Swamp Travel Companion: Pick My Next City

[sancarlos]

Last I heard, the passport was required for flying in, but not for driving in.

[brian]

Last I heard, the passport was required for flying in, but not for driving in.

It is absolutely required no matter where you cross or how you cross.

[Steve of phpBB]

Do you need a passport to get into Canada? Or just to get back?

Because maybe going to Canada and then not being able to return is the way to go.

[Rams Fanny]

In one of the versions of the Swamp, I gave an emphatic argument for Portland but can't remember if you actually went. Happy to reiterate if you need convincing.

Montreal is absolutely worth the passport. Quebec City is as well especially during Winter Carnival. QC can be difficult if you don't speak at least basic french whereas you would be fine in Montreal.

[Pruitt]

I know that Canadians are told to have a passport for getting into the USA.

[mister d]

Love SF and both Portlands.

[HaulCitgo]

I like Asheville a lot and might move but it's a bit small for that long a trip. Savannah is a good time too but all in all I'd rather Charleston. I'd vote Toronto but will throw in KC as an as yet unmentioned, better than you think destination, especially if you get to tailgate with the chiefs. Wasn't as enamored with Nashville but I'll take another trip to give it a full shot. Miami? Gotta floss a bit but there's a time and place for that. Never made it to Austin but certainly something I need to fix. Just go to Toronto and work on the Jamacian patois so you can wine with the ICE removals.

[mister d]

I have a goal of visiting 49 states but not Florida.

[DC47]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

[Pruitt]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

Listen, if you're in Detroit, why not cross the river and visit Sarnia? It's chemical-arific!

[Steve of phpBB]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

How about Cleveland in January? Should I plan for more than the one day my depositions will take?

[A_B]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

How about Cleveland in January? Should I plan for more than the one day my depositions will take?

I guess that depends on if you get charged with anything or not.

[Brontoburglar]

I like Asheville a lot and might move but it's a bit small for that long a trip. Savannah is a good time too but all in all I'd rather Charleston. I'd vote Toronto but will throw in KC as an as yet unmentioned, better than you think destination, especially if you get to tailgate with the chiefs. Wasn't as enamored with Nashville but I'll take another trip to give it a full shot. Miami? Gotta floss a bit but there's a time and place for that. Never made it to Austin but certainly something I need to fix. Just go to Toronto and work on the Jamacian patois so you can wine with the ICE removals.

Tailgating at a Chiefs game is immensely, immensely overrated.

Kansas City itself, is not. We have a bad airport -- though great for locals -- but the city is getting fun. It'd be a good 3-day trip or so.

[Steve of phpBB]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

How about Cleveland in January? Should I plan for more than the one day my depositions will take?

I guess that depends on if you get charged with anything or not.

I was going to sacrifice a live goat outside Progressive Field. Is that legal?

[Sabo]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

How about Cleveland in January? Should I plan for more than the one day my depositions will take?

I guess that depends on if you get charged with anything or not.

I was going to sacrifice a live goat outside Progressive Field. Is that legal?

You're the fucking lawyer, you tell us!

Seriously, if you're in town and have some time to get out, let me know. When will you be in town?

[Steve of phpBB]

Cleveland in summer. If you can make the trip in February, then Detroit has no peer. Side trip to Toledo.

How about Cleveland in January? Should I plan for more than the one day my depositions will take?

I guess that depends on if you get charged with anything or not.

I was going to sacrifice a live goat outside Progressive Field. Is that legal?

You're the fucking lawyer, you tell us!

Seriously, if you're in town and have some time to get out, let me know. When will you be in town?

If we could make it work, that would be fantastic. But I have a very narrow window - I get in on Monday 1/30 at 7pm, then I have a deposition the next day and then fly out at 7. I'll be in Westlake.

[Sabo]

I'm actually in town those days, so we might be able to make something work. I'm not terribly familiar with Westlake, but I know it's one of the nicer areas in greater Cleveland. Shoot me a PM when you think you'll have some free time and we'll see what we can do.

[mister d]

I honestly have no idea if we ever went anywhere in 2017 after all this talk. Anyway, we're going to Asheville with the kids at the end of March so ...

1. Food recs?
2. Beer recs?
3. Places to see and (just as importantly) avoid?
4. Outdoors-y stuff keeping in mind none of us are hikers and one of us is a volatile 9 year old?
5. Do we need a car?
6. Strong hotel preference (pool a must)?
7. Is my favorite single digit number!

We looked at the Biltmore online and ... I just don't think that's something we'd be into esp at that cost? I'm willing to be convinced otherwise but I can think of a lot better uses of $300.

[govmentchedda]

I honestly have no idea if we ever went anywhere in 2017 after all this talk. Anyway, we're going to Asheville with the kids at the end of March so ...

1. Food recs?
2. Beer recs?
3. Places to see and (just as importantly) avoid?
4. Outdoors-y stuff keeping in mind none of us are hikers and one of us is a volatile 9 year old?
5. Do we need a car?
6. Strong hotel preference (pool a must)?
7. Is my favorite single digit number!

We looked at the Biltmore online and ... I just don't think that's something we'd be into esp at that cost? I'm willing to be convinced otherwise but I can think of a lot better uses of $300.

You absolutely need a car, and I'll have to answer in much more detail later. Currently slammed at work.

[P.D.X.]

[mister d]

Did you do that?

[P.D.X.]

Nah.

https://www.porchdrinking.com/articles/ ... eville-nc/

[wlu_lax6]

I honestly have no idea if we ever went anywhere in 2017 after all this talk. Anyway, we're going to Asheville with the kids at the end of March so ...

1. Food recs?
2. Beer recs?
3. Places to see and (just as importantly) avoid?
4. Outdoors-y stuff keeping in mind none of us are hikers and one of us is a volatile 9 year old?
5. Do we need a car?
6. Strong hotel preference (pool a must)?
7. Is my favorite single digit number!

We looked at the Biltmore online and ... I just don't think that's something we'd be into esp at that cost? I'm willing to be convinced otherwise but I can think of a lot better uses of $300.

You absolutely need a car, and I'll have to answer in much more detail later. Currently slammed at work.

Lots of breweries..burial was my favorite.
March may be too cold.for.slidding rock..but fun for kids
Pinball museum in downtown or retrocade in West Asheville
Biscuit Head for brunch/breakfast (across from retrocade)
Batcave, NC is a neat town on the way to Lake Lure..which has a very.cool Flowering bridge
I like Brevard better than Asheville.
Lots of short hikes to waterfalls which you can do with a 9 year old.

[wlu_lax6]

I honestly have no idea if we ever went anywhere in 2017 after all this talk. Anyway, we're going to Asheville with the kids at the end of March so ...

1. Food recs?
2. Beer recs?
3. Places to see and (just as importantly) avoid?
4. Outdoors-y stuff keeping in mind none of us are hikers and one of us is a volatile 9 year old?
5. Do we need a car?
6. Strong hotel preference (pool a must)?
7. Is my favorite single digit number!

We looked at the Biltmore online and ... I just don't think that's something we'd be into esp at that cost? I'm willing to be convinced otherwise but I can think of a lot better uses of $300.

You absolutely need a car, and I'll have to answer in much more detail later. Currently slammed at work.

Lots of breweries..burial was my favorite.
March may be too cold.for.slidding rock..but fun for kids
Pinball museum in downtown or retrocade in West Asheville
Biscuit Head for brunch/breakfast (across from retrocade)
Batcave, NC is a neat town on the way to Lake Lure..which has a very.cool Flowering bridge
I like Brevard better than Asheville.
Lots of short hikes to waterfalls which you can do with a 9 year old.

Also.aomw great guides if you want to do some.family friendly repelling or mountain biking (can refer you on the MTB as we have used a guide 2x down there).

[govmentchedda]

Breweries:

Burial is really good, but the beer list is a little too stout dominant in my opinion.

Sierra Nevada's complex, near the south end of the airport is massive. It's kind of Disneyworld of beer. Big open air amphitheatre out back, a garden you can walk through, pretty sure they offer brewery tours, and a full restaurant with really good food for a brewery. I'm not the biggest fan of their beers, but the brewery is impressive. Near Riveter as well, I'll get into that elsewhere.

Highlands Brewing has a cool location as well, up on the top of a hill, with a pretty large interior room, and a massive meadow out back with food trucks and a small bandshell. They also have a disc golf course surrounding the outside area.

I really like Hilman brewing for both beer and food. They're smaller in scale than both of the above and have two locations, one near Biltmore Village and one out east in Old Fort.

Which reminds me. Burial has a place called Forestry Camp in Biltmore Village that has a taproom and full restaurant that is supposed to be amazing. The building is gorgeous.

New Belgium has a tasting room overlooking the French Broad River, which is kind of a pretty spot up kinda high next to the river, but I fucking hate their beers.

Just across the river from New Belgium is Wedge Brewery and their stuff is tasty. I think they've moved breweries since I last went, but are in the same general area. Tasty beers.

If you're willing to head out east a little to where we stay in Black Mountain, Black Mountain Brewing is really good, and they have a permanent BBQ truck out back that is also really good. They're right across the street from Foothills Grange, which has a large outdoor seating area and a pretty large tap list of local beers, as well as their own meat based (but not really BBQ) foodtruck (Foothills is a butchery just down the road).

[bfj]

…one of us is a volatile 9 year old

We agree, but we love you anyway.

[govmentchedda]

Food:

One of my favorite restaurants in the country is Curate, Chef Katie Button's Spanish restaurant. Get reservations for sure (or show up for a late lunch), but it's not super fancy. Mostly tapas style dishes done very similar to what I've had in Spain. It's right in one of the centers of downtown. There's also a less casual, smaller menu restaurant out back called Bodega (where they also sell bread and wine and other Spanish style take away food downstairs) and the upstairs of Bodega is a sit down spot. While these two restaurants likely share the same building you can't get from one to the other inside said building. It's a walk around the block.

Similar situation for Rhubarb and Rhu. I haven't been to Rhubarb, but it's rated on par with Curate, and is near Curate. Rhu, Rhubarb's take away spot, is on the back side of the building near Bodega, and I have eaten there. I remember it being good, but don't remember what I had.

Table is nearby as well and was really good the two times we went. I'd definitely recommend it.

Vivian in/near the River Arts District was fantastic too. Both Table and Vivian are not French bistros, but have that sort of feel, but with a focus on local ingredients.

Mother started as a take away bakery (loaves of bread, large pretzels, jamon beurre sandwiches) all for takeaway along with a bottle or two of wine, meant to be taken down to the river for a picnic. They've recently opened a location in South Slope and it's really good too. Similar to Table and Vivian with a smaller menu, but better food (no slight to Table or Vivian). Really, maybe more of a lunch spot while Table and Vivian are more dinner.

Chai Pani is excellent Indian. Pretty sure they've just moved from their downtown spot to a much larger location that used to be a BBQ spot. James Beard nominees, if not winners.

Also downtown and not really a food or drink place is Citizen Vinyl. It's on the ground floor of the old Asheville Citizen newspaper/radio station building. The building itself is kinda cool very art deco feel to it with glass bricks, clean lines, etc. There's also a cool terrazzo map of North Carollina on the floor in the entry way. It's got a cocktail bar, small food menu, and a vinyl shop. It's certainly worth popping your head in, even if you don't want a cocktail or food.

Near the river, White Duck Taco shop is a casual spot with tasty tacos that aren't necessarily authentic Mexican, but really well done. They also sell Cheerwine slushies (both with and without booze added). Definitely recommend trying Cheerwine on it's own, and as a slushie.

Also near the river is 12 Bones BBQ, probably my favorite BBQ in town. There's usually a line, but everything there is really good.

Out in West Asheville there are 4 spots I'd recommend. First, is Sunny Point Cafe. Think diner type breakfast and lunch food, but with local ingredients and made really well. Second, there's a Biscuit Head location out here. They're a tasty small chain. Mostly breakfast, but also lunch style sandwiches. These two restaurants are pretty similar in menu and vibe. Third, Thai Pearl is really good Thai food. Fourth, Neng Jr.'s is dinner only and small. I have not yet been, but people are raving about it. Filipinx restaurant (their word). Lots of Eater/James Beard attention on this place.

In Biltmore Village, there's a spot called Corner Kitchen that does really good local food for all three meals. It's in an old house.

The Montford rooftop bar at the top of the Doubletree downtown has fantastic sunset views, but you definitely need a reservation and I'm not 100% sure if they allow kids. They do serve food, so I'm thinking kids are ok, but I've never seen any there. Great cocktails and wine selection, and amazing view, especially if the weather is right.

[govmentchedda]

Everything else:

Coffee:
Pollen (on the west side of downtown Asheville) is a hipster florist/coffee shop. Really tasty coffee, serving all of the finest blends from roasters that all the coffee nerds are up on (Sey, Onyx, etc.).

Farewell in the south slope area, similar coffee offerings as Pollen, but also a few homemade bread/pastry options that are quite good.

Rowan is supposed to be really good downtown, but I haven't been

Hotels:
I don't really have much personal experience but the Omni Grove Park Inn is supposed to be really nice. I understand it to be on the top of a hill with gorgeous views, a huge stone fireplace, very likely has good restaurants, etc. I suspect this place is more resort than just hotel. Maybe they have their own golf course?

I wonder if the Doubletree with the rooftop bar will guarantee you a room with a good view?

Activities:
I mentioned Riveter earlier. It's near Sierra Nevada and the airport. It's a really great rock climbing gym (like 40-50 ft climbs). They have autobelay as well, so you can climb solo. They've got a kid friendly area too, and also a bar, but you can't climb after you drink. They also have a BMX course outside that we've never done, but is fun to watch.

The Pinball museum and the Moog museum are both supposed to be pretty great, and I think they're close to each other on the north side of downtown.

There's tons of hiking, but you mentioned not really being hikers. You can definitely find spots that are more walk than hike and see some cool shit. I like one particular spot near the Blue Ridge Parkway, but can't remember the name right now. I feel like "knob" or "bald" is in the name, but it's escaping me. Driving a bit of the Blue Ridge Parkway isn't a bad idea either. Think windy mountain road with great spots to either just stop and enjoy the view or hike up a trailhead.

There are tons of disc golf courses around town if you want to give that a try. You can get a disc at a Play it Again sports for 10-15 bucks, and usually just walk on any course.

wlu_lax mentioned Sliding Rock, and it's definitely fun, but I think it's too damn cold even in the middle of summer. It feels like a cold plunge when you get to the bottom.

Also, there really are a lot of homeless people in Asheville. That reputation is well earned. I have never really had any personal aggressive experiences with them, but I have been witness to arguments between a few of them that felt on the edge of violence.

[govmentchedda]

Let me know if you have a question about any of this, or anything I didn't mention. I'm sure I forgot a few things.

[Ryan]

Yeah like a map of storm drains or aldermanic voting record maybe? How’s a guy supposed to plan?!?

[mister d]

Let me know if you have a question about any of this, or anything I didn't mention. I'm sure I forgot a few things.

Take the kids to Bald Knob. Got it.

[govmentchedda]

Let me know if you have a question about any of this, or anything I didn't mention. I'm sure I forgot a few things.

Take the kids to Bald Knob. Got it.

Craggy Gardens!

Neither bald nor knob. Although there's definitely another spot with at least one of those words in the title.

[Giff]

Chimney Rock was awesome.

[govmentchedda]

Chimney Rock was awesome.

Chimney Rock is definitely cool, and they've got touristy fun outdoor type stuff there like "panning for gold and gems" that the kids might like.

I didn't mention Biltmore, and while it's definitely more expensive than it should be, it's one of the few American "castles" and grounds that I know of. If that type of thing interests you, it's pretty great.

[wlu_lax6]

Chimney Rock was awesome.

Chimney Rock is definitely cool, and they've got touristy fun outdoor type stuff there like "panning for gold and gems" that the kids might like.

I didn't mention Biltmore, and while it's definitely more expensive than it should be, it's one of the few American "castles" and grounds that I know of. If that type of thing interests you, it's pretty great.

There is a great hike/view near Pisgah Fish Hatchery. The fish hatchery is a nice stop if you are in the area, but the hike from that parking lot has a great waterfall and if you want a view, there is a great hike up that puts you on a bald part of the mountain that has a great view.

Also if you hit Pisgah or Dupont...the bike shop, the Hub, has a fantastic beer garden (there is a good brewery across the street too).

[DSafetyGuy]

Gonna tell my friend who lives there to cancel sending his suggestions.

[DSafetyGuy]

I was too late, here's what he sent me:

There are numerous hotels in downtown Asheville. The Omni Grove Park Inn is a beautiful but pricey resort style hotel ~2.5 miles north of downtown. Generally, hotels in Biltmore Village (2.5 miles south of downtown) tend to be less expensive. Many of these hotels feature pools.

The Biltmore House is the top tourist destination here. Tickets are required to visit Biltmore (https://www.biltmore.com). There are a few ticket levels with the main ones being admission to the house (about $100/person) and admission to the grounds (about $70/person).

Downtown - Asheville is a small city, so the downtown area is very walkable. There are a number of museums: art, science, and the music Moogseum. Some of our favorite places downtown are: Huli Sue’s (Hawaiian & BBQ), Tupelo Honey (Southern), Curate (Spanish), Mehfil (Indian), and Hemingway’s Cuba.

Just blocks south of downtown is the South Slope area where many of the breweries are located. Some of our favorites are Green Man, Catawba, and The Funkatorium.

Biltmore Village - Biltmore Village is the area of shops and restaurants just outside of the gate to the Biltmore property. One of our favorite breweries is Cursus Keme, 2 miles east of Biltmore Village; and one of our favorite pizza trucks, 900 Degreez, is at the brewery next door, New Origin.

River Arts District (The RAD) - Along the east bank of the French Broad River (actually believed to be one of the oldest rivers in the world) around highway 240 is the arts district with galleries, studios, and some great restaurants. There are some parks on either side of the river with walking trails and playgrounds. Some of our favorites are White Duck Taco Shoppe, Hi-Wire Brewing, All Souls Pizza, 12 Bones BBQ, and Rosa Bees. On the west side of the river is the New Belgium brewery that features a number of food trucks. Further north (2.5 miles) and right on the river is the Zillicoah brewery (please note, children are only allowed on Sundays).

West Asheville - There are a number of great restaurants and shops along Haywood Road, the main street that goes through West Asheville. Gan Shan West and Pizza Mind share a spot with Archetype Brewing. Further down is Nine Mile, Thai Pearl, and the new Botiwalla. There are many other great spots in between those two areas.

Further outside of town - Salt Face Mule is a new brewery on the river 7 miles north of town. It has a mini-golf course. The Sierra Nevada brewery has a restaurant and a large outdoor area. It is near the airport, in Mills River, 17 miles south of downtown.

Other activities - There are great opportunities for outdoor activities around Asheville. Explore Asheville has a hiking guide here. Other places to visit include the NC Arboretum and the Western NC Nature Center.

Other notes - Driving here is a bit of a challenge. We’re in the mountains and therefore there are a lot of winding roads, so the cardinal direction you’re going in often does not correspond with the highway name. Construction along I-26 (the main north/south highway between the airport and downtown) often (as in always) causes delays. Like in many cities, homelessness is an issue here. Just be aware. Are they homeless or some retired tech bro who moved to Asheville to be a massage therapist and sell crystals? Who knows? And when signs say ‘don’t leave valuables in your car’, they mean it, so don’t. Things generally don’t stay open here too late. Eating dinner after 8 is late here. Restaurants do fill up so Open Table and Resy are good reservation apps to have. Uber & Lyft are reliable downtown, not so much further outside of town. Another option that is basically a local cab company is the AVL Ride app. You can also call them (828-333-1976) to reserve rides, or if you need a ride to or from the airport.

[Brontoburglar]

Ched forgot Wicked Weed!

Second Burial and Sunny Point. I think we went to Sunny Point twice in two days last time we were there.

[mister d]

Thanks everyone. We've already made a reservation at Curate for one of the nights.



(I knew of the restaurant from a cookbook but didn't know it was in Asheville so that's pretty cool.)

[mister d]

Follow-up questions:
1. Are any of the local-ish zoos or aquariums worth it if your standard is the good east coast zoos and like Chicago/Boston/Baltimore aquarium?
2. Ice cream shop recs?