Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

Okay . . . let's try this again.

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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Looks like Johnnie has Brian blocked.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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I absolutely don't. And shame on me. I actually quoted his post. I thought that this tweet was something different. My bad.

(Only dude I have blocked is the guy who posts the "Red Sox Magic Number" because he's an obvious useless troll.)
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Charlie Pierce on Trump green lighting Kurd killing: https://www.esquire.com/news-politics/p ... ey-invade/
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

Post by Johnnie »

A federal judge curbstomped Trump's defense over releasing his tax returns and then....

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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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You didn't really think Trump wouldn't appeal? It's going to go to the Supremes and then we'll really see what kind of a "democracy" we're living in.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 10:04 am A federal judge curbstomped Trump's defense over releasing his tax returns and then....

It'd be malpractice for the Second Circuit *not* to issue at least a short-term stay.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Yeah, I don't speak legalese so it looked like a win, but it's never a win until we're all dead and the pain is over.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:46 pm Yeah, I don't speak legalese so it looked like a win, but it's never a win until we're all dead and the pain is over.
The legal basis for requiring the president or presidential candidates to release their tax returns has never been tested before (like so many things in this post-Trumpian world), so this is going to the Supreme Court.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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brian wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:54 pm
Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:46 pm Yeah, I don't speak legalese so it looked like a win, but it's never a win until we're all dead and the pain is over.
The legal basis for requiring the president or presidential candidates to release their tax returns has never been tested before (like so many things in this post-Trumpian world), so this is going to the Supreme Court.
...where a 5-4 split is expected with Boofy K writing the opinion.

Awesome.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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brian wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:54 pm
Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:46 pm Yeah, I don't speak legalese so it looked like a win, but it's never a win until we're all dead and the pain is over.
The legal basis for requiring the president or presidential candidates to release their tax returns has never been tested before (like so many things in this post-Trumpian world), so this is going to the Supreme Court.
This particular issue really isn't about whether a president or candidate can be required to release tax returns. (California has tried to enact such a requirement, but a federal district court rejected that a week or so ago.)

This is about whether being President gives some kind of immunity against a state criminal subpoena for personal and corporate tax returns.

I don't think it's a crazy argument. I understand that federal officers have some protection against politically-motivated prosecutions by hostile local governments. Think about a district attorney in Alabama issuing subpoenas to a locally based federal civil rights investigator. Or a Utah county attorney prosecuting a BLM employee who refuses to allow ATVs to access disputed roads in a wilderness study area. If there is such a protection, I think Trump could invoke it here.

I only read the beginning of the ruling the district court issued today, so I don't know if the judge addresses that issue, or what he says about it.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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He seems extra stable today...
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 1:00 pm
brian wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:54 pm
Johnnie wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 12:46 pm Yeah, I don't speak legalese so it looked like a win, but it's never a win until we're all dead and the pain is over.
The legal basis for requiring the president or presidential candidates to release their tax returns has never been tested before (like so many things in this post-Trumpian world), so this is going to the Supreme Court.
...where a 5-4 split is expected with Boofy K writing the opinion.

Awesome.
Probably. Though a good outcome there would be a ruling left open enough to interpretation that any future laws Congress passes requiring such a release would withstand future Court scrutiny. But it'll be a dark day for democracy and a dark day for transparency in government when the public is told they no longer have the right to know how the president earns his/her income.

(I don't know the legal reasons for these rulings, of course. I'm just trying to call balls and strikes. But Trump has flaunted 50 years of public disclosures and gotten away with it and I'm certain he'll continue to be protected by GOPers in the Congress and on the Supreme Court as well.)
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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"What a bunch of pedantic pricks." - sybian
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Pruitt wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 3:07 pm
He cannot be serious.

Is he serious?

I really do think he's talking half tongue-in-cheek. But still, I just cannot fucking believe that there are people who voted for him or voted for others to enable him to become president. I just can't.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Own the libz. My team has to win at all cost. Quit being so dramatic and triggered, snowflake.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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I mean, what can you even say in response to this shit? It's just so insane.

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“Name the general or it didn’t happen”
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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"Excuse me sir, but you're full of shit. NOBODY believes you."
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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I forget who, but someone has coined these nonsense tales his "Sir Stories" because no matter the person, another leader or a family member or whatever, they call him "sir" and not Mr. President or whatever and its a dead giveaway he's made it up.
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Not sure if Dale initiated that term but he’s definitely a proponent and highlights them all of the time.
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mister d wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 5:44 pm I forget who, but someone has coined these nonsense tales his "Sir Stories" because no matter the person, another leader or a family member or whatever, they call him "sir" and not Mr. President or whatever and its a dead giveaway he's made it up.
It's Daniel Dale...who used to be with the Toronto Sun, and is now with CNN.

Here's a story he wrote up about the 'Sir Stories'. 'Sir' alert: This one word is a telltale sign Trump is being dishonest
I've fact-checked every word Trump has uttered since his inauguration. I can tell you that if this President relays an anecdote in which he has someone referring to him as "sir," then some major component of the anecdote is very likely to be wrong.

Lots of people do call Trump "sir," of course. But the word seems to pop into his head more frequently when he is inventing or exaggerating a conversation than when he is faithfully relaying one. A "sir" is a flashing red light that he is speaking from his imagination rather than his memory.

In poker parlance, it's a tell.

Trump has told false "sir" stories on all manner of subjects: health care, the Middle East, the courts, unions and -- just last week -- both tariffs and social media. But no genre of Trump story is more reliably sir-heavy than his collection of suspiciously similar tales about macho men breaking into tears of gratitude in his presence.

In a speech in January, Trump painted a colorful picture of the "strong, tough" farmers, ranchers and builders who stood behind him in 2017 as he signed an executive order to rescind a water regulation. "Half of them were crying," he told the American Farm Bureau Federation, especially one man so tough he might not have cried even "when he was a baby."

"He was crying," Trump repeated. "He said, 'Sir, you gave me back my life. You gave me back my property.'"
Touching if true. Absolutely not true.
Dale is a great follow on Twitter...he fact checks Trump's speeches in real-time.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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For what it’s worth I didn’t need the “sir” to know Trump was lying about the United States military not having any ammunition.
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If anything we have plenty of ammo, but a total lack of people who provide weapons training and a total lack of opportunities to do so.

But the bigger deployment issue is the base passport office. Because of a lack of a State Department nobody is getting a passport in time no matter how early you start the process.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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brian wrote: Mon Oct 07, 2019 6:22 pm For what it’s worth I didn’t need the “sir” to know Trump was lying about the United States military not having any ammunition.
Easy to say that now.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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So another person ordered not to testify. Can one of these people, should they have enough spine to do so, just ignore and go ahead and head down to the house for a hearing? Or would secret service/white house security stop them?
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I guess, but would you want to try and solve Giuliani's riddles three?
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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A_B wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:25 am So another person ordered not to testify. Can one of these people, should they have enough spine to do so, just ignore and go ahead and head down to the house for a hearing? Or would secret service/white house security stop them?
Pretty sure all Sondland needed to do was to resign from his post and he’d be then free to testify. But that would take integrity. So don’t bank on that happening.
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A_B wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:25 am So another person ordered not to testify. Can one of these people, should they have enough spine to do so, just ignore and go ahead and head down to the house for a hearing? Or would secret service/white house security stop them?
If these people had any integrity or a shred of care for the Constitution, rule of law or the good of our democracy, they wouldn't have worked for Trump in the first place.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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The only reason not to subpoena him and then arrest him for refusing to honor the subpoena I can think of is that the Dems know that will precipitate making end of the republic official when they try do it and the order to arrest is not carried out.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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tennbengal wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:52 am The only reason not to subpoena him and then arrest him for refusing to honor the subpoena I can think of is that the Dems know that will precipitate making end of the republic official when they try do it and the order to arrest is not carried out.
I hear you, still a little early for that yet, but ultimately that option has to be retained. For now, it's additional evidence to also add obstruction of justice to Trump's articles of impeachment. As ever, the coverup is worse than the crime. That's why Hillary testified for 11 hours in a farce Benghazi hearing. The battle is being fought by trying to tease out why Trump won't let any of these people testify if the conversation was "perfect". It's just great timing that the battle to hide his tax returns is being fought on another front because it really ties the whole thing together. Americans love a conspiracy and a great one is "what is Trump hiding?"
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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tennbengal wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:52 am The only reason not to subpoena him and then arrest him for refusing to honor the subpoena I can think of is that the Dems know that will precipitate making end of the republic official when they try do it and the order to arrest is not carried out.
And this might be the one area where I'm ok with backing off. I have the feeling most Republicans aren't ready for an all-out crisis like that either so if you think there's a way to wait out either the 2020 vote or Trump's dying brain versus lighting that match, I get it.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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The Sybian wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 9:32 am
A_B wrote: Tue Oct 08, 2019 8:25 am So another person ordered not to testify. Can one of these people, should they have enough spine to do so, just ignore and go ahead and head down to the house for a hearing? Or would secret service/white house security stop them?
If these people had any integrity or a shred of care for the Constitution, rule of law or the good of our democracy, they wouldn't have worked for Trump in the first place.
It seems to me that the Constitution is like God or Jesus - people use it as a crutch or justification when it is convenient, but try everything they can to not follow the rules it sets out.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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I don't know if it's possible to have pre-schaudenfreude but the Nobel Peace Prize is being announced at 6 a.m. Eastern time on Friday.

Fact: It is not going to Donald Trump.
Fact: For some reason, his peabrain somehow seems to think he deserves one, probably because Obama won one (under a pretty sketchy pretext to be fair, but still).
Fact: It is probably going to Greta Thunberg.
Fact: Trump might be having an epic Twitter meltdown Friday morning, so that will be a fun way to start the weekend.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Just another kid who peaked in high school! Sad!
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Our Republican savior is here, you guys! The man that will change the minds of other Republicans and save the republic at large!

Ol' Willard Mittens!

Rpt: Romney sees himself as key player in impeachment trial
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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The subpoena cannon has been fired.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/national ... nal&wpmk=1

Good. About damn time, frankly. I don't care if it lights a match, this shit is out and out obstruction.

And fuck Lindsey Graham and the durr hurr House Gop morons tearing down our institutions on an hourly basis. Special place in hell for these fucking morons.
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Re: Trump Admin Meltdown Thread Part IV - Welcome to Stupid Watergate

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Trump's strategy to obstruct and slowplay at every turn is honestly probably the smartest strategy given his obvious guilt, but he doesn't have enough time to run out the clock before the election. If it means it takes until January or February to collect as much evidence as possible and vote on impeachment then, so be it. But this is gonna happen and Trump and his goober subordinates are going to get dragged for months in the process.
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