NHL 2021 Offseason

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:03 am

Yep. Symptomatic, but as of yet nothing severe or hospitalization.

I get that MY experience is a very small sample size, but that's also a pretty high % of the people that I know that went to the games.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:08 am

Yeah, that's disheartening.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:14 am

Pretty sure none of them wore masks.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:41 am

San Jose are in cap hell. We need General Manager sancarlos to resolve this.

Over 30% of cap tied up in Burns (8M, 36), Karlsson (11.5M, 31) and Vlasic (7M, 35) for the next 4+ years. Karlsson is signed for 6 more years at 11.5M. He hasn't aged well at all.

They have over 70% of their cap tied up in only 9 players. Hertl is the only contract ending next year. Couture's contract is starting to look really bad and they have 6 more years 8M until he is 38. They have even managed to overpay their younger players with Meier making 6M after one decent season. Is Kane tradeable at this point making 7M? Its a hot mess! Is there any plausible way they can be competitive in the next 5 years?

It's interesting to judge if the risk was worth the reward. San Jose tried everything. 14 playoff appearances in the last 17 years, 3 conference finals, 1 Stanley Cup final. They have more regular season wins than any other team over the last 17 years, with the most playoff games played in that time and the 3rd most wins. I don't think they're anything other than a success story, no different than some of the great players who never won a cup. They're easily the greatest team not to win a cup this generation. May not mean a lot when the ultimate goal is to win the cup, but it's still impressive.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:55 am

Could be worse, could be Minnesota. They're going to have $15m in cap space tied to Parise and Suter in 2023-24 AND 2024-2025. What in the absolute fuck were they thinking?

Sure the Sharks have 30% of the cap tied to Burns, Karlsson and Vlasic for the next 4 years. They're at least going to be taking the ice for them. The Wild will have over 18% of their cap tied to guys they released 3 and 4 years ago!

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:03 pm

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:55 am Could be worse, could be Minnesota. They're going to have $15m in cap space tied to Parise and Suter in 2023-24 AND 2024-2025. What in the absolute fuck were they thinking?

Sure the Sharks have 30% of the cap tied to Burns, Karlsson and Vlasic for the next 4 years. They're at least going to be taking the ice for them. The Wild will have over 18% of their cap tied to guys they released 3 and 4 years ago!

True and Minnesota only has 2 playoff wins to show for it.

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm

Just move #26 to Houston already.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:09 pm

Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm Just move #26 to Houston already.

Frankly, before this year, I have no idea how the Panthers didn't get moved. They seemed to finally get their barn to at least 50% capacity (although who knows, given COVID restrictions). That team seems to be on the up, but it really hurts to put your arena in such a horrible location. It's very analogous to the Rays.

Post by **brian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:17 pm

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:09 pm
Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm Just move #26 to Houston already.
Frankly, before this year, I have no idea how the Panthers didn't get moved. They seemed to finally get their barn to at least 50% capacity (although who knows, given COVID restrictions). That team seems to be on the up, but it really hurts to put your arena in such a horrible location. It's very analogous to the Rays.

To be fair, Arizona is in the same situation as far as having their arena in a horrible location. That's not the only reason for their issues attracting fans, of course, but it's worth noting.

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:21 pm

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:55 am Could be worse, could be Minnesota. They're going to have $15m in cap space tied to Parise and Suter in 2023-24 AND 2024-2025. What in the absolute fuck were they thinking?

Sure the Sharks have 30% of the cap tied to Burns, Karlsson and Vlasic for the next 4 years. They're at least going to be taking the ice for them. The Wild will have over 18% of their cap tied to guys they released 3 and 4 years ago!

7.8 or so/yr for buyout hits.

They were thinking that if Parise or Suter chose to retire before the end of their contracts, the cap recapture penalties would have been catastrophic.

This also gets 2 NMCs off the books to allow them to protect more key pieces in the expansion draft, and frees up approx 10mm in immediate cap for next year they can use to resign guys or perhaps go after someone.

The deals were horrid the moment they were signed, but honest, this is a pretty small price to pay to get MN out of a terrible situation

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:29 pm

BSF21 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:21 pm
govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 11:55 am Could be worse, could be Minnesota. They're going to have $15m in cap space tied to Parise and Suter in 2023-24 AND 2024-2025. What in the absolute fuck were they thinking?

Sure the Sharks have 30% of the cap tied to Burns, Karlsson and Vlasic for the next 4 years. They're at least going to be taking the ice for them. The Wild will have over 18% of their cap tied to guys they released 3 and 4 years ago!
7.8 or so/yr for buyout hits.

They were thinking that if Parise or Suter chose to retire before the end of their contracts, the cap recapture penalties would have been catastrophic.

This also gets 2 NMCs off the books to allow them to protect more key pieces in the expansion draft, and frees up approx 10mm in immediate cap for next year they can use to resign guys or perhaps go after someone.

The deals were horrid the moment they were signed, but honest, this is a pretty small price to pay to get MN out of a terrible situation

They also have my favorite rookie threatening to go back to the KHL, and really aren't that great otherwise. 10mm for next year is great and all, but it's not going to get you a FA, because most non-Taylor(!) Hall free agents sign for more than one year, and NHL contracts are averaged for the purposes of the cap, no matter when you actually pay them. As far as the threat of retirement is concerned, couldn't they just put them on LTIR? I'd think a late 30s hockey player with 15 years in the league already could easily come up with an injury that would not let them play any longer.

Don't get me wrong, the first part of your last sentence is 100% correct, but I just don't get this move no matter what even the most sympathetic Wild fans say.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:29 pm

I imagine every 7+ year contract comes with an expectation of an amnesty buyout option in the future.

(That double signing is a weird "I know exactly where I was" moment. Seaport in Boston on the 4th or the weekend of the 4th, and it was hotter than fuck.)

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:33 pm

I really don't think it hurts them as bad as people are making it out to be right now. Kaprisov and Fiala are both going to be looking at bridge deals, that gets them through the rougher years of the first 4 of the buyout period, then it slacks back to 880k/yr, which is nothing. They're sitting on 26 MM as of today and most of their big names are good for another 2-3 years. Might get kind of ugly in 23/24, but if the cap rises again, you're not dead in the water.

You wanna see dead in the water look what happens to Nashville if Shea Weber retires.

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:34 pm

Also I think that Kaprisov back to the KHL story is so overhyped its not even funny.

Feel free to mock me when he's playing for Federov on CSKA Moscow in December.

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:52 pm

brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:17 pm
govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:09 pm
Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm Just move #26 to Houston already.
Frankly, before this year, I have no idea how the Panthers didn't get moved. They seemed to finally get their barn to at least 50% capacity (although who knows, given COVID restrictions). That team seems to be on the up, but it really hurts to put your arena in such a horrible location. It's very analogous to the Rays.
To be fair, Arizona is in the same situation as far as having their arena in a horrible location. That's not the only reason for their issues attracting fans, of course, but it's worth noting.

I don't want to derail, but I couldn't believe how far Auburn Hills and Pontiac are from Detroit. Did anyone from Dearborn ever go to Pistons games?

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:14 pm

BSF21 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:33 pm I really don't think it hurts them as bad as people are making it out to be right now. Kaprisov and Fiala are both going to be looking at bridge deals, that gets them through the rougher years of the first 4 of the buyout period, then it slacks back to 880k/yr, which is nothing. They're sitting on 26 MM as of today and most of their big names are good for another 2-3 years. Might get kind of ugly in 23/24, but if the cap rises again, you're not dead in the water.

You wanna see dead in the water look what happens to Nashville if Shea Weber retires.

I did my math wrong and thought that the 7/year was for both.

This is worse than I originally thought.

Post by **brian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:47 pm

Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:52 pm
brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:17 pm
govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:09 pm
Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm Just move #26 to Houston already.
Frankly, before this year, I have no idea how the Panthers didn't get moved. They seemed to finally get their barn to at least 50% capacity (although who knows, given COVID restrictions). That team seems to be on the up, but it really hurts to put your arena in such a horrible location. It's very analogous to the Rays.
To be fair, Arizona is in the same situation as far as having their arena in a horrible location. That's not the only reason for their issues attracting fans, of course, but it's worth noting.
I don't want to derail, but I couldn't believe how far Auburn Hills and Pontiac are from Detroit. Did anyone from Dearborn ever go to Pistons games?

No, that was definitely part of the problem with Pistons attendance once they started to suck. When the Lions were in Pontiac, it was the same deal as having the Cardinals in Glendale. You can deal with that shitty 90 minute drive each way once a week on a Sunday since it's an all-day commitment, but you're not doing that more than once or twice a year to see an NBA or NHL team.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:50 pm

brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:47 pm
Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:52 pm
brian wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:17 pm
govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:09 pm
Giff wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 12:04 pm Just move #26 to Houston already.
Frankly, before this year, I have no idea how the Panthers didn't get moved. They seemed to finally get their barn to at least 50% capacity (although who knows, given COVID restrictions). That team seems to be on the up, but it really hurts to put your arena in such a horrible location. It's very analogous to the Rays.
To be fair, Arizona is in the same situation as far as having their arena in a horrible location. That's not the only reason for their issues attracting fans, of course, but it's worth noting.
I don't want to derail, but I couldn't believe how far Auburn Hills and Pontiac are from Detroit. Did anyone from Dearborn ever go to Pistons games?
No, that was definitely part of the problem with Pistons attendance once they started to suck. When the Lions were in Pontiac, it was the same deal as having the Cardinals in Glendale. You can deal with that shitty 90 minute drive each way once a week on a Sunday since it's an all-day commitment, but you're not doing that more than once or twice a year to see an NBA or NHL team.

Imagine that x81 with baseball. That's the Rays.

Post by **brian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:50 pm

I think I've mentally blocked out how much it sucked driving from western Wayne County to Pontiac for Lions games back when I had season tickets pre-Ford Field. The only saving grace was Sunday traffic vs. normal weekday traffic, but even then it was easily a 75-minute drive on a good day and that was getting there two hours prior to gametime to avoid 80,000 people converging on an area not really built for that.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:51 pm

BSF21 wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 1:14 pmThis is worse than I originally thought.

Oh, its bad no matter what, but there was no good option either. Like the Lundqvist buyout last year, even before he went on LTIR or considering his franchise status, was a mistake. They should have taken the cap hit in a pre-compete season rather than needlessly pushing some forward. This one, you're either paying those two guys $15MM in 4 of 4 years to play or in 3 of 4 years to not play, plus you've got the protection against retirement. It sucks, but its the back-end of the original signing that sucks, not the decision Guerin was stuck with.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 7:26 pm

I’m well aware of the Sharks’ cap problems. I have no solutions to offer so I just try not to think about it.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:33 pm

Shea Weber says he may not play next year. If he retires the Preds are absolutely fucked. Cap recapture is a bitch.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:55 pm

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:33 pm Shea Weber says he may not play next year. If he retires the Preds are absolutely fucked. Cap recapture is a bitch.

Canadians?

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Wed Jul 14, 2021 9:31 pm

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:55 pm
govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:33 pm Shea Weber says he may not play next year. If he retires the Preds are absolutely fucked. Cap recapture is a bitch.
Canadians?

Preds. They would be charged $24 million against the cap if Weber retires. It was a rule put in, in 2013 because teams were cheating and front loading contracts and then trading players away. But last year, some of this was relaxed.

https://www.ontheforecheck.com/2020/7/7 ... rs-for-now

As long as Shea Weber was still active in the NHL, his salary was the responsibility of the Canadiens—unless Weber retires before his contract ends in 2025.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:31 am

Drury has about 48 hours to not really piss me off about the expansion list.

BSF21 · Post by **BSF21** » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:42 am

govmentchedda wrote: ↑Wed Jul 14, 2021 8:33 pm Shea Weber says he may not play next year. If he retires the Preds are absolutely fucked. Cap recapture is a bitch.

They'll just LTIR him. That recapture is brutal but I don't think there's any way it's actually put into place. All these teams have some way around it it seems.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Jul 15, 2021 8:50 am

He can just go work for the league.

Post by **brian** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 4:13 pm

Vegas and Philly flip mostly disappointing high draft choices to each other (Cody Glass for Nolan Patrick with a third player involved via Nashville).

For whatever reasons I'm not sure VGK ever gave Glass a fair shake so I'm thinking Nashville and Philly got the best of this deal.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 4:15 pm

If Nolan Patrick could stay healthy, I think he could still be a player.

Post by **brian** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 4:21 pm

sancarlos wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 4:15 pm If Nolan Patrick could stay healthy, I think he could still be a player.

He's reunited with Kelly McCrimmon who was his coach in juniors (Brandon, MB) and VGK definitely needs some help building out their top nine forwards, especially considering they're probably gonna trade Reilly Smith for cap reasons, so this is his big chance to prove himself and make some money.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 4:59 pm

Howden to Vegas is so interesting to me unless you guys needed a forward slot filled. He’s been absolutely awful but he was also thrown into the league atleast a full year too early.

The Goodrow trade terrifies me given the tendency teams have to overpay depth players on good playoff runs and the fact that we’d now have 8 forwards locked into the roster.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 5:14 pm

Goodrow is a free agent in 11 days, so good luck to the Rangers signing him to an affordable deal, before he hits the market.

We Sharks’ fans will always love him for his game 7 OT goal against Vegas.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 5:39 pm

1. Rangers love him and want to entice him to skip the market.

2. Rangers like him and consider 7th round picks to be zero value so why not.

3. Rangers think Seattle loves him enough to acquire his rights during expansion and this could save their other forwards.

I’m assuming it’s likely #1 and I don’t like that. There’s also a rumor all over Rangers Twitter of a near trade today that has everyone furious it was even discussed.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 6:00 pm

If I've learned anything as a Sharks fan, it's that you don't want to give 8-year deals at a really big aav to a defenseman.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:14 pm

mister d wrote: ↑Sat Jul 17, 2021 5:39 pmThere’s also a rumor all over Rangers Twitter of a near trade today that has everyone furious it was even discussed.

So apparently it was Buchnevich for Horvat. I would have been totally down.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:21 pm

Yeah, I agree. The Canucks get all their scoring from the line Horvat centers.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:37 pm

It also apparently could have been Shesterkin + 1st for Carey Price which would have ruined my life.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 7:37 pm

Islanders traded Andrew Ladd and 3 draft picks to Arizona for literally nothing.

govmentchedda · Post by **govmentchedda** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 9:14 pm

Did bolts trade Goodrow? I really thought we might sneak in and be able to keep him. Really like his game a ton.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Jul 17, 2021 11:13 pm