Game of Thrones Season 6: The Quickening (chatter/guesses/spoilers)

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri May 20, 2016 6:23 am

rass wrote:Wah wah wah Jersey Jon Snow #3. Jeez.

Given that the character’s name isn’t as ubiquitous as, say, Tyrion Lannister or Theon Greyjoy, for example, it’s inevitable that a few real-life Jon Snows are out there, hearing the same jokes over and over.
Did she mean unique?

I know seven Theon Greyjoys.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:09 pm

Emelia Clarke got her wish.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:21 pm

Dadgummit. Seriously? I mean on one hand great fucking slow burn but on the other hand Gfd.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:23 pm

Hold the door.

:(

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:32 pm

Oh yea. Ghost died too.

In total, this entire episode was so dense with reveals and plot development.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:35 pm

Johnnie wrote:Oh yea. Ghost died too.

In total, this entire episode was so dense with reveals and plot development.

That wasn't ghost. That was summer.

We are down to ghost and the long lost nymeria amongst the direwolves.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:47 pm

A_B wrote:
Johnnie wrote:Oh yea. Ghost died too.

In total, this entire episode was so dense with reveals and plot development.
That wasn't ghost. That was summer.

We are down to ghost and the long lost nymeria amongst the direwolves.

Oh yea, John's was ghost.

Hey how did Littlefinger get to the North so quickly?

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Sun May 22, 2016 9:50 pm

Varys made a comment that it had been two weeks since the deal with the masters. So I assume it's all kind of fast forwarded two weeks.

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Mon May 23, 2016 11:14 am

Johnnie wrote:Hold the door.

:(

As someone said on Twitter, they apparently invented Pre-Traumatic Stress Disorder.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Mon May 23, 2016 3:59 pm

Is there anything more disturbing than when they put Arya in that Princess Leia hair do? She goes from little cutie to WHOA! EEK!

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Mon May 23, 2016 4:03 pm

Nonlinear FC wrote:Is there anything more disturbing than when they put Arya in that Princess Leia hair do? She goes from little cutie to WHOA! EEK!

She does have a head and eyes like a muppet, so that hair style does her no favors.

Rush2112 · Post by **Rush2112** » Mon May 23, 2016 4:10 pm

But how about "paying for upward mobility Sansa", eh? She did us some favours.

rass · Post by **rass** » Mon May 23, 2016 8:48 pm

A_B wrote:Dadgummit. Seriously? I mean on one hand great fucking slow burn but on the other hand Gfd.

GFD!!!

rass · Post by **rass** » Tue May 24, 2016 6:00 am

Old Hodor holds the door, of course, and dies of course, but at least now we know that this zombie dragon universe also involves time travel.

yup (and I hope affecting the past doesn't become a thing)

So, was Hodor living with the trauma/knowledge of what was going to happen to him that whole time? Or did the loop not work that way?

And perhaps more importantly, was Bran still in control of Hodor when he was hold-door-ing? Hodor seemed a little more himself by the time they got the door, so I'd like to think he made the choice to sacrifice himself and Bran didn't make him do it. Was it clearer than I thought it was?

Because we watched the episode last night, "After the Thrones" was available to watch afterwards. I don't know if it's just because it was only their fifth episode, or maybe they started recording immediately after watching the episode and were shaken, or maybe I was distracted by Greenwald's (who I like!) hairline, but the show left me a little cold. I think I would have much rather have read a transcript of the various discussions. The note that last night's timey-wimey episode was directed by a veteran director of Lost was interesting, though.

ETA: Summer! That was BS. More than anything else, I feel like the direwolves have been the victims of budgeting concerns.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Tue May 24, 2016 8:16 am

On the plus side Theater Sansa's tits were nice.

And it's a footnote to the rest of the episode but Arya knows what went down when she wasn't around.

rass · Post by **rass** » Tue May 24, 2016 8:18 am

Johnnie wrote:On the plus side Theater Sansa's tits were nice.

And it's a footnote to the rest of the episode but Arya knows what went down when she wasn't around.

What when? She watched Ned get beheaded back in season 1.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:07 am

Ask the Maester:

Ask the Maester: What Bran’s Time-Bending Moment Tells Us About the ‘Game of Thrones’ World

THE RINGER·TUESDAY, MAY 24, 2016

By Jason Concepcion

Have more questions for our Maester? Tune in at 3 p.m. ET, when Jason will answer your questions live, right here on Facebook.

RIP, Three-Eyed Raven. You were a bad teacher of greenseeing, my dude. If the fate of the world hinged on my ability to pass on my knowledge, I’d tell my only student, “DON’T LET THE NIGHT’S KING TOUCH YOU,” five times a day. In retrospect, it’s kind of the only rule a young greenseer needs to know. A rule that important should be treated like the Fight Club rule. But despite that massive flaw, the Three-Eyed Raven was one of the story’s most fascinating and mysterious characters.

Spencer asks, “Who was the man in the tree?”

The Three-Eyed Raven was born Brynden Rivers in 175 AC (about 125 years before the events of the show) in King’s Landing. He was one of the many bastards of King Aegon IV, better known to history as “Aegon the Unworthy.” Aegon was, above all else, profligate; he ate too much, he spent too much, and he fucked too much. His innumerable dalliances resulted in a vast brood of bastards, and those born to highborn mothers, like Brynden, were known as “Great Bastards.” The King legitimized all of his bastards on his deathbed, creating a succession crisis that resulted in five civil wars, the effects of which are still being felt in the realm today.

Lord Brynden is best known for his actions during the first of these conflicts, known as the First Blackfyre Rebellion. During the decisive Battle of the Redgrass Field, Brynden, who remained loyal to his half brother King Daeron II, and Brynden's personal militia of archers gained the strategic heights on the Weeping Ridge. The hail of arrows they unleashed slew the usurper Daemon Blackfyre (another of Brynden’s half brothers) and Daemon's two sons. As the rebel army began to flee, Aegor “Bittersteel” Rivers (another Great Bastard), led a cavalry charge at Brynden and his archers. Bittersteel got close enough to hack out one of Lord Brynden’s eyes, but it was too little too late. The war was effectively over once Daemon and his sons were killed.

The loss of his eye added to Brynden’s already intimidating appearance. Owing to his pallorous white skin, the blood-red birthmark staining his face, and his reputation for sorcery, he was called “Bloodraven.” His influence was seen in every shadow; popular gossip held him to blame for a long drought around 211 AC. After serving as Hand to two kings, he was sent to the Wall in 233 AC (with a young Maester Aemon!) for reasons that remain unclear, and eventually rose to Lord Commander. He disappeared on a ranging beyond the Wall in 252 AC, roughly 50 years before Bran finds him under the weirwood tree.

Robert asks, “If Bran can mess with time, what other plots does that explain?”

It’s important to note that the Three-Eyed Raven flat-out tells Bran that it is impossible to change the past. “Through the trees, I see them still,” says the Raven — who is known as the Three-Eyed Crow in the books — of his own attempts to contact long-lost loved ones. “No word of mine has ever reached them. The past remains the past.” But it appears that Bran is more powerful than even Lord Brynden knew. The books only hint that Bran has this ability, so seeing it on the show sends my mind reeling.

As to the question — one theory floating around posits that a time-traveling Bran is responsible for numerous events, including Aerys II becoming the Mad King and the construction of the Wall. I don’t subscribe to this for reasons that are too involved to discuss here. But the bottom line is: world-building. What makes this story effective is the seamlessness of its world-building. Overuse of a time-traveling mechanic would unravel those seams. Why would Bran go back in time to build a Wall that’s already built in his timeline? Why would he try to stop the Mad King from killing his grandfather and not try to stop Ilyn Payne from beheading Ned Stark? To paraphrase Looper, if we start talking about time travel, we're going to be here all day talking about it, making diagrams with weirwood branches. And that would ruin the story.

Mallory Rubin asks, "Is it worth living in a world where 'Winter Is Coming' and Summer is no more?"

Mallory answers: Greetings, cherished skinchangers. It's the Mother of Dragons, searching for some catharsis in the form of a quick guest entry. Are you holding up OK after the hauntingly beautiful death we witnessed on Sunday night? I speak, of course, of Summer's sacrifice, in which Bran's direwolf/bestie catapulted into a pod of wights in order to give his human a few extra precious seconds to escape the Three-Eyed Raven's den of doom. Hodor's demise has sparked more outcry than Lady Crane's latest rhyme, and rightly so — but Summer deserves as many fond remembrances.
Never forget how Summer ripped out the throat of Bran's would-be assassin, nor how he allowed Bran to share his skin and mind. Summer was Bran's fiercest shield and most loyal companion, but he was also the vessel through which Bran began to use and understand his powers. Summer helped set in motion a series of magical happenings that we now realize could determine the fate of Westeros, but Bran will have to face the next stage of his journey absent the courage that his wolf's familiar warmth long provided.
Bran still has Meera, and for his sake, I pray that another champion comes to his aid. But he no longer has his greatest protector. Summer was more than a wolf. He was a friend, brave and true. We shall never see his like again.

Andrew asks, “If the White Walkers were once a weapon used by the Children of the Forest against the First Men, did that also create the ridiculously long winters?”

I think that’s a fair assumption. I would go a bit further, though: I think the Children may have inadvertently created winter. It was summer when the Children created the White Walkers under the heart tree among the standing stones. When Bran uses his greenseer powers to visit the same location thousands of years later, it’s winter, and the White Walkers are gathering their army there. The birthplace of the Others must be somewhere very far north, somewhere they can gather their strength in eternal cold, far from the eyes of men. How could it ever have been so warm so far north unless winter as we know it didn’t exist at the time?

Early in the books, when Bran is unconscious after being pushed from the tower by Jaime, the Three-Eyed Crow comes to him in a dream and takes him high into the sky. “Teaching you how to fly,” he tells the boy. From that soaring vantage, Bran sees ships plying the waters of the Bite between the North and the Vale. To the east, past the vast green of the Dothraki sea, he sees Asshai by the Shadow, the very end of the known world, where “dragons stirred beneath the sunrise.” When he finally turns his eyes north, he spies the Wall “shining like blue crystal.” Beyond that, he sees the Haunted Forest, the frozen waters of the Milkwater, and endless plains of ice. Farther and farther north he looks until he comes to a “curtain of light at the end of the world” past which lies “the heart of winter.” What he sees there terrifies him. This is where I think the Children created the White Walkers.

Ben asks, “Are the White Walkers actually evil?”

They were created to kill humans and they can raise the dead, so, from our perspective, it’s hard to view them as anything but evil.

Matthew asks, “Is there any meaning behind the fact that the White Walkers were created with dragonglass?”
It certainly helps explain why obsidian kills them.

Dean asks, “Are the Children of the Forest extinct now?”

Perhaps not. In the southern Riverlands, between the Trident and King’s Landing, is the God’s Eye, the largest lake in Westeros. During the war between the Children and the First Men some 12,000 years ago, on the small island in the middle of the lake, the Children cast the spell that shattered the Arm of Dorne, the land bridge linking Essos to southern Westeros. If that slowed the advance of humankind, it certainly did not stop it, and the war raged for roughly another 2,000 years. Exhausted, both sides came to an understanding, and the Pact, the peace accords between the Children and the First Men, were agreed to on that same island in the God’s Eye. Faces were carved into the island’s weirwood trees so that the Old Gods could bear witness. Ever since, the island has been known as the Isle of Faces. No one* ever visits this island. According to the folk tales, the Isle’s only inhabitants are caretakers known as the “the Green Men.” *One person that we know of (allegedly) has, but it’s not worth getting into now.

David asks, “Why didn’t they send Rickon to Howland Reed?”

The swamp keeps of the crannogmen of the Neck are built on movable man-made islands. Howland Reed’s seat, Greywater Watch, is no different; its location changes so often that even ravens can’t find it. Additionally, the Neck is full of snakes and creatures called “lizard-lions,” which sound suspiciously like alligators. Without a crannogmen bayou guide, wandering around in the bogs of the Neck is just a really bad idea. (PS: I need the Ned Stark–Howland Reed friendship origin story. How did those two dudes meet?)

Arielle asks, “What's the deal with the Iron Islands? They seem so easily convinced by everyone! First they were all Team Yara, and now Team Euron?”

If you need to win over a crowd with a speech, never speak first. That’s the lesson of Shakespeare’s Julius Caesar and Euron’s kingsmoot win. The Ironborn are out of practice with the whole democracy thing. The last kingsmoot was held either 4,000 or 2,000 years ago (the scholars disagree), but, either way, it makes no difference. The tradition had been relegated to cultural memory.

Chris asks, “How is it possible that Yara had the loyalty of enough Ironborn who were willing to disregard the will of the Drowned God that she could take what appears to be the entire fleet — on, like, 30 seconds’ notice — but not enough to win the kingsmoot?”

The easiest but also least interesting answer is that there were many, many, many more people in attendance at the kingsmoot that weren’t shown because extras and CGI are expensive. It’s easy to forget that Season 1 presented the entire battle in the Whispering Wood as, like, eight horses galloping across a field. We’re spoiled now. Game of Thrones costs north of $10 million per episode to produce. That’s a $4 million increase from the second season. Most of the budget for “The Door” was likely spent on the extended white walker attack, which featured a direwolf in action (RIP) and multiple explosions.

That said, I counted the ships (more CGI!) that Yara and Theon purloined and came up with about 70. If we round that up to an even 100 and assume the ships are medieval-style cogs run by skeleton crews of 10 per ship, we get a force of 1,000 men. That’s a lot, assuming they were all at the kingsmoot, but it’s not unrealistic to think it wouldn’t be enough to swing the election considering the above rationalizations.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:18 am

One of the lesser of the Maester Columns. Seems rushed.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:38 am

rass wrote:
Johnnie wrote:On the plus side Theater Sansa's tits were nice.

And it's a footnote to the rest of the episode but Arya knows what went down when she wasn't around.
What when? She watched Ned get beheaded back in season 1.

She saw the beheading, but I'm not sure she knew about Tyrion being forced to marry Sansa and the crap thereafter. Or maybe I'm misremembering.

Jerloma · Post by **Jerloma** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:41 am

Yeah, she was walking around Kings Landing pretending to be a homeless girl for some time during that, trying to figure out how to take out the Lannisters.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:42 am

Ok. Then I'll stick to commenting on boobs.

Like Diet Melisandre. We're gunna get to see hers, I'm sure.

Jerloma · Post by **Jerloma** » Tue May 24, 2016 9:47 am

Were those Dany's last week or was that a body double? I thought she'd renegotiated her contract so she doesn't have to show skin.

rass · Post by **rass** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:00 am

Jerloma wrote:Yeah, she was walking around Kings Landing pretending to be a homeless girl for some time during that, trying to figure out how to take out the Lannisters.

No, didn't she clear out pretty quick (for the Wall, but got diverted)? She was gone certainly gone before the Battle of Blackwater, when the Tyrell's saved the city and Sansa was dumped for Margaery.

Sorry Johnnie, you were right.

Jerloma · Post by **Jerloma** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:03 am

I will fucking cut you.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:07 am

Jerloma wrote:Were those Dany's last week or was that a body double? I thought she'd renegotiated her contract so she doesn't have to show skin.

Hers. Not a body double.

rass · Post by **rass** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:11 am

tennbengal wrote:
Jerloma wrote:Were those Dany's last week or was that a body double? I thought she'd renegotiated her contract so she doesn't have to show skin.
Hers. Not a body double.

Hers? Or hers from like 5 years ago?

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:19 am

rass wrote:
tennbengal wrote:
Jerloma wrote:Were those Dany's last week or was that a body double? I thought she'd renegotiated her contract so she doesn't have to show skin.
Hers. Not a body double.
Hers? Or hers from like 5 years ago?

Hers now, I hear/read.

rass · Post by **rass** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:20 am

tennbengal wrote:
rass wrote:
tennbengal wrote:
Jerloma wrote:Were those Dany's last week or was that a body double? I thought she'd renegotiated her contract so she doesn't have to show skin.
Hers. Not a body double.
Hers? Or hers from like 5 years ago?
Hers now, I hear/read.

Thanks TittyBengal!

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Tue May 24, 2016 10:28 am

And she watched the scene with her parents. Awwwwwwww.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Wed May 25, 2016 9:49 pm

Also, internet theory that Sansa is prego with Ramsay's baby.

rass · Post by **rass** » Thu May 26, 2016 5:50 am

Johnnie wrote:Also, internet theory that Sansa is prego with Ramsay's baby.

I saw that. I just don't get what purpose it serves story-wise, I guess.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu May 26, 2016 8:02 am

rass wrote:
Johnnie wrote:Also, internet theory that Sansa is prego with Ramsay's baby.
I saw that. I just don't get what purpose it serves story-wise, I guess.

It's a Stark baby and thus an heir to controlling Winterfell?

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Thu May 26, 2016 8:03 am

Johnnie wrote:
rass wrote:
Johnnie wrote:Also, internet theory that Sansa is prego with Ramsay's baby.
I saw that. I just don't get what purpose it serves story-wise, I guess.
It's a Stark baby and thus an heir to controlling Winterfell?

Wouldn't it be a Bolton baby?

rass · Post by **rass** » Thu May 26, 2016 8:21 am

A_B wrote:
Johnnie wrote:
rass wrote:
Johnnie wrote:Also, internet theory that Sansa is prego with Ramsay's baby.
I saw that. I just don't get what purpose it serves story-wise, I guess.
It's a Stark baby and thus an heir to controlling Winterfell?
Wouldn't it be a Bolton baby?

Regardless, Sansa, Jon, Bran, Arya and Rickon would all be ahead of the kid anyway. Sansa doesn't need a baby to make her claim to WF valid. I don't think a kid is necessary to drive any further conflict with Ramsay.

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Thu May 26, 2016 8:24 am

The only purpose it serves is to make Sansa suffer more. She's Job in this story.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Thu May 26, 2016 10:29 am

Well, there was a reason Tywin decried Tyrion marry and impregnate Sansa (and then flip Jeoffrey to Margery, IIRC). At the time she was the only accessible Stark and thus their baby gave the Lannister's control of WF down the line.

But yea. She's already went through the ringer with shellshock at this point. The Job comparison makes sense.

Rams Fanny · Post by **Rams Fanny** » Thu May 26, 2016 11:20 am

What possible reason are we following Sam Tarly for? It will take years for him finish studying and things will be settled by then. I'm sure there's some plot twist to come but he's very far removed from all the characters from this point.

rass · Post by **rass** » Thu May 26, 2016 11:32 am

Rams Fanny wrote:What possible reason are we following Sam Tarly for? It will take years for him finish studying and things will be settled by then. I'm sure there's some plot twist to come but he's very far removed from all the characters from this point.

Some shit eventually happens in Oldtown in the books, but we're not privy to the importance or outcome of it all yet. Maybe the show will flesh that out a bit.

I do like Sam, and I'm sort of interested in seeing a Tarly family reunion as long as he isn't completely ruined by his father in front of his girl.

Johnnie · Post by **Johnnie** » Mon May 30, 2016 12:11 am

rass wrote:l do like Sam, and I'm sort of interested in seeing a Tarly family reunion as long as he isn't completely ruined by his father in front of his girl.

Yea, about that...

Anyhoo, this episode cemented my hatred of a marriage of church and state.

Also, where did Khaleesi leave her horse?

Moreta · Post by **Moreta** » Mon May 30, 2016 7:39 am

Johnnie wrote: Also, where did Khaleesi leave her horse?

The dragon was hungry.