The Nostalgiaganza

[The Sybian]

Bapo!, there is a book in all of your nostaliaganzing. Or maybe a website with accompanying links. Something. You need to make a career out of this. If John Hein could get rich off of Jump the Shark, you should be too. Have you thought about rewatching the 1993 Islanders playoff run? You've inspired me. That was the greatest sports postseason, except for 1986 Mets. More exciting in that nobody expected them to win a series, and they made it to the Conference Finals by winning a bunch of games in OT. My parents didn't let me stay up to watch the end of some of those games, since they could have gone on for hours, so I taped all the OT games and woke up early before school to watch. My mother gave me a rough guess at what time the games ended, so I could FF through more action to get to see the game winner. The Isles only year winning a playoff series in something like 28 years. 5 or 6 dry years before, and a lot after. I have vague memories of watching the Isles dynasty's last Cup win, but I was too young to really understand what I was watching. I remember being really confused about why they were all dumping cans of Bud on each other in the locker room.

[Pruitt]

As a young Browns fan, I loved Don Cockroft. For most of his career, he punted as well.

I was a big Gary Anderson fan as a kid. I was always drawn to kickers and goalies.

Billy Sims could have been an all time great if he didn't get hurt. Absolutely phenomenal. he and Bo Jackson are two "what ifs"

There's a 1981 Lions/Chiefs Thanksgiving Day game that's sad to watch. The two stars are Sims and Joe Delaney. Both among the very best running backs in the league. Delaney would drown a couple of years later, and then Sims would ruin his knee.

Sims' first four games in the league in 1980: 153 rushing yards, 64 receiving yards, 3 TDs; 134 rushing yards, 94 receiving yards, 2 TDs; 95 rushing yards, 22 receiving yards, 1 TD; 157 rushing yards, 26 receiving yards.

Joe Delaney! Wow.

And I remember the first Curt Warner - guy was great for 5 or so seasons. Just looked up his rookie numbers:

335/1449 yds, 42 receptions, 14 TDs.

They should pay Running Backs more in their first contract, because some really great ones never saw a second one.

ETA: What Syb said.

[The Sybian]

ETA: What Syb said.

Right, everybody loves the 93 Isles!

[bapo!]

Um, we don't talk about David Volek and the '93 Isles in this thread. That Penguins team was probably better than the two previous teams, which had won Cups, and then they lost in the first round. Gahhh!

My '90s sports knowledge is rather hazy due to college, early-20s stuff, and lack of cable. I want to revisit that era of hockey, but I'm not sure how much I would enjoy it. Way too much obstruction, and 1995-2005 was pretty dull. But 1993 would be fun, I think.

Todd Denault wrote a supposedly excellent book about the '92-'93 season called 'A Season In Time.' (Haven't read it yet. I have read his book about the 1975 New Year's Eve game between the Canadiens and Central Red Army, and it's sublime.) That was Mario's cancer year, the controversial Kings/Leafs series, the Habs winning, etc.

In theory, I'm a fan of Bure, Mogilny, Selanne, and Kariya, but I just haven't watched enough. Some day, maybe.

[The Sybian]

Um, we don't talk about David Volek and the '93 Isles in this thread. That Penguins team was probably better than the two previous teams, which had won Cups, and then they lost in the first round. Gahhh!

My '90s sports knowledge is rather hazy due to college, early-20s stuff, and lack of cable. I want to revisit that era of hockey, but I'm not sure how much I would enjoy it. Way too much obstruction, and 1995-2005 was pretty dull. But 1993 would be fun, I think.

Todd Denault wrote a supposedly excellent book about the '92-'93 season called 'A Season In Time.' (Haven't read it yet. I have read his book about the 1975 New Year's Eve game between the Canadiens and Central Red Army, and it's sublime.) That was Mario's cancer year, the controversial Kings/Leafs series, the Habs winning, etc.

In theory, I'm a fan of Bure, Mogilny, Selanne, and Kariya, but I just haven't watched enough. Some day, maybe.

That was the second round. Isles beat the Caps, Pens beat the Devils. The Caps series was amazing. Isles lose the first game, win the next 3 in OT (2 double OTs), then the Isles win the series in Game 6, with Dale Hunter delivering the worst cheap shot in history. Turgeon separated his shoulder and was thought to be out for the rest of the playoffs, but came back I think towards the end of the Pens series. I'll spare you the Pens series recap, but was that the series when Pilon collided with Kevin Stevens, knocking Pilon unconscious and Stevens faceplanting and breaking his entire face? [Google confirms, did NOT need to read the details of the facial reconstruction surgery. Fuck, how do surgeons do it?]

Crazy how old footage from 1993 looks. Always depresses me when I show my son a highlight from my heyday, and he can't get past how bad TV was when I was young. Come on, focus on Barry Sanders' skills!

[EnochRoot]

Clearly the best 93-94 NHL was experienced on Sega, no?

[mister d]

Does Hunter ever play again if that happens in this years playoffs? Best case after a full season?

[Rush2112]

Clearly the best 93-94 NHL was experienced on Sega, no?

You're probably the guy to appreciate this. 96 Phish Red Rocks (the riot year!) my buddy and I hitch a ride up from ABQ with another dude coming to to the shows, but also to visit his GF whose in grad school at DU, so we get dropped off the first night and we were going to just crash in the woods (we were poorish and my money was for drugs and beer) we ended up talking to a guy and his girl that were selling some craft thing and ended up just hanging with them all night. When the lot was packing up they asked where we were sleeping and then they invited us back to his brother's pad where we ended up playing NHL until like 4 in the morning. He then called around the next morning and found some place selling Newcastle for 9$! a case! I bought 10 cases, sold them in the lot 3$ or 2 for 5! and paid my next month's rent.

[MaxWebster]

quick interruption - can confirm.

(something about that 1993 season - i'm sure in no small part to nostalgiaganza - really stays with me. Aside from it being in many ways the end of the 80s-era of hockey on a personal level i feel like that was a final irresponsible year for me :P - fresh outta college, single, making dogshit for cash but didn't matter. also the Sabres swept the Bruins while i lived in Boston which is a cause for all-time celebration)

carry on, bapo!

Todd Denault wrote a supposedly excellent book about the '92-'93 season called 'A Season In Time.' (Haven't read it yet. I have read his book about the 1975 New Year's Eve game between the Canadiens and Central Red Army, and it's sublime.) That was Mario's cancer year, the controversial Kings/Leafs series, the Habs winning, etc.

In theory, I'm a fan of Bure, Mogilny, Selanne, and Kariya, but I just haven't watched enough. Some day, maybe.

[bapo!]

And I remember the first Curt Warner - guy was great for 5 or so seasons. Just looked up his rookie numbers:

335/1449 yds, 42 receptions, 14 TDs.

They should pay Running Backs more in their first contract, because some really great ones never saw a second one.

I watched the 1982 college football season. I picked that year because Pitt and Penn State were both still relevant (Penn State won the national championship), and there was a lot of starpower that year. You mentioned Curt Warner. Other running backs in 1982: Herschel Walker, Eric Dickerson, Craig James, Marcus Dupree, Mike Rozier, Bo Jackson, and Dalton Hilliard. It was fun to watch football and actually care about the running backs. I don't think you're allowed to do that anymore.

And a quick follow-up about the straight-ahead kickers. I mentioned Danmeier, Cockcroft, and Moseley as being the last of their ilk. That's not technically true. There was a dude named Dirk Borgognone. He kicked a 68-yarder in high school. After that, his coach only had him kick 50+yarders, and he missed his last 8 kicks. Great way to build confidence. He played a couple of games in the NFL in 1995, but he was only used for kick-offs.

[Pruitt]

Incredible how quickly running backs burn out (not a revelation, but still)

Anyone else remember George Rogers? 378 rushes as a Saints rookie.

[Steve of phpBB]

Um, we don't talk about David Volek and the '93 Isles in this thread. That Penguins team was probably better than the two previous teams, which had won Cups, and then they lost in the first round. Gahhh!

My '90s sports knowledge is rather hazy due to college, early-20s stuff, and lack of cable. I want to revisit that era of hockey, but I'm not sure how much I would enjoy it. Way too much obstruction, and 1995-2005 was pretty dull. But 1993 would be fun, I think.

Todd Denault wrote a supposedly excellent book about the '92-'93 season called 'A Season In Time.' (Haven't read it yet. I have read his book about the 1975 New Year's Eve game between the Canadiens and Central Red Army, and it's sublime.) That was Mario's cancer year, the controversial Kings/Leafs series, the Habs winning, etc.

In theory, I'm a fan of Bure, Mogilny, Selanne, and Kariya, but I just haven't watched enough. Some day, maybe.

Just write a book about one game.

[bapo!]

Incredible how quickly running backs burn out (not a revelation, but still)

Anyone else remember George Rogers? 378 rushes as a Saints rookie.

378 carries is insane. In his last two years at South Carolina, he had 311 carries (12 games) and 297 carries (11 games).

Looked up this year's numbers in the NFL. Derrick Henry had...378 carries. (Dalvin Cook had 312.) Last year, Henry, Ezekiel Elliot, and Nick Chubb were all around 300. That's an awful lot of punishment.

Henry is probably the only running back today who makes me a little dreamy. I love watching him. A few years ago, I really enjoyed Le'Veon Bell and Todd Gurley, but that didn't work out too well. Never fall in love with a running back or a pitcher. Or a goalie.

[bapo!]

I'll spare you the Pens series recap, but was that the series when Pilon collided with Kevin Stevens, knocking Pilon unconscious and Stevens faceplanting and breaking his entire face? [Google confirms, did NOT need to read the details of the facial reconstruction surgery. Fuck, how do surgeons do it?]

I remember this, of course, but I don't know too many of the details. Probably a good thing that it happened before the Internet era. And I have no inclination to look it up now.

I haven't rewatched any of those '80s/'90s Pens games yet. I should. Lemieux alone is worth watching, and those were really fun teams. I'm curious to see Stevens again. He was always a fan favorite here. There were more Kevin Stevens types back then -- big tough guys who could score and fight. Guys like Cam Neely and Jeremy Roenick. Those guys were never my favorites, but I understand the appeal.

[sancarlos]

I'll spare you the Pens series recap, but was that the series when Pilon collided with Kevin Stevens, knocking Pilon unconscious and Stevens faceplanting and breaking his entire face? [Google confirms, did NOT need to read the details of the facial reconstruction surgery. Fuck, how do surgeons do it?]

I remember this, of course, but I don't know too many of the details. Probably a good thing that it happened before the Internet era. And I have no inclination to look it up now.

I haven't rewatched any of those '80s/'90s Pens games yet. I should. Lemieux alone is worth watching, and those were really fun teams. I'm curious to see Stevens again. He was always a fan favorite here. There were more Kevin Stevens types back then -- big tough guys who could score and fight. Guys like Cam Neely and Jeremy Roenick. Those guys were never my favorites, but I understand the appeal.

Of course you probably know about Kevin Stevens's more recent notoriety, right?

During the 1999–2000 season, Stevens struggled. Not only did he rarely see the ice during this season, but after a game against the St. Louis Blues, he was caught in an East St. Louis, Illinois motel with a prostitute and crack cocaine. After this event, Stevens entered the NHL/NHLPA Substance Abuse and Behavioral Health Program...

...In May 2016, Stevens and a co-defendant were charged with conspiracy and possession with intent to distribute oxycodone.[5]

In May 2017, Stevens entered a guilty plea in a Boston federal court and was sentenced to probation, community service and a $10,000 fine. Stevens admitted to being addicted to prescription drugs since May 1993 (see above) when he sustained massive injuries during a game – an addiction that destroyed his marriage and his post-playing career in hockey.

On January 13, 2018, Stevens' recovery from addiction and his subsequent community service was presented in a 30-minute documentary entitled "Shattered" which aired on Sportsnet, a Canadian sports channel.

[bapo!]

Yeah, Stevens' story is well known here. Still as popular as ever. If fans are ever allowed to attend Penguins games again, you'll see a few fans wearing his jerseys.

And learning that his drug history dates back specifically to that injury is not surprising.

[bapo!]

Since we're talking puck, and this Ning/Wings game isn't retaining my interest, I want to mention a game I watched a while ago. Penguins/Canucks, 1/19/1977. Broadcast on WIIC-Pittsburgh Channel 11. (WIIC is now WPXI.)

I usually enjoy home broadcasts more than national broadcasts, especially if the commercials are included. They just feel more personal. I miss the days when local stations would preempt the network to air local sports. This was a late-night game, so Johnny Carson didn't air in Pittsburgh that night. Knowing how prickly and attentive Carson was, I'm sure that WIIC's station manager received a very unpleasant phone call.

The broadcast opens with the aforementioned Sam Nover welcoming viewers to WIIC's 'first telecast ever from west of the Mississippi!'

Nover's regular partner is absent due to a prior commitment with another hockey job, so Nover is joined in the booth by Greg Douglas, the Canucks' Assistant General Manager and Public Relations Director. Could you imagine something like this happening today? Nover and Douglas work well together. Questionable opinions about manliness aside, Nover was an excellent sportscaster.

The game is worth watching if you're interested in local broadcasts or '70s hockey. One awful moment stands out, tho. About 42 minutes in, Mike Robitaille is elbowed and knocked out. He's pretty much dragged off the ice, then given this stellar medical care by the Canucks staff.



This was the end of his career, and he later sued the Canucks for their mistreatment.

[rass]

Don't take this personally but you're an asshole* for including that final line below the picture.



*because I can't be the asshole for laughing at the photo

[bapo!]

Yeah, I understand. Like, it's so ridiculous that you want to laugh, right?

So many of these old games have casual comments about concussions. And then to see the medical staff react like this? I'm glad that we've made some progress since then.

If it's any consolation, Robitaille won the lawsuit.

[MaxWebster]

I am 100% going to watch that - Mike Robitaille is a bit of a legend in WNY. He played a few years in Buffalo when they started to go from interesting to near-great and was traded to the Canucks the year they went to the finals (74-75). Anyways his infamy initially was for breaking Gil Perreault's leg but true fame was becoming a fantastic colour commentator for Sabres' broadcasts from the mid 80s through the 90s. Was excellent - as a bold college kid in Boston I chatted him up in the Garden and it went exactly as I'd hoped. Him firing up a cigarette btwn periods, swiveling on his chair, and talking Sabres hockey w this then-19 yr old. (plus he helped me get on TV that night)

[EnochRoot]

Clearly the best 93-94 NHL was experienced on Sega, no?

You're probably the guy to appreciate this. 96 Phish Red Rocks (the riot year!) my buddy and I hitch a ride up from ABQ with another dude coming to to the shows, but also to visit his GF whose in grad school at DU, so we get dropped off the first night and we were going to just crash in the woods (we were poorish and my money was for drugs and beer) we ended up talking to a guy and his girl that were selling some craft thing and ended up just hanging with them all night. When the lot was packing up they asked where we were sleeping and then they invited us back to his brother's pad where we ended up playing NHL until like 4 in the morning. He then called around the next morning and found some place selling Newcastle for 9$! a case! I bought 10 cases, sold them in the lot 3$ or 2 for 5! and paid my next month's rent.

Thank you, and yes I do! What's great about having all those like-minded balls-in-the-air is they tend to land in um..concert.

Reminds me of how I paid for my times touring around the southeast following Phish between 93 and 95! I'd describe what I did but I'd come out looking bad.

[bapo!]

I was thinking about Renee Richards recently. Wondered if anybody had ever written a biography about her. Turns out she's written two autobiographies, in 1983 and 2007.

The first book, 'Second Serve,' is a narrative of Richards' decades-long struggle to become herself. Reading anything about trans people from another era is interesting because the subject was handled so much differently then. Even a mass-market autobiography is different, because it feels a greater need to explain, to justify. In 1983, a lot of that explanation and justification involved blaming her family.

The second book, in addition to covering the years after 'Second Serve' was published, does a bit of recapping, but the tone isn't so life-or-death. And it spends more time going into detail on the stuff that I find interesting: her time on the professional tour, coaching Martina Navritilova, etc. Also, the second book has a lot more about her Jewish background. I don't think the first book mentioned that at all. It's like the editors/publishers thought, 'Look, this story is already daring enough. We can't talk about that, too.'

There are strange little details in her life. The news reporter who outed her on a San Diego newscast was Tucker Carlson's father. And when she decided to sue to be allowed to play professionally, she hired Roy Cohn. And Bobby Riggs makes a couple of cameos, and he's a fascinating character in his own right.

I remembered watching a made-for-tv movie when I was a kid. Looked that up and rewatched it. 'Second Serve' aired on CBS on 5/13/1986. It's...about what you would expect from a 1986 made-for-tv movie about a trans person. But Vanessa Redgrave is pretty great, so there's that. Unfortunately, she's right-handed, and Richards is left-handed, so the tennis scenes are completely unbelievable. If this movie were made today, I would organize a boycott campaign because Hollywood cast somebody who wasn't 6'1" and left-handed to play the lead.

[sancarlos]

That book sounds interesting!

[bapo!]

As I was reading Richards' first book, I was trying to find clips and matches to watch online. There isn't much available. I know that she was interviewed by Howard Cosell, and I'm a mark for all things Cosell-related, but it's unavailable.

I thought that she had played World Team Tennis, which is one of those Weird '70s Things I've been meaning to examine. Oddly, in the first book, she mentions that she was asked to play in 1977, then was not allowed to join the team. She neglects to mention that she played in 1978.

The second book spends a lot of time talking about her season with the Sun Belt (New Orleans) Nets, especially about her mixed-doubles partner, John Lucas. Wait, the basketball player? Yes. He was an All-American in basketball and tennis at the University of Maryland. He was a very nice player.

Another search unearthed this 6/17/1978 match between the Sun Belt Nets and the Anaheim Oranges. Julie Heldman and Vic Braden have the call for HBO. Heldman is a former professional player who tries hard as a broadcaster. The match is held in St. Louis, nowhere near Anaheim nor the Sun Belt, unless the Sun Belt has been reimagined since the '70s.

World Team Tennis was played at hockey/basketball arenas in front of sparse crowds on multicolored carpet. No-ad scoring. Teams played one set each in men's and women's singles, men's and women's doubles, and mixed doubles. Substitutions were allowed. Low-key atmosphere.

In their match, Richards and Lucas play Francoise Durr and Anand Armitraj. Durr won 26 singles and 60 doubles tournaments on the tour. Armitraj had two brothers who also played professionally. Both played for the Los Angeles World Team Tennis team. Vijay Armitraj is this guy:



Richards/Lucas win their set in a tie-breaker, but then lose a super-tie-breaker, which I guess was a Team Tennis thing. Anaheim wins the match, 28-27.

Richards didn't have much of a second serve, but had very nice hands around the net. There were parts of her game that made me jealous. The broadcasters really wanted her to do well, complimenting every little thing she did.

After the match, Anaheim captain Cliff Drysdale is interviewed. So weird to hear that voice connected to a much younger guy. I've always liked his commentary on tennis, but I never knew he was so dreamy.

[sancarlos]

Name the Swamper on whose couch Vijay Amritraj slept.

[bapo!]

Name the Swamper on whose couch Vijay Amritraj slept.

Ha! Something definitely clicked in my head when I heard the name. Now I feel nostalgic for old Swamp avatars.

[The Sybian]

Name the Swamper on whose couch Vijay Amritraj slept.

JLo, right?

[Pruitt]

[bapo!]

The Pittsburgh Penguins made a curious move last week, creating the position of President of Hockey Operations and hiring Brian Burke. And, one can assume, Vice President of Truculence and Assistant Director of Barn Fights.

One of the local radio guys (who might have been Mark Madden) said that he had read Burke's book, and he came off as an unlikable bully. I'm reading it now, and I think I agree. I like Burke as a personality, but what he values in hockey players, human beings, and personal interactions is just so far away from what I value. This was published in 2020, but it could have been published in 1975. I want him nowhere near the Penguins' decision-making process.

Anybody else ever read an autobiography that made you like the author less? It's always weird when it happens. Like, they can control the narrative, so why write the book that way? Off the top of my head, I remember: Peter Criss (KISS drummer), Theoren Fleury (hockey player with a nightmare of a personal life; this is a whole 'nother conversation), Ashley Blue (porn star), and Dusty Rhodes (wrestler). I've also read all of Donald Trump's books, but I read those with the intention of hating them. I wasn't disappointed.

That said, Burke's book is very entertaining. And I haven't even read the Todd Bertuzzi chapter yet. His chapter about the 1999 NHL Draft and his work to draft the Sedin twins is interesting. I didn't realize how complicated that was. He had the #3 pick. Then he traded for the #4 pick. Traded the #4 pick for the #1 pick. Then traded the #1 for the #2 so that he would have consecutive picks and be able to announce both Sedins at once.

The first round of that draft is on YouTube. I just watched it. These are always fun. All of those shiny happy teenagers. But man, what a forgettable draft. This was the Dark Ages of the NHL, and I didn't really check back until after the lockout a few years later. But still, I thought I would have at least recognized more than a handful of names.

Only 9 players in the first round played more than 400 games. 12 players played fewer than 100 games. (5 of those played 4 games or fewer.) The Flyers took a goalie in the first round, with predictable results. Brutal.

[sancarlos]

With Burke there, I expect the Pens to offer a #1 for Ryan Reaves any day now.

[mister d]

They could really use a young (bigoted) offensive RHD.

[bapo!]

With Burke there, I expect the Pens to offer a #1 for Ryan Reaves any day now.

That was my first thought, too. Maybe the second time will be a charm. One of GM Jim Rutherford's many missteps here. He left behind a complicated legacy.

One more note about that 1999 draft. Other than the Sedins, the name that most resonates with me is Kris Beech. Taken #7 by Washington. He came to Pittsburgh a couple of years later in the ill-fated Jaromir Jagr trade. (This was after Jagr talked about 'dying alive.') Michal Sivek and Ross Lupashuk were also in that deal. Those names make Penguins fans break out in hives. Beech scored 10 goals for the Penguins in 95 games.

The Pens' own #1 pick that year, Konstantin Koltsov, scored 12 goals in 144 games.

[govmentchedda]

Bolts first pick in that draft was none other than Sheldon Keefe (2nd round).

[Ryan]

I was pretty much at the height of my college hockey fandom that year and I thought Jeff Jillson was a fucking god.

[mister d]

Gotta be honest I hate the 1999 draft in hindsight. Only bright side is we eventually got Mr. Beautiful Eyes (8th overall) for a few years at the end of his career.

[bapo!]

Gotta be honest I hate the 1999 draft in hindsight.

#4 overall, Pavel Brendl. 11 goals/22 points in 78 career games. Yikes.

There are Sivek (38 games, 3 goals) and Lupashuk (3 games, 0 goals) right at the top of the second round.

Henrik Zetterberg, probably the third-best forward in the draft, went in the 7th round. (So did Martin Erat and Radim Vrbata.) Notable: Craig Anderson in the 3rd round, Ryan Malone in the 4th, Ryan Miller in the 5th.

George Parros, who is now in charge of player safety, went in the 8th round.

[sancarlos]

I was pretty much at the height of my college hockey fandom that year and I thought Jeff Jillson was a fucking god.

We kept waiting for him to show his talent in San Jose. And waiting... and waiting...

[Sabo]

George Parros, who is now in charge of player safety

Doesn't this belong in the Irony thread?

[bapo!]

George Parros, who is now in charge of player safety

Doesn't this belong in the Irony thread?

Brian Burke used to be in that role. Then Colin Campbell. I guess they thought Brendan Shanahan was too respected, so they went back to their roots.

[sancarlos]

George Parros, who is now in charge of player safety

Doesn't this belong in the Irony thread?

Brian Burke used to be in that role. Then Colin Campbell. I guess they thought Brendan Shanahan was too respected, so they went back to their roots.

Don't forget Stephane Quintal. He's another guy who was a fighter as a player who was in in that role for awhile.