Assassinating foreign leaders
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Assassinating foreign leaders
Seems bad. But I only dabble at history , so maybe I am off on this.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I mean. Shoulda waited for the Friday news dump at least.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
This clip is from June but it’s pretty apropos now:
Sanders has done more to oppose Trump’s escalation toward war with Iran than any other Senator. He was the only Senator to vote against increased sanctions on Iran (a proposal which the GOP cynically tied to sanctions against Russia) and also voted against Trump’s military budget.
Sanders has done more to oppose Trump’s escalation toward war with Iran than any other Senator. He was the only Senator to vote against increased sanctions on Iran (a proposal which the GOP cynically tied to sanctions against Russia) and also voted against Trump’s military budget.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Well, at least I'm not deployed to the Middle East right now.
Wait.
Shit.
Wait.
Shit.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
There is always a tweet...
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I'm not sure this is an escalation. Your embassy was attacked and action was taken. We'll see what happens next but there is a huge spectrum of options between this action by a state in response to an attack on it's own soil and some kind of future full blown invasion.
My prediction is that Iran got its hand caught in the cookie jar and will quietly walk away.
My prediction is that Iran got its hand caught in the cookie jar and will quietly walk away.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Well this looks like an interesting read. Let's see...
Hypersonic Missiles Are a Game Changer
doodoodoo...
Hypersonic Missiles Are a Game Changer
doodoodoo...
Written on 2 Jan, hours before the strike. 😳Moreover, hypersonics are a weaponized moral hazard for states with a taste for intervention, because they erase barriers to picking fights. Is an adversary building something that might be a weapons factory? Is there an individual in an unfriendly country who cannot be apprehended? What if the former commander of Iran’s Revolutionary Guards, Qassem Soleimani, visits Baghdad for a meeting and you know the address? The temptations to use hypersonic missiles will be many.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Well, this thread is just dandy.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
There’s also a huge spectrum of options in response to a window getting broken at a US embassy before we get to “assassinate one of the most powerful figures in the Middle East.” It’s not just the Iranian government that could take action but all kinds of Shi’a groups and non-state actors. Already things have gotten a lot more unstable in Iraq if Sadr is going to do this.degenerasian wrote: ↑Fri Jan 03, 2020 1:49 am I'm not sure this is an escalation. Your embassy was attacked and action was taken. We'll see what happens next but there is a huge spectrum of options between this action by a state in response to an attack on it's own soil and some kind of future full blown invasion.
My prediction is that Iran got its hand caught in the cookie jar and will quietly walk away.
Also, this is an important point that needs to be repeated ad nauseum until the Democratic leadership actually starts trying to *lead* on foreign policy issues.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
It's only bad if the foreign country has the capability to make things ugly for us.tennbengal wrote: ↑Thu Jan 02, 2020 9:11 pm Seems bad. But I only dabble at history , so maybe I am off on this.
So no worries!
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Pretty good short thread from freshman Congresswoman from Michigan who is a former CIA analyst and expert on Iran.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Is the secondary "benefit" for these fucks that domestic retaliation would more likely take place post-election so either Trump wins and who cares or the Dems win and blame them?
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
They’re not thinking on that level. War with Iran has been a goal of neo-Con hardliners for at least 15 years. Remember when St. McCain sang “bomb Iran” during a 2008 campaign event?
And Israel and Saudi Arabia — the two counties that probably influence Trump’s foreign policy more than any others — would love nothing more than for the US to do their dirty work and start a shooting war with Iran.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I would think the goal would be to time a retaliation for right before the next election so everyone rallies around the flag.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Can you imagine what a Bush Did 9/11 would look like under Trump? All his lowest performing properties would be "attacked by terrorists" with his top people all happening to be off-site on that day.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Trump wouldn't get the ball to home plate
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Nice work with the umlaut, New Yorker.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Heh
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Umlauts are in their text style guide but had no idea that cartoonists had to adhere.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I over-analyzed it as a sly reference to the Reichstag fire.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Heh.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
One thing I've noticed in the various news reports...in the timeline for all this, it started with killing of a US 'contractor'.
That 'contractor' was a mercenary, right? Most likely from Blackwater, right? Has anyone seen Erik Prince hanging around Mar-A-Lago lately?
That 'contractor' was a mercenary, right? Most likely from Blackwater, right? Has anyone seen Erik Prince hanging around Mar-A-Lago lately?
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Someone help me out here: That thing about two trillion dollars on military equipment ... wtf? Isn’t that like three times the entire defense budget?
I’m seeing lots of folks talking about what else we could do with $2 trillion, but is that number even close to accurate?
I’m seeing lots of folks talking about what else we could do with $2 trillion, but is that number even close to accurate?
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
He loves lying about military spending. People taking it at face value even if just to argue how it could better be spent probably doesn’t help.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Lots of info in this thread. Davidson wrote an article in 2017 outlining Trump orgs ties with the IRG through a Tump hotel deal in Azerbaijan.
Did you see that ludicrous display last night?
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Best description of all this now: we just added Stupid Iran Contra to Stupid Watergate.
mister d wrote:Couldn't have pegged me better.
EnochRoot wrote:I mean, whatever. Johnnie's all hot cuz I ride him.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Couldn’t we have just withdrawn from Iraq without assassinating anyone or causing any major geopolitical crises? I thought Middle East mastermind Jared Kushner was better than this.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
This is weird.
The Iraqi PM tells the US to leave, and they are actually leaving?
What is going to happen next in Iraq? (Sincere, not sarcastic question)
The Iraqi PM tells the US to leave, and they are actually leaving?
What is going to happen next in Iraq? (Sincere, not sarcastic question)
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Iraq will be essentially be controlled by Russia and Iran, much like Syria now.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
Neat. The people that support the party that unabashedly worships the military should now see what an awful idea killing thousands of American troops over the course of a 10 year war was and the progressives should have their unwavering support now that they've seen the error of their ways. Everything comes up roses.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
The Intelligence and Military communities say Russia controlling Iraq is bad for the US, but Putin said it's good for the US, so I believe Putin.
In all seriousness, I don't know what to make out of all of this. While I don't like keeping troops in Iraq, the thought of withdrawing them scares me. Especially when Trump withdraws in capitulation to Iraq requesting we withdraw because Trump assassinated a powerful Iranian general. Yes, there is some truth that I tend to think Trump withdrawing troops is bad, while I probably would have been more comfortable with Obama withdrawing troops. Is this "Trump Derangement Syndrome" or Obama worship? Maybe to a degree, but I also know Obama would have listened to all advice from all of the most knowledgeable and intelligent people, and carefully weighed the scenarios. Did he make wrong decisions in hindsight? Absolutely. I think I'm justified in believing Trump makes decisions without much concern over long term strategy or care over whether it benefits the US. He will act without knowledge or information, and will impulsively do whatever he thinks has the most immediate benefit to himself. He publicly proclaims himself smarter and better informed than all the generals and Intel communities, not to mention he completely gutted the State Department and cut the balls off the Intel agencies, so he doesn't even have the extent or reliability of the information Obama or every other President had.
We are so fucked, and it amazes me the power of blind loyalty.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
This is becoming a VEEP episode...
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
These guys are such incompetents.
In all honesty, if the assassination requires us to bug out of Iraq, so be it. I've wanted us to withdraw from there for years, and while I'd prefer an orderly withdrawal under a competent president, I don't think a chaotic withdrawal under an incompetent president would be much different.
And his one problem is he didn’t go to Russia that night because he had extracurricular activities, and they froze to death.
Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I strongly agree with this view. And frankly, I don’t think the US should be using military and economic resources to limit Iranian influence in Iraq. Iran and Iraq have significant geographic and cultural ties and it’s probably better that they are allies than enemies, like they were when they fought a brutal war in the 1980s. That war (which we intervened in by giving weapons to Saddam) imposed a terrible toll on both countries.Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Jan 06, 2020 5:05 pm These guys are such incompetents.
In all honesty, if the assassination requires us to bug out of Iraq, so be it. I've wanted us to withdraw from there for years, and while I'd prefer an orderly withdrawal under a competent president, I don't think a chaotic withdrawal under an incompetent president would be much different.
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Re: Assassinating foreign leaders
I think we need a better explanation then this. A cruise missile isn't going to follow a civilian take off profile then that. Plus the whole transponder and size compared to a relatively stealth cruise missile that's tiny and would show up tiny on screen.
I think that if Iran wants to really fix this then beyond the black box, they need to deliver the data recordings from the battery that fired to see what they saw, as well as access to the crew of the battery and the commander of the areas air defense network.
I think that Trudeau and the other countries effected need to push on this pretty hard for answers and compensation.
At least they could have said we thought it was a bomber etc. This explanation is hard to buy into.
Ukraine wants everything.
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