The Swamp

I can finally post something in an NHL thread!



No team name/logo/colors, but they do have a GM.

We're going to see you turn into a hockey fan, DiS!

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:16 pm We're going to see you turn into a hockey fan, DiS!

We'll get everyone eventually.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:16 pm We're going to see you turn into a hockey fan, DiS!

Oh, I'll be fully on board once the local team starts playing.

(As long as they pick a cool name like Totems. They pick something lame, all bets are off).

DaveInSeattle wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:21 pm

sancarlos wrote: ↑Wed Jul 17, 2019 12:16 pm We're going to see you turn into a hockey fan, DiS!

Oh, I'll be fully on board once the local team starts playing.

(As long as they pick a cool name like Totems. They pick something lame, all bets are off).

I doubt you'd even care about that after a few months. A name is just a name.

I don't wish the Totems/Whatevers any ill, but am looking forward to a lot of people having to eat shit when they suck during their first year, despite whatever all the idiot trolls out there think about how "easy" the expansion draft rules are to game.

So you'll attribute it more to GMGM's brilliance than the expansion sequence? I'd be very, veeerrry surprised if 3 or 4 or whatever GMs again make trades like Columbus or Minnesota where they happily give two or more assets to avoid giving the mandated one asset.

mister d wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2019 2:08 pm So you'll attribute it more to GMGM's brilliance than the expansion sequence? I'd be very, veeerrry surprised if 3 or 4 or whatever GMs again make trades like Columbus or Minnesota where they happily give two or more assets to avoid giving the mandated one asset.

I think it's gonna be a little of both. I'm not as convinced that some teams aren't going to try and use the expansion draft to get them relief under the cap or make a determination that it's better to sacrifice Player X to prevent Seattle from taking Player Y. And even with that it's not going to be as easy to even get to .500, much less win a division and go to the Finals (and then use the assets to build a Cup contender for the next few years).

Some of the really questionable decisions in the '17 expansion draft involved teams dumping first-round picks in my opinion and those had nothing to do with the 17-18 season. Florida wanted to deal Reilly Smith anyway, it just happened to be to Vegas. Minnesota packaging Tuch to take Haula is indefensible in retrospect and Columbus' crime wasn't losing Karlsson, it was giving Vegas a first-round to protect other players.

I think Francis will do fine and I doubt Seattle will be embarrassingly bad for years like some previous expansions, but I don't see how they're going to be able to build anything better than about a .500 team in the first year. GMGM did exceptionally well and probably got exceptionally lucky it should be said. They did their homework on scouting guys like Marchessault, Karlsson and all that, but it's still silly to expect a fourth-line center to become a 40-goal scorer even with more ice time. (The most ridiculous decision in retrospect might have been Pittsburgh sending a second-rounder to take Fleury. I don't think there was ever any question Vegas wasn't gonna take Fleury.)

ETA: GMGM flipped those extra firsts that Columbus and the Islanders sent into Pacioretty and Mark Stone essentially, which is also part of how we got here where VGK is among the favorites for the Cup next year, but those guys didn't have anything to do with the inaugural season. Most of that season was GMGM hitting blackjack after blackjack among the expansion picks and the guys on that team playing over their heads/projections all year.

I doubt there will be anybody as good as Fleury available, for one thing. For another, you've got to believe the rest of the league learned a few things and will do some things differently this time around.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Thu Jul 18, 2019 3:16 pm I doubt there will be anybody as good as Fleury available, for one thing. For another, you've got to believe the rest of the league learned a few things and will do some things differently this time around.

Everyone says that and then GMs end up making the same mistakes over and over again (that said, there seemed to be a lot more restraint and reason to this year's free agency bonanza, so maybe GMs really are learning). I think there will definitely still be some side deals to protect certain players but I think the price will be a lot lighter -- maybe around a third or a fourth-rounder instead of the firsts and seconds Vegas got.

What the what?

Oilers trade Lucic and a conditional 3rd round draft pick to Flames for Neil. Swap of big long term deals.

The proof will be in the pudding, but I've got to believe this will end up being a big win for the Oilers. Neal is not perfect, but I've always thought he was a hard pain-in-the-ass type of guy to play against, and he has a scorer's touch (assuming last year was an aberration). I'd like to have him on my team. On the other hand, Lucic has been on a downhill trend for awhile now and doesn't seem to have the skating speed for today's NHL. Two bad contracts, so that is kind of a wash.

I was thinking same thing tbh. I know the reason for the trade and can’t kill the Flames too much but I think the Oilers got the better of it.

You can only get away with that condition in a deal like this one where both teams are doing addition by subtraction but holy crap is that awesome.

I like the deal because the Flames dont really need more scoring. They finished 1st in the West pretty much without Neal.

But they got physically man handled by the Avs in the first round. If Neal can't crack the top 6 then he's useless. id rather have Lucic in the bottom 6 for the same price. Neal was heartless last year, not even that pain in the ass to play against guy.

What might actually kill the Flames though is that Lucic has a NMC and if he doesn't waive it in two years, then he will have to be protected exposing someone else to Seattle.

Lucic as a deterrent is one of the biggest myths in a sport that loves their myths.

mister d wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:15 pm Lucic as a deterrent is one of the biggest myths in a sport that loves their myths.

Hey I'll take Lucic doing anything at all positive, and isn't taking 2 stupid penalties a game. 

Cause Neal did nothing. 

Nothing. 

Didn't score, didn't defend, didn't cover, didn't control space or time. He skated in circles, disengaged from play, and waited, then complained about his usage. 

He's done.

You probably don’t want to look at the penalties leaderboard.

Yeah the Avs aren’t even a physical team, aside from Zadorov. They didn’t beat the Flames with physicality. Checkitout.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:56 pm Yeah the Avs aren’t even a physical team, aside from Zadorov. They didn’t beat the Flames with physicality. Checkitout.

They are not even a physical team and they crushed the Flames that series. Shows how soft the Flames are.

If the Flames had played the Blues they would have lost in 3

degenerasian wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:24 pm

mister d wrote: ↑Sat Jul 20, 2019 11:15 pm Lucic as a deterrent is one of the biggest myths in a sport that loves their myths.

Hey I'll take Lucic doing anything at all positive, and isn't taking 2 stupid penalties a game. 

Cause Neal did nothing. 

Nothing. 

Didn't score, didn't defend, didn't cover, didn't control space or time. He skated in circles, disengaged from play, and waited, then complained about his usage. 

He's done.

Psst. I think James Neal killed Degen's puppy or something.

First season point total O/Us are out in sports books.

5 teams over 100:

Tampa 108.5
VGK 103.5
Toronto 102.5
Colorado 100.5
Boston 100.5

brian wrote: ↑Sun Jul 21, 2019 10:06 pm First season point total O/Us are out in sports books.

5 teams over 100:

Tampa 108.5
VGK 103.5
Toronto 102.5
Colorado 100.5
Boston 100.5

Surprising amount of faith in a couple of those teams.

Tentative deal for new arena in Calgary.

https://nhl.bamcontent.com/images/asset ... e/file.pdf

He's so great.

Do not get that contract even a little.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 8:19 am Do not get that contract even a little.

I like it.

I'd rather commit 8 years to a 25 year old goalie than signing Bobo like Florida did. They are certainly getting him for his prime years.

If the Bolts waited, they would always need to sign him to an 8 year contract, and the AAV would only increase as the years went by.

This way, they start sooner and get him for more prime years guaranteed.

If he was a RFA next year, the number wouldn't be less, based on what other RFA"s are asking for. And perhaps he might have only wanted to sign for the years to take him to UFA.

Sooner than later, goalies are going to become the NHL version of RBs.

degenerasian wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:15 am

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 8:19 am Do not get that contract even a little.

I like it.

I'd rather commit 8 years to a 25 year old goalie than signing Bobo like Florida did. They are certainly getting him for his prime years.

If the Bolts waited, they would always need to sign him to an 8 year contract, and the AAV would only increase as the years went by.

This way, they start sooner and get him for more prime years guaranteed.

If he was a RFA next year, the number wouldn't be less, based on what other RFA"s are asking for. And perhaps he might have only wanted to sign for the years to take him to UFA.

It's an overpay but it's what the market is demanding. I agree that it doesn't look as bad when his NMC comes off at age 30 and if you max out you've only got him through 33/34 yo.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:22 am Sooner than later, goalies are going to become the NHL version of RBs.

Pretty much already there, draft-wise, no?

Yup, but the contracts haven't followed yet. Tampa is now at $67MM for 2020-21 with Point and Sergachev both unsigned.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:42 am Yup, but the contracts haven't followed yet. Tampa is now at $67MM for 2020-21 with Point and Sergachev both unsigned.

41.125 tied up in 5 guys. Blackhawks syndrome except TBL players can still play.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 9:22 am Sooner than later, goalies are going to become the NHL version of RBs.

Oiler is right there with you on this. A few weeks ago, he and I were debating what was going to happen with Vasy, with him taking the side that you can essentially plug in anyone there, or rotate, etc. My position was that Vasy seems to have exceeded or met all of his hype, and not having to scramble to fill that position every year is worth something.

I am a little bit more concerned about what happens with Point after this, and Sergachev next (especially if he gets paired with Hedman this year).

You're kind of damned if you do and damned if you don't with goalies though. For that kind of term, you'd like to think they might have been able to get him a little cheaper, but not extending him isn't really an option either.

VGK trades Gusev to New Jersey for a second and a third. Bummed they couldn't get him on the team, but that's not a bad return for a guy they got in the expansion draft.

The Devils could be interesting this season.

Devils constantly make good trades.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Jul 29, 2019 2:19 pm Devils constantly make good trades.

And get lucky in the lottery. That's a good combination.