Final Four 2014

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 2:09 pm

Sharps are loading up BIG TIME on Wisconsin. That line has moved from +2 to pick 'em in a matter of hours. Saw a tweet that one house has Kentucky +1 now. Looks like they're hitting Florida pretty hard too. That line has moved from 6 to 7 this morning. Should be a good couple of games.

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 2:13 pm

And just as I write this William Hill (my online sportsbook puts it back to Kentucky -1 (though the ML is -115/-105).

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 2:14 pm

I don't understand why March Madness ends 7 days into April.

/my only NCAA basketball comment every year

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 7:10 pm

Florida destroyed. Bookies win again

DaveInSeattle · Post by **DaveInSeattle** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:04 pm

We are all badgers tonight...

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:15 pm

We're rooting against the white guys, right?

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:41 pm

It's almost as if the SEC is a hilariously overrated conference or something.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 8:59 pm

brian wrote:It's almost as if the SEC is a hilariously overrated conference or something.

That doesn't make any sense. The SEC got only 3 teams into the tournament -- fewer than any other major conference. And two of those teams, Tennessee (#11) and Kentucky (#8), were seeded below where they ranked in the efficiency rankings and vastly outperformed their seeding. (You could argue, based on the pre-tournament Pomeroy rankings, that Tennessee was the most underrated team in the country.) But yeah, if you want to call an 11-2 tournament record proof that the SEC is "hilariously overrated," you can go ahead.

howard · Post by **howard** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:09 pm

What is the point of the overbearing rebranding of "North Texas"? It's fucking Dallas.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:11 pm

howard wrote:What is the point of the overbearing rebranding of "North Texas"? It's fucking Dallas.

I was wondering that, too.

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:22 pm

I guess the City of Arlington has a bug up its ass about it?

Imagine the NFL kowtowing to East Rutherford?

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:53 pm

Great game. They say styles make fights right?

Kentucky inside against Wisconsin outside.

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:55 pm

Joe K wrote:
brian wrote:It's almost as if the SEC is a hilariously overrated conference or something.
That doesn't make any sense. The SEC got only 3 teams into the tournament -- fewer than any other major conference. And two of those teams, Tennessee (#11) and Kentucky (#8), were seeded below where they ranked in the efficiency rankings and vastly outperformed their seeding. (You could argue, based on the pre-tournament Pomeroy rankings, that Tennessee was the most underrated team in the country.) But yeah, if you want to call an 11-2 tournament record proof that the SEC is "hilariously overrated," you can go ahead.

Kentucky is about to lose to the third best team in the Big Ten and Florida lost to the second best team in the AAC. (Which itself was a pretty horrible conference.)

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 9:59 pm

I'm with Brian. Going into the Final Four, if Kentucky and Florida didn't both win out its was going to rightly be considered a bad showing by the conference.

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:10 pm

mister d wrote:I'm with Brian. Going into the Final Four, if Kentucky and Florida didn't both win out its was going to rightly be considered a bad showing by the conference.

Seriously. Based on Brian's logic, every conference other than whatever one Mercer belongs to is overrated. If Kentucky losing to Wisconsin (minus their best interior defender in Cauley-Stein) is a blemish on the SEC, then I would like to know what Michigan State losing to UConn, Michigan losing to Kentucky, and Ohio State losing to Dayton says about the Big 10.

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:14 pm

Kentucky is only in this game with the benefit of some seriously horseshit officiating. Kentucky is allowed to be physical while Wisconsin is not.

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:17 pm

If you want a name conference that diarrhea'd themselves, how about the Big East who had a 2 and a 3, didn't get a team out of the first weekend and saw three of their four teams go down by double digits?

howard · Post by **howard** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:30 pm

Wisconsin refused to put the ball in Kaminsky's hands. Even when they double him in the post, he made nice passes out for wide-open shots. Badgers' star guard did not impress me.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:31 pm

One missed free throw

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:33 pm

That was an unbelievably ballsy shot by that one Harrison.

Post by **brian** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 10:38 pm

I blocked Trollaware the instant he crawled back after Scottie was banned. Anyone want to summarize what he said?

Joe K · Post by **Joe K** » Sat Apr 05, 2014 11:11 pm

These last 4 Kentucky games have been unbelievable. I thought the Wichita State game was one of the best college games I had ever seen, and somehow they've only gotten more exciting since than. I'm a big Shabazz Napier fan, and think Kevin Ollie is a great coach, but at this point I like Kentucky's chances. But regardless of what happens, this Kentucky run has been incredibly enjoyable.

By the way, I'm not surprised that Ollie badly outcoached Donovan. Donovan is a good college coach, but I think the in-game strategy is much more advanced in the NBA than in college. Ollie spent many years in the pros and (supposedly) is a hot commodity among NBA teams looking for a coach. I'm not surprised that, given his background, he would be able to outcoach Donovan.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 7:37 am

brian wrote:
Joe K wrote:
brian wrote:It's almost as if the SEC is a hilariously overrated conference or something.
That doesn't make any sense. The SEC got only 3 teams into the tournament -- fewer than any other major conference. And two of those teams, Tennessee (#11) and Kentucky (#8), were seeded below where they ranked in the efficiency rankings and vastly outperformed their seeding. (You could argue, based on the pre-tournament Pomeroy rankings, that Tennessee was the most underrated team in the country.) But yeah, if you want to call an 11-2 tournament record proof that the SEC is "hilariously overrated," you can go ahead.
Kentucky is about to lose to the third best team in the Big Ten and Florida lost to the second best team in the AAC. (Which itself was a pretty horrible conference.)

I remember being about to lose. But something happened after that.

Bensell · Post by **Bensell** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:45 am

All I gotta say is Hellz Yeah

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Sun Apr 06, 2014 8:52 am

Rex wrote:I guess the City of Arlington has a bug up its ass about it?

Imagine the NFL kowtowing to East Rutherford?

There's allegedly a contract stipulation that says the stadium itself is in "North Dallas" (I know) and not Arlington.

It was fun last night. Atmosphere felt more like an "event" rather than a basketball game because of the scope of the stadium and the number of people seemingly content to watch the game on the big screen on the concourses rather than actually watch the game itself. It seems like it'd be much more fun in an arena.

However, we were able to park less than a mile from the stadium and had little traffic, no problems getting in and out, and didn't pay much for our (really high up) seats. I'm guessing we'll be in the lower bowls pretty cheaply Monday night.

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:39 am

So, they've got an 8 seed and a 7 seed in the finals. When, (if ever), have we seen a final game where the seed numbers totaled over 15? Or, where the higher seeded team was as low as a 7 seed?

Post by **brian** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 10:58 am

To answer your questions that would be never and never.

Post by **Shirley** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:00 pm

Yeah, isn't cool to see these plucky little Cinderellas make it all the way to final? It's what this tournament is all about.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:13 pm

Shirley wrote:Yeah, isn't cool to see these plucky little Cinderellas make it all the way to final? It's what this tournament is all about.

It's just 7 of the last 19 titles combined for the two after tonight! That leaves 2/3rds of all the titles for all the other schools!

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:15 pm

Ticket prices need to start coming down

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:19 pm

Brontoburglar wrote:Ticket prices need to start coming down

why? They're setting attendance records.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:35 pm

degenerasian wrote:
Brontoburglar wrote:Ticket prices need to start coming down
why? They're setting attendance records.

UK fans will pay whatever as well. Not a good market for a casual fan.

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 2:42 pm

Man, imagine what it would be like if people cared about hoops.

DC47 · Post by **DC47** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:05 pm

AB_skin_test wrote:
Shirley wrote:Yeah, isn't cool to see these plucky little Cinderellas make it all the way to final? It's what this tournament is all about.
It's just 7 of the last 19 titles combined for the two after tonight! That leaves 2/3rds of all the titles for all the other schools!

Point taken. But these collections of players are still long-shot underdogs in 2014, regardless of how good their predecessors in the same uniforms were. Both teams have recovered from big problems during the season and have found themselves in the tournament. I like that better than if the finals were both #1 or #2 seeds who have been killing it straight through the past five months.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:11 pm

DC47 wrote:Point taken. But these collections of players are still long-shot underdogs in 2014, regardless of how good their predecessors in the same uniforms were. Both teams have recovered from big problems during the season and have found themselves in the tournament. I like that better than if the finals were both #1 or #2 seeds who have been killing it straight through the past five months.

Alternate translation: Preseason #1 and Preseason #18 snoozed their way through an increasingly meaningless regular season, then survived a handful of crapshoot end-of-game scenarios to make everyone forget they were Preseason #1 and Preseason #18

Post by **Shirley** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 4:52 pm

Ryan wrote:
DC47 wrote:Point taken. But these collections of players are still long-shot underdogs in 2014, regardless of how good their predecessors in the same uniforms were. Both teams have recovered from big problems during the season and have found themselves in the tournament. I like that better than if the finals were both #1 or #2 seeds who have been killing it straight through the past five months.
Alternate translation: Preseason #1 and Preseason #18 snoozed their way through an increasingly meaningless regular season, then survived a handful of crapshoot end-of-game scenarios to make everyone forget they were Preseason #1 and Preseason #18

Yeah, that's more the point. I don't necessarily agree with the "increasingly meaningless" part though. There has always been an element of chaos in the tournament, meaning teams with great regular seasons flop and vice versa.

With Kentucky this year, the key is that they are by FAR the most talented team in the country, but they are extremely young and college success is somewhat secondary to this group of pre-NBAers. That's a tough team to mold into a cohesive unit. I don't know if it's a case of it taking most of a season to learn the nuances of their offensive and defensive systems, that they needed to lose a bit to earn a little humility, or if it's just that they see the end is near and kicked it up a notch. Either way, it's (and I hate to admit this) kinda interesting.

At the same time, I HATE what Cal has been doing at Kentucky (and started at Memphis). I don't think it's good for the sport to have a program that serves only as a defacto minor league for the NBA. I doubt most of those kids give two shits about Kentucky or even college hoops as a whole. They are there because the rules say they have to go somewhere and Kentucky looks like the surest bet for one-and-done riches. Why not pool up and enjoy some brief Miami Heat-like success?

I'm pretty sure that if I were a Kentucky fan I'd feel pretty ambivalent about this recent success.

DC47 · Post by **DC47** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 5:05 pm

Ryan wrote:
DC47 wrote:Point taken. But these collections of players are still long-shot underdogs in 2014, regardless of how good their predecessors in the same uniforms were. Both teams have recovered from big problems during the season and have found themselves in the tournament. I like that better than if the finals were both #1 or #2 seeds who have been killing it straight through the past five months.
Alternate translation: Preseason #1 and Preseason #18 snoozed their way through an increasingly meaningless regular season, then survived a handful of crapshoot end-of-game scenarios to make everyone forget they were Preseason #1 and Preseason #18

I take pre-season rankings as close to meaningless. There is so much turnover on college teams, and untested incoming freshman make more of a difference than they used to. So who really knows about a team until they've played at least a handful of competitive games? That could take until Christmas for many. Pre-season rankings are roughly equivalent to the standings in the American League at the end of April.

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:12 pm

AB_skin_test wrote:
degenerasian wrote:
Brontoburglar wrote:Ticket prices need to start coming down
why? They're setting attendance records.
UK fans will pay whatever as well. Not a good market for a casual fan.

Should have jumped on the nosebleeds when we had the chance. Now they're 4x what they were.

Going to go out there and see what we can get for under $100. We're trying not to be a row from the top tonight.

rass · Post by **rass** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:47 pm

I liked this Kid Rock performance better:

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Mon Apr 07, 2014 7:51 pm

Team wearing blue rumbles and stumbles its way through the regular season, gets crazy hot/lucky in the playoffs, beats a team from New England in the final. Nope, never seen that happen before.