Presidential Election 2024

[degenerasian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

[The Sybian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

There have been more female than male law students for at least 25 years. Probably a higher number of men as partners in big firms and in leadership positions because many sacrifice career advancement for family, STEM actually is problematic. School and workplaces are often uncomfortable for women. Lots of creepy guys in STEM jobs and the work environments usually aren’t welcoming.

[Rush2112]

Question regarding the women in law numbers, are the women going into particular aspects of law that don't lead to big firms or is there still a glass ceiling besides the family aspect? I know a few women lawyers and they are either law librarians or involved in "lesser" aspects of the law (immigration and music.)

As for STEM, I think it's tough for women to be attached to STEM fields even at lower levels of schooling.

[degenerasian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

There have been more female than male law students for at least 25 years. Probably a higher number of men as partners in big firms and in leadership positions because many sacrifice career advancement for family, STEM actually is problematic. School and workplaces are often uncomfortable for women. Lots of creepy guys in STEM jobs and the work environments usually aren’t welcoming.

Can't be more creepier than guys on construction sites.

But also it doesn't work the other way. Why are they not pushing and investing guys into nursing as an example.

[The Sybian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

There have been more female than male law students for at least 25 years. Probably a higher number of men as partners in big firms and in leadership positions because many sacrifice career advancement for family, STEM actually is problematic. School and workplaces are often uncomfortable for women. Lots of creepy guys in STEM jobs and the work environments usually aren’t welcoming.

Can't be more creepier than guys on construction sites.

But also it doesn't work the other way. Why are they not pushing and investing guys into nursing as an example.

Because men aren’t historically oppressed and discriminated against? Women who want STEM careers were either pushed away or made uncomfortable in the academic setting and walked away, I just don’t think there are that many women who wanted careers in construction and walked away. I keep reading your initial post about welders, and I just don’t see that you aren’t advocating for getting more women in welding. Am I missing sarcasm?

[degenerasian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

There have been more female than male law students for at least 25 years. Probably a higher number of men as partners in big firms and in leadership positions because many sacrifice career advancement for family, STEM actually is problematic. School and workplaces are often uncomfortable for women. Lots of creepy guys in STEM jobs and the work environments usually aren’t welcoming.

Can't be more creepier than guys on construction sites.

But also it doesn't work the other way. Why are they not pushing and investing guys into nursing as an example.

Because men aren’t historically oppressed and discriminated against? Women who want STEM careers were either pushed away or made uncomfortable in the academic setting and walked away, I just don’t think there are that many women who wanted careers in construction and walked away. I keep reading your initial post about welders, and I just don’t see that you aren’t advocating for getting more women in welding. Am I missing sarcasm?

I'm just pointing out the difference in the Democrats philosophy about equality, since we were talking about the election. And right now, their direction is seen as elitist and white collar. I've worked both in an IT office and on a construction site and there's no way that an IT office is creepier or that women are more uncomfortable there. Stuff you hear on a site, you'd never hear in an office. Coincidentally, I've only even worked for female managers in the office and male managers on site. Many women want careers in construction, and this is not all physical work, there are sales, procurement, other offsite jobs and they walked away. It's still seen as a 'boy's club" and it's hard for women not to be discouraged. Even if the woman is the manager, the guys will still go ask the guys.

[mister d]

[P.D.X.]

ah, trial by tweets

[Johnnie]

[Shirley]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

What the fuck, dude? There's so much ignorance in those sentences that I don't even know where to start. And I don't have time, so I won't. But I'm really curious to hear your explanation of why men dominate those fields (and many/most others) "naturally."

[degenerasian]

And do we need equality in all jobs? I mean, if a woman wants to be a welder or construction worker, by all means I want her to have an equal opportunity. But is there a “shortage” of female welders? Is there a benefit in diversity in welding? It’s not like women weld differently and improve the ideas in welding. My guess is a lot more men want welding jobs than women, it’s not discriminatory, it just is.

That's my point. There isn't a shortage anywhere, we don't need equality in any job. But the left thinks that there is a 'shortage' in STEM and in executive positions. There are more men in law, chemistry and mathematics naturally. That's not discriminatory either but is viewed as such. There's this huge push and money invested to get women in those fields but not the same for welding or construction. These initiatives are only invested and 'forced' in the white collar world

What the fuck, dude? There's so much ignorance in those sentences that I don't even know where to start. And I don't have time, so I won't. But I'm really curious to hear your explanation of why men dominate those fields (and many/most others) "naturally."

Naturally is the wrong word. Syb and I are discussing how some jobs just have more men than women and it's not discriminatory or a shortage.

[HaulCitgo]

They care and it is important because these are some of the countrys highest paying jobs. Like you said white collar. The gateway to quality of life improvements for not only the woman but her childrens yet to be born children. No one cares about welding because it doesn't have those kind of social class impacts, though I do think women could be of benefit to welding. They might do it better or innovate somehow. We wouldn't know.

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

[Shirley]

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

Absolutely. And this same pattern appears any many high-paying fields. It's not "natural" in any sense other than misogyny is natural.

(Aside - when my wife was graduating from law school and interviewing for associates and law clerk positions, more than one partner/judge asked her what her daddy does. The good old boys network is alive and well.)

[EnochRoot]

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

Absolutely. And this same pattern appears any many high-paying fields. It's not "natural" in any sense other than misogyny is natural.

(Aside - when my wife was graduating from law school and interviewing for associates and law clerk positions, more than one partner/judge asked her what her daddy does. The good old boys network is alive and well.)

Not to sound crass, but…so what?

It’s not the Democrats’ job to cure all of society’s ills. Show up for the working man first and foremost and then worry about the rest.

Or, get sucker-punched by a demagogue again.

[P.D.X.]

*working person

[cerranoredux]

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

Absolutely. And this same pattern appears any many high-paying fields. It's not "natural" in any sense other than misogyny is natural.

(Aside - when my wife was graduating from law school and interviewing for associates and law clerk positions, more than one partner/judge asked her what her daddy does. The good old boys network is alive and well.)

Not to sound crass, but…so what?

It’s not the Democrats’ job to cure all of society’s ills. Show up for the working man first and foremost and then worry about the rest.

Or, get sucker-punched by a demagogue again.

Yeah, like the Republicans did.

[EnochRoot]

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

Absolutely. And this same pattern appears any many high-paying fields. It's not "natural" in any sense other than misogyny is natural.

(Aside - when my wife was graduating from law school and interviewing for associates and law clerk positions, more than one partner/judge asked her what her daddy does. The good old boys network is alive and well.)

Not to sound crass, but…so what?

It’s not the Democrats’ job to cure all of society’s ills. Show up for the working man first and foremost and then worry about the rest.

Or, get sucker-punched by a demagogue again.

Yeah, like the Republicans did.

They have a super-majority on SCOTUS and own both houses. It's a tradeoff they were clearly willing to make (again).

[Shirley]

And there very definitely is a glass ceiling in law. Women are over represented at the entry points buy by the time you get to lawyers in business positions/c suites, and large or prestigious firm leadership, there are few. The path to adhere to perceived leadership quotas is often to promote women to head of HR or chief of compliance or general counsels in some cases.

Absolutely. And this same pattern appears any many high-paying fields. It's not "natural" in any sense other than misogyny is natural.

(Aside - when my wife was graduating from law school and interviewing for associates and law clerk positions, more than one partner/judge asked her what her daddy does. The good old boys network is alive and well.)

Not to sound crass, but…so what?

It’s not the Democrats’ job to cure all of society’s ills. Show up for the working man first and foremost and then worry about the rest.

Or, get sucker-punched by a demagogue again.

I wasn't talking about Democrat policy. And unless I missed it, equal pay and access to top jobs for women wasn't part of their platform. But fine, you don't care.

[HaulCitgo]

You don't need to distinguish between class when selling democrats vision on many social issues. Some will be of more or less interest to certain classes but equality for women still plays at many economic levels given the right mouthpiece. Abortion is the not same thing even if it was a winning issue.

[degenerasian]

Do Democrats just end up running as "Republicans who care?"

[mister d]

Hasn't that been the only real distinction for several cycles now? Both parties are completely beholden to money before anything else.

[degenerasian]

Hasn't that been the only real distinction for several cycles now? Both parties are completely beholden to money before anything else.

Not really because the Democrats have been calling Republicans wackjobs for several cycles. Everyone who disagrees with Democrats are racists. Not everyone can be a racist, Mitt Romney can't be a racist if Trump is racist.

What I mean is the Democrats go that far right, become Republican wackjobs who care.

[L-Jam3]

Is it something that if a person leans left, that means they have some level of empathy and humanity? And since there is only one major left-leaning party in America, the Democratic party has more of a tendency of people who aren't really predisposed to fighting to crush their enemies?

Take Schumer for example. When he was the majority party leader in the Senate, it seemed like he buckled. And I'm not necessarily calling him a shit, but more like someone who was trying to get along. And with him and Pelosi, they tried to blunt the attacks of the left-most wing of their party (the Squad), maybe because by being empathetic, they didn't have the inclination to crush. And yes, I agree with D that both parties, including the Dems, are beholden to money, but money is what's necessary to win elections. That's an unfortunate political reality.

I am more and more apt to follow Democrats who are of an aggrieved group because frankly, they seem more apt to pull up their sleeves and fight. Like a Black woman who has reached a certain level of success got there not because she kowtowed, but because she fought head-on. That's a person I want in leadership of the party.

[L-Jam3]

(And yes, I'm not defending Pelosi. She's just as corrupt as the Republicans. That factors into her silencing the leftward faction too, if not more than other factors.)

[mister d]

I know I've said this before and ad nauseum, but old white millionaires cannot effectively lead an opposition party. Its self-evidently impossible.

[The Sybian]

I know I've said this before and ad nauseum, but old white millionaires cannot effectively lead an opposition party. Its self-evidently impossible.

So what you are saying is we need old white Billionaires! That seemed effective.

[A_B]

I'd argue the republican's just ran an effective opposition party with old white guys in charge.

[degenerasian]

Yeah but there's a lot of monday morning QB that a black woman couldn't win, america was not 'ready'.

So unfortunately, the candidate that L-Jam wants to lead the party, won't in the forseeable future. They're going to run Newsom.

[mister d]

I'd argue the republican's just ran an effective opposition party with old white guys in charge.

And the reason they were able to is because of who the Dems are. The average person can't truly identify with that level of wealth so then it becomes about personality.

[Jerloma]

And yes, I agree with D that both parties, including the Dems, are beholden to money, but money is what's necessary to win elections. That's an unfortunate political reality.

Well, she raised a billion dollars which is insane.

Instead of looking at total dollars raised, it may be better indicator to look at the number of individual contributions vs. dollars raised. Sure, Elon can go ahead and drop 100 million in your PAC but he still only gets one vote.

[Johnnie]

Do Democrats just end up running as "Republicans who care?"

They're so anti-progressive, they might as well.

It's funny. I finally got around to listening to a few podcasts in my backlog because I've been preoccupied.

A topic that popped up within them was "Do liberals need their own Joe Rogan??" and the point was made "The Democrats had a liberal Joe Rogan years ago. It was Joe Rogan." But hey, he was vilified for not checking all of the boxes and had a bit of a 'checkered' past, so he was kicked out before he was even brought in.

Republicans have been embracing non mainstream media outlets like Theo Von, Rogan, Flagrant, etc...and Democrats, as usual, were behind the curve. In fact, Rogan said he was voting for Bernie in 2020 and it was met with scorn by the media and establishment Democrats.

https://amp.cnn.com/cnn/2020/01/24/poli ... ndorsement

It's what Will McAvoy said in The Newsroom:

You know why people don't like liberals? It's because they lose. If liberals are so fucking smart how come they lose so goddamn always?

[HaulCitgo]

Democrats just need someone that isn't from the northeast, west coast or Minnesota. That alone will cure many ills

[Rush2112]

Democrats just need someone that isn't from the northeast, west coast or Minnesota. That alone will cure many ills

We have a gay white Democratic governor here in CO!

[Brontoburglar]

his RFKJr support last week was quite the plot twist

[The Sybian]

his RFKJr support last week was quite the plot twist

Yeah, that was really surprising.

[GoodKarma]

Local news kept re-iterating that his social accounts were not hacked.

Polis framed it as allowing choice when it comes to vaccines and "making America healthy again"...which was interesting language and odd choice considering his state was the only one to vote further left. My guess is, since he is the Chair of the National Governors Association, it was an attempt to make nice with the incoming administration.

[Jerloma]

Harris campaign sent me an email today asking for donations to join them in their fight against Trump's presidency. I don't know what the fuck they think they're gonna do, but where's Bezos, Gates, and Zuck now? It's not surprising that that the Dems got a lot more donations from the billionaire CEOs because the GOP is going to deregulate everything and let capitalism completely crush us if it kills them anyway. So a Harris donation is just hedging their bets.

Take the LinkedIn dude that donated $7 million and explicitly said it was to get Lina Khan fired, because bribery is legal at only the most consequential areas that we could have made it legal. Billionaires don't really spend money without getting a lot more in return. That's why they're billionaires.

But if Trump wins, that's a go anyway. (Although Vance oddly seems to have some fairly progressive anti-trust views)

Point is, the billionaires and the investor class win no matter what. Then the shitty campaign comes and pleads to the class that they abruptly abandoned in order to appease said billionaires to cover their debt for said shitty campaign.

So for everyone who still gets all confused whenever someone types the word "establishment"...this.

[Johnnie]

They raised a billion dollars in 3 months and were 20 million in debt once the election was over.

Even the Pod Save guys are like "What the fuck is this shit?"

Fuck them. Where did that money go?

[A_B]

Fuck them. Where did that money go?

I woudn't know because i unsubscribed from all that bullshit. Fuck off asking for money now after that fucking debacle.