3 areas of healthcare (universal, affordable*, quality) and you can only have 2 out of the 3. Nowhere in the world has all 3.

Here in Canada, we have probably the worst of the single payer systems. We fulfill 1.5 of the 3. Universal, kind of affordable and not quality.
UK & Taiwan: Universal, affordable, not quality
Nordic Countries : Universal, Quality, not affordable
USA: Quality, Affordable(?), not universal

*affordable meaning low cost private plans or low taxes

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:30 am

degenerasian wrote:What do you guys think of the notion I've heard in many places that there are 3 areas of healthcare (universal, affordable*, quality) and you can only have 2 out of the 3. Nowhere in the world has all 3.

Here in Canada, we have probably the worst of the single payer systems. We fulfill 1.5 of the 3. Universal, kind of affordable and not quality.
UK & Taiwan: Universal, affordable, not quality
Nordic Countries : Universal, Quality, not affordable
USA: Quality, Affordable(?), not universal

*affordable meaning low cost private plans or low taxes

For a country as rich as the US, anything, and I mean anything is affordable. Congress just agreed on bipartisan grounds to massively increase the defense budget in a blink of the eye. We absolutely could afford a high-quality, universal system. We'd just rather spend the money on bombing Muslims and paying insurance CEO's tens of millions annually.

The problem with the current US system is that even if it's quality, there are huge affordability issues for millions of people. Either because the people are low-middle income, or because they have serious conditions that aren't getting covered. So even if our care is quality for those with access to it, we score poorly on a whole bunch of outcome metrics as compared to countries with truly universal coverage.

GoodKarma · Post by **GoodKarma** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:39 am

Based on outcomes, you can argue the U.S. is lacking on the quality side.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:45 am

GoodKarma wrote:Based on outcomes, you can argue the U.S. is lacking on the quality side.

Right, and this is tied to affordability/access issues. You could have the best doctors in the world but if people can't afford the co-pays, the outcomes aren't going to be pretty. The argument that the US has better "quality" than places like Canada or the U.K. Is too often based only on the perspective of people affluent enough to afford the care they need.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 1:20 pm

I have a bit of an issue with labelling Canada's health care as not being very high in quality.

BUT having said that, I live in a city with a number of the best hospitals in the country. I can't vouch for what it's like in small towns.

travzilla · Post by **travzilla** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 2:03 pm

Pruitt wrote:I have a bit of an issue with labelling Canada's health care as not being very high in quality.

BUT having said that, I live in a city with a number of the best hospitals in the country. I can't vouch for what it's like in small towns.

Having moved to rural Nova Scotia last year, small town health care is very challenging. My wife needed her birth control prescription renewed. I had hip pain I needed checking out. For both cases, that meant going to (and waiting in) the ER. No walk-in clinics within 1.5 hours of my house. We're on a 30,000+ person (and growing) provincial waiting list for a family doctor. The doctor in town retired 3 years ago and the province has decided to not replace him, even though there's a newly built clinic (either due to cost or inability to recruit). The hospital ER itself closes for a day or so about once a month due to not having an available doctor.

It's frustrating, but I guess still better than having an amazing doctor down the street that you have no hope of affording, or being bankrupted by an emergency out of your control.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 2:44 pm

Pruitt wrote:I have a bit of an issue with labelling Canada's health care as not being very high in quality.

BUT having said that, I live in a city with a number of the best hospitals in the country. I can't vouch for what it's like in small towns.

It ranks low according to this study

https://www.cihi.ca/sites/default/files ... b-rev.pptx (powerpoint file)

Canada's healthcare has always been safe, affordable, and high quality when compared to other countries. However, that's only when Canadians receive health care because Access to Health care remains an areas we really struggle with.

Indicators like wait time for specialist, rates of same day appointments, and usage rates of ER and acute care services are things our country has always struggled with. There are reasons for this though such as how our population is spread out and our federal structure makes it that the Provinces each manages their own health systems.

Equity is another area we have room to improve in. While we won't have the same level of inequality compared to the US between health care affordability, our health coverage doesn't include other aspects of primary health compared to other countries such as dental, vision, and mental health care.

Sometimes I feel that Canadians only know two systems. Canada and the US and as long as we have better healthcare than them, that's is enough. We cling desperately to our outdated, inefficient system instead of looking at all the alternatives around the world.
__________________

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 3:21 pm

I'd wager that healthcare in rural areas suffers the same fate in whatever country. Just like any other service.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:05 pm

degenerasian wrote:
Pruitt wrote:I have a bit of an issue with labelling Canada's health care as not being very high in quality.

BUT having said that, I live in a city with a number of the best hospitals in the country. I can't vouch for what it's like in small towns.

It ranks low according to this study

https://www.cihi.ca/sites/default/files ... b-rev.pptx (powerpoint file)

Canada's healthcare has always been safe, affordable, and high quality when compared to other countries. However, that's only when Canadians receive health care because Access to Health care remains an areas we really struggle with.

Indicators like wait time for specialist, rates of same day appointments, and usage rates of ER and acute care services are things our country has always struggled with. There are reasons for this though such as how our population is spread out and our federal structure makes it that the Provinces each manages their own health systems.

Equity is another area we have room to improve in. While we won't have the same level of inequality compared to the US between health care affordability, our health coverage doesn't include other aspects of primary health compared to other countries such as dental, vision, and mental health care.

Sometimes I feel that Canadians only know two systems. Canada and the US and as long as we have better healthcare than them, that's is enough. We cling desperately to our outdated, inefficient system instead of looking at all the alternatives around the world.
__________________

The thing to remember in comparing Canadian and American health systems is that Canada spends less than half per person than the US does. You could improve access and waiting time issues in the Canadian system by increasing spending 75% - and it would still be cheaper and mroe inclusive than the US system.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:43 pm

Scarcity of doctors is a problem that plagues the rural U.S. as well as rural Canada.

And, correct me if you think I'm wrong, but I was told this by a Canadian doctor who lives here in the Bay Area, and I've heard similar stories from Canadian relatives - That, another problem is earning power of top doctors. Many of them can leave Canada and come to the U.S. and earn significantly more money than they can in Canada (I understand earnings are limited by the Canadian single-payer system?). Which often means that the doctors who stay behind are the ones who couldn't increase their earnings by leaving, often meaning that there is something lacking in their resume.

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Mon Sep 25, 2017 3:00 pm

Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Wed Sep 27, 2017 5:22 pm

The Great Charley Pierce No Fan Of Roy Moore

I’m out of empathy for this stuff. I’m out of pity. I’m out of patience. And, not for nothing, but Moore’s opponent is a guy named Douglas Jones. In 2001, Jones convicted two men for the bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham in 1963, one of the iconic white supremacist terrorist acts of that period. One of those bastards already died in prison and the other keeps getting denied parole. If you’d rather be represented in the Senate by a lawless theocratic lunatic, rather than a guy that finally got justice for four murdered little girls, well, you deserve anything that goddamn happens to you.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Wed Sep 27, 2017 11:25 pm

If Hillary Clinton tweeted this would liberals in the media get indignant?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BZkZpchH0-Q/

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 6:54 am

Pruitt wrote:The Great Charley Pierce No Fan Of Roy Moore

I’m out of empathy for this stuff. I’m out of pity. I’m out of patience. And, not for nothing, but Moore’s opponent is a guy named Douglas Jones. In 2001, Jones convicted two men for the bombing of the 16th Street Baptist Church in Birmingham in 1963, one of the iconic white supremacist terrorist acts of that period. One of those bastards already died in prison and the other keeps getting denied parole. If you’d rather be represented in the Senate by a lawless theocratic lunatic, rather than a guy that finally got justice for four murdered little girls, well, you deserve anything that goddamn happens to you.

LIKE

Gunpowder · Post by **Gunpowder** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:18 am

Johnnie wrote:If Hillary Clinton tweeted this would liberals in the media get indignant?

https://www.instagram.com/p/BZkZpchH0-Q/

If Hillary Clinton started tweeting shitty memes? Yes.

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 7:50 am

Baloney wrote:Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Starting to heat up

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... Korea.html

Avram · Post by **Avram** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:00 am

Baloney wrote:
Baloney wrote:Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Starting to heat up
e lot bigger
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... Korea.html

Lets not forget the Kurdistan independence referendum. I think that could be a whole lot bigger

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:09 am

Baloney wrote:
Baloney wrote:Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Starting to heat up

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... Korea.html

Feels like the Spanish government isn't handling this very well.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:24 am

Pruitt wrote:
Baloney wrote:
Baloney wrote:Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Starting to heat up

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... Korea.html

Feels like the Spanish government isn't handling this very well.

I think Spain views the secession of Catalonia kind of like the U.S. viewed the secession of the South.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:41 am

Yeah, and it took so long to quiet the Basque separatists that maybe they see this as the start of a chain reaction?

Johnny Carwash · Post by **Johnny Carwash** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 9:57 am

Is there some kind of history there with different segments of the country not getting along?

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:04 am

This should heat up el Clásico.

Post by **brian** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:05 am

Johnny Carwash wrote:Is there some kind of history there with different segments of the country not getting along?

I feel like you're joking, but you also had never heard the term "Canadian tuxedo" so, just in case...yeah.

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 10:09 am

Pruitt wrote:
Baloney wrote:
Baloney wrote:Not getting much coverage but a big deal none the less, Catalonia to vote on independence on Oct 1st

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2017/ ... dence-vote

Starting to heat up

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article ... Korea.html

Feels like the Spanish government isn't handling this very well.

They were pretty heavy handed during the Scottish vote just to avoid this very thing

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:25 am

I'm really torn on the Roy Moore win. On one hand, he is one of the most horrendous Congressional candidates ever, but OTOH, Trump went all in on Strange and got destroyed. In most cases, I cautiously root for the insane wingnut to win a GOP primary, as they are less electable, but a Democrat has no chance of winning a Senate race in Alabama, do they?

Post by **brian** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:33 am

THAT would be the ultimately indignity to Trump (and a good sign for November 2018) since he'll be forced to campaign for Moore, but no. I wouldn't hold your breath.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:38 am

Gunpowder wrote:If Hillary Clinton started tweeting shitty memes? Yes.

Not my point even remotely.

It was misogyny and an attack on women and engendered visceral reacts on the left when a photoshopped golf ball hit Hillary and she stumbled into an airplane. Not because it was a shitty meme.

The answer is no, btw.

Johnny Carwash · Post by **Johnny Carwash** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:47 am

I don't think Trump gives a shit between Strange and Moore, and was campaigning for Strange because his advisers told him to and was too lazy to pay closer attention. Moore is the guy people who are really into Trump wanted, and that means more than Trump's nominal endorsement.

Post by **brian** » Thu Sep 28, 2017 11:51 am

Johnny Carwash wrote:I don't think Trump gives a shit between Strange and Moore, and was campaigning for Strange because his advisers told him to and was too lazy to pay closer attention. Moore is the guy people who are really into Trump wanted, and that means more than Trump's nominal endorsement.

I agree on a theoretical "cuck-o-meter" it rates like 2 out of 10, but it still puts a lie to any kind of notion that Trump has any control over his base, which is a canard that the right-wing media flaunts endlessly. Shows that he has no idea what he's doing and his supporters don't give a shit about him except as a tool to piss off "libtards"

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Fri Sep 29, 2017 8:46 am

P.D.X. wrote:This should heat up el Clásico.

Yep

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... ments.html

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:01 am

Jeebus, Johnnie - I would follow this guy anywhere:

https://twitter.com/yashar/status/913595160214286336

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:14 am

Yup. Watched that in full yesterday. The guy is awesome.

Hearing a person speak that well and that powerfully and using specific language to unify all in this matter while forcefully decrying that whoever did this is not accepted makes me a bit hopeful for when a real human is president again.

That's the type of leadership I'm used to seeing. When I turn on the TV and see millionaire talking heads blathering ignorant bullshit I know I'm not crazy, just living in some twilight zone.

Unfortunately a general will never be allowed to speak like that in uniform on the news though. It politicizes the military and immediately makes our standing knocked down a peg.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:25 am

Which is frustrating, because you all are already hella politicized - just on one side. By that I mean, the right (generally - probably exclusively) wraps itself in the flag and military service to further its purposes - and nothing can really be said to add nuance to that from the military.