World Cup 2018 Qualification

Post by **Shirley** » Tue Oct 24, 2017 5:33 pm

He's 10. We'll probably never hear from him again.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Sun Oct 29, 2017 9:20 am

Cool effort. And it is great that they created this opportunity at my club for the girl they mentioned. I don't know what level travel she is playing on. Our club runs rec, multiple levels of travel, and ECLN (Elite Club with National travel) on the girls side. I believe the U-16 top team is coached by
Cindi Harkes.
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/soc ... y-problem/

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Thu Nov 09, 2017 4:01 pm

Balls

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/footba ... d-Cup.html

mister d · Post by **mister d** » Thu Nov 09, 2017 4:01 pm

Every time this thread is bumped its another kick in the dick.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:00 pm

Italy and Sweden has been good so far.

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:05 pm

Is this 2 legs?

Steve of phpBB · Post by **Steve of phpBB** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:08 pm

A_B · Post by **A_B** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:12 pm

Did Buffon protest or someThing?

NVM. I let my americanness assume something, but he apparently just was singing the anthem like a crazy person.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 3:17 pm

wlu_lax6 wrote:Italy and Sweden has been good so far.

I also like that Italy's striker is "Immobile"

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:06 pm

Senegal has qualified with it's win this morning over South Africa.

Honduras-Australia starts at the top of the hour.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:08 pm

and Sweden just scored

Brontoburglar · Post by **Brontoburglar** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:10 pm

wlu_lax6 wrote:
wlu_lax6 wrote:Italy and Sweden has been good so far.

I also like that Italy's striker is "Immobile"

the analyst's constant griping about the Italian players has me chuckling

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 4:59 pm

When you watch Italy in tournaments - or in qualification for that matter - you just wait for them to start playing well. Reputation can only take you so far, they looked horrible today.

Post by **brian** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 5:20 pm

Italy missing the World Cup would make me feel about three percent better. Hopefully Sweden can get an early goal against Italy and just force the Azzurri to try and score three.

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 5:21 pm

Ref called a penalty against Honduras then took it back (overruled by Italian linesman for offside!)

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:16 pm

NZ-Peru starting on BeIN

Rex · Post by **Rex** » Fri Nov 10, 2017 10:19 pm

Someone's getting Geiger'd on the world stage tonight!

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 2:22 pm

Who's watching Italy-Sweden?

Italy need goals but still refuse to start Insigne

sancarlos · Post by **sancarlos** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:17 pm

Christian Pulisic wrote an interesting piece in the Players' Tribune

“For a soccer player … man, ask anyone and they’ll tell you — those age 16–18 years are everything,” Pulisic wrote. “From a developmental perspective, it’s almost like this sweet spot: It’s the age where a player’s growth and skill sort of intersect, in just the right way — and where, with the right direction, a player can make their biggest leap in development by far.”

He then went on to explain, and in some places opine about, the difference between spending those years in the U.S. versus in Europe:

“In the U.S. system, too often the best player on an under-17 team will be treated like a ‘star’ — not having to work for the ball, being the focus of the offense at all times, etc. — at a time when they should be having to fight tooth and nail for their spot. In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been ‘the best player,’ and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.
“Without those experiences, there’s simply no way that I would be at anywhere close to the level that I am today.”

Good analysis of it, here:

Players' Tribune essay, here:

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:19 pm

“For a soccer player … man, ask anyone and they’ll tell you — those age 16–18 years are everything,” Pulisic wrote. “From a developmental perspective, it’s almost like this sweet spot: It’s the age where a player’s growth and skill sort of intersect, in just the right way — and where, with the right direction, a player can make their biggest leap in development by far.”

He's clearly brilliant because that lines up with my thoughts in this thread.

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:19 pm

sancarlos wrote:Christian Pulisic wrote an interesting piece in the Players' Tribune

“For a soccer player … man, ask anyone and they’ll tell you — those age 16–18 years are everything,” Pulisic wrote. “From a developmental perspective, it’s almost like this sweet spot: It’s the age where a player’s growth and skill sort of intersect, in just the right way — and where, with the right direction, a player can make their biggest leap in development by far.”

He then went on to explain, and in some places opine about, the difference between spending those years in the U.S. versus in Europe:

“In the U.S. system, too often the best player on an under-17 team will be treated like a ‘star’ — not having to work for the ball, being the focus of the offense at all times, etc. — at a time when they should be having to fight tooth and nail for their spot. In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been ‘the best player,’ and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.
“Without those experiences, there’s simply no way that I would be at anywhere close to the level that I am today.”

Good analysis of it, here:

Players' Tribune essay, here:

In The Guardian

https://www.theguardian.com/football/20 ... -us-soccer

Post by **brian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:23 pm

degenerasian wrote:Who's watching Italy-Sweden?

Italy need goals but still refuse to start Insigne

Sweden seem content to stay back and counterattack, which they might end up regretting.

Post by **Sabo** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 3:23 pm

In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been ‘the best player,’ and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.

This is the very same thing Jermaine Jones talked about in the video he posted after the US crashed out of the World Cup. Go watch his video if you haven't yet.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:06 pm

I mean... WE'VE been saying this stuff. Very specifically that Pulisic was actually developed just fine in the US system (his words), but that the vital difference maker is the Croatian passport that let him go over at 16.

Sargent has to wait a full year to go, when he's clearly ready now. There are dozens of kids in the academies that should be in Europe.

What I like about that article (well, there's a LOT to like)... I like that he's introducing the idea of lobbying to change that rule. It won't happen, but I like that he's even thinking on that level.

Fucking sucks that kid's not gonna be in Russia.

Post by **brian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:12 pm

Seeing "Immobile" on the jersey of a soccer player is never not going to make me chuckle a little.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:15 pm

Also, having just now zipped through those two pieces, it's very telling to me that they don't mention that he was developed primarily in the US system. Yes, he went to Barca and a few other Euro club camps... Other kids get to do that too.

I keep stressing this point because there's a sky is falling mentality that needs to be knocked down. If you get too bogged down in doom and gloom, it becomes difficult to get past the inertia.

The academies are on an upward trend. The U-17 and U20s just did pretty well at their WCs. The US system now has U15, 16, 18, and 19 squads. By the time the 22 cycle rolls around, I'm pretty psyched that a 21-22 yo Pulisic is going to be joined by a nice batch of young players with multiple years or academy, national team, and professional experience.

I've outlined in great detail all the shit that needs to get fixed. But the more "casual" fans I talk to, the more I realize a lot of folks are just entirely too negative and forlorn about the future. The now sucks. I'm gonna be bummed about it all summer. And beyond. But I do see the light flickering in the distance.

Post by **brian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:29 pm

Meanwhile, high drama at the San Siro here.

Post by **brian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:42 pm

hahahahahahahahaha. Fuck Italy.

P.D.X. · Post by **P.D.X.** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:43 pm

https://twitter.com/DaleJohnsonESPN/sta ... 0406940672

degenerasian · Post by **degenerasian** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 4:43 pm

How many highballs do Italy have put into the box before they realize it doesn't work

Baloney · Post by **Baloney** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 5:48 pm

Arrivederci

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 6:26 pm

Sabo wrote:
In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been ‘the best player,’ and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.

This is the very same thing Jermaine Jones talked about in the video he posted after the US crashed out of the World Cup. Go watch his video if you haven't yet.

But in the professional context vs youth. And took special time out to skewer Jordan Morris for being a bitch.

Pruitt · Post by **Pruitt** » Mon Nov 13, 2017 7:01 pm

I don;t know enough about Italian soccer to know if Insigne would have made the difference... but the English announcers we had on the feed here were shocked that he wasn't starting and stunned and then kind of angry that he wasn't brought in.

Final stats showed Italy with 75% possession, but other than one great save that the Swedish keeper made, it just didn't feel like they were going to score.

Ciao, ciao.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:09 am

Buffon, De Rossi, Chiellini, Barzagli all will retire. 60 years since Italy has not qualified. Bet their soul searching is worse than what is going on in the U.S. I am reading about Italy having a shallow player pool and weak youth teams.

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 8:50 am

Cupboard wasn't bare though...

https://twitter.com/Adz77/status/930371397897027584

tennbengal · Post by **tennbengal** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:01 am

More from Pulisic - I could not agree more:

In the U.S. system, too often the best player on an under-17 team will be treated like a “star” — not having to work for the ball, being the focus of the offense at all times, etc. — at a time when they should be having to fight tooth and nail for their spot. In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been “the best player,” and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.

Without those experiences, there’s simply no way that I would be at anywhere close to the level that I am today.

And so I really just wonder, you know: Why is it that E.U. players are allowed to move country once they turn 16 … but non-Europeans can only do so at 18? Why aren’t we campaigning for a level playing field, where our best 16 year olds — who may not have an E.U. passport like I had — are free to move when they turn 16, like the best young players in Europe can? And in the meanwhile, as long as some of our best young players aren’t getting the opportunity like I had to go to Europe when they’re 16 … are we doing everything in our power to make sure the level of play in U.S. soccer is high enough so that they can continue to develop up to their maximum potential? So that they can continue to develop until they are allowed to play at the top level their talent dictates — wherever that is in the world?

I also understand, of course, that — even with the option to leave — leaving the States might not be for everyone. Staying is fine, and I totally respect it. But at the same time, I’ve gotta say: It really does frustrate me, when I watch MLS, and I see our best U-17 players — who, again, are so talented and so capable — being rostered … but then not being put on the field much to actually play. I watch that, and I just think about how I was given a chance … a real chance … and it changed my life. Why then are we seemingly hesitant to allow these other talents to blossom?

Again, from points I made either earlier in this thread, or other soccer threads on here, the issue in the US is NOT the U14 development programs in my opinion, it is what happens in the age 14-17 years - that's where the slippage occurs with respect to keeping up with the rest of the world. By the time they get to 18 and finally get to go overseas, they have lost extremely valuable development time...

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:29 am

Yeah, I think we're reaching "broad consensus/awareness" in the wake of not making the WC. I don't think a lot of people had really focused on it in a serious way.

The thing is, it's not something the US can just snap their fingers and fix. I haven't been able to find the European perspective on this, but just from following Yanks Abroad over the years, there is tension between various Federations and the clubs. The clubs, naturally, want as deep and broad a talent pool as possible. The Feds want to make sure the national team player pool quality doesn't suffer when their youth are squeezed out for academy spots.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:32 am

tennbengal wrote:More from Pulisic - I could not agree more:

In the U.S. system, too often the best player on an under-17 team will be treated like a “star” — not having to work for the ball, being the focus of the offense at all times, etc. — at a time when they should be having to fight tooth and nail for their spot. In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been “the best player,” and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.

Without those experiences, there’s simply no way that I would be at anywhere close to the level that I am today.

And so I really just wonder, you know: Why is it that E.U. players are allowed to move country once they turn 16 … but non-Europeans can only do so at 18? Why aren’t we campaigning for a level playing field, where our best 16 year olds — who may not have an E.U. passport like I had — are free to move when they turn 16, like the best young players in Europe can? And in the meanwhile, as long as some of our best young players aren’t getting the opportunity like I had to go to Europe when they’re 16 … are we doing everything in our power to make sure the level of play in U.S. soccer is high enough so that they can continue to develop up to their maximum potential? So that they can continue to develop until they are allowed to play at the top level their talent dictates — wherever that is in the world?

I also understand, of course, that — even with the option to leave — leaving the States might not be for everyone. Staying is fine, and I totally respect it. But at the same time, I’ve gotta say: It really does frustrate me, when I watch MLS, and I see our best U-17 players — who, again, are so talented and so capable — being rostered … but then not being put on the field much to actually play. I watch that, and I just think about how I was given a chance … a real chance … and it changed my life. Why then are we seemingly hesitant to allow these other talents to blossom?

Again, from points I made either earlier in this thread, or other soccer threads on here, the issue in the US is NOT the U14 development programs in my opinion, it is what happens in the age 14-17 years - that's where the slippage occurs with respect to keeping up with the rest of the world. By the time they get to 18 and finally get to go overseas, they have lost extremely valuable development time...

It creates a really interesting cultural question. There are very small subset of kids where going overseas makes sense. Truly gifted soccer players who can make the gamble of giving up on education to be a professional soccer player. And many of them will wash out or hit bad luck. Julian Green, Gedion Zelalem. But if your kid had that talent would you put it all on the table or hedge and say you will have a great experience playing for a MLS Academy/Development Academy team with good coaches and training. A chance to get a high school diploma and a decision to go pro (Chris Durkin, Bill Hamid), start college and then go pro (Jordan Morris, Robbie Rodgers), or graduate and go pro (Bobby Warshaw has a degree from Stanford).

Or go to high school, get drafted by the MLS, go to college and play football, and then kick for the Chargers and Jacksonville in the NFL.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:32 am

And to point out the obvious, the same is true in reverse. Who is going to push for a change in EU policy? US Soccer, to date, is so enmeshed with MLS that it seems highly unlikely there would be any real incentive or consensus on what would certainly be seen as a threat to the burgeoning academy structure.

I guess it all starts by figuring out how to pay the academies back when they develop a player and he either gets picked up by a professional club (MLS or Euro or Mexican or whatever.) Right now, a player gets plucked for an academy and a club that developed that player for 5 years gets nothing but a handshake.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Tue Nov 14, 2017 9:38 am

wlu_lax6 wrote:
tennbengal wrote:More from Pulisic - I could not agree more:

In the U.S. system, too often the best player on an under-17 team will be treated like a “star” — not having to work for the ball, being the focus of the offense at all times, etc. — at a time when they should be having to fight tooth and nail for their spot. In Europe, on the other hand, the average level of ability around you is just so much higher. It’s a pool of players where everyone has been “the best player,” and everyone is fighting for a spot — truly week in and week out. Which makes the intensity and humility that you need to bring to the field every day — both from a mental and physical perspective — just unlike anything that you can really experience in U.S. developmental soccer.

Without those experiences, there’s simply no way that I would be at anywhere close to the level that I am today.

And so I really just wonder, you know: Why is it that E.U. players are allowed to move country once they turn 16 … but non-Europeans can only do so at 18? Why aren’t we campaigning for a level playing field, where our best 16 year olds — who may not have an E.U. passport like I had — are free to move when they turn 16, like the best young players in Europe can? And in the meanwhile, as long as some of our best young players aren’t getting the opportunity like I had to go to Europe when they’re 16 … are we doing everything in our power to make sure the level of play in U.S. soccer is high enough so that they can continue to develop up to their maximum potential? So that they can continue to develop until they are allowed to play at the top level their talent dictates — wherever that is in the world?

I also understand, of course, that — even with the option to leave — leaving the States might not be for everyone. Staying is fine, and I totally respect it. But at the same time, I’ve gotta say: It really does frustrate me, when I watch MLS, and I see our best U-17 players — who, again, are so talented and so capable — being rostered … but then not being put on the field much to actually play. I watch that, and I just think about how I was given a chance … a real chance … and it changed my life. Why then are we seemingly hesitant to allow these other talents to blossom?

Again, from points I made either earlier in this thread, or other soccer threads on here, the issue in the US is NOT the U14 development programs in my opinion, it is what happens in the age 14-17 years - that's where the slippage occurs with respect to keeping up with the rest of the world. By the time they get to 18 and finally get to go overseas, they have lost extremely valuable development time...

It creates a really interesting cultural question. There are very small subset of kids where going overseas makes sense. Truly gifted soccer players who can make the gamble of giving up on education to be a professional soccer player. And many of them will wash out or hit bad luck. Julian Green, Gedion Zelalem. But if your kid had that talent would you put it all on the table or hedge and say you will have a great experience playing for a MLS Academy/Development Academy team with good coaches and training. A chance to get a high school diploma and a decision to go pro (Chris Durkin, Bill Hamid), start college and then go pro (Jordan Morris, Robbie Rodgers), or graduate and go pro (Bobby Warshaw has a degree from Stanford).

Or go to high school, get drafted by the MLS, go to college and play football, and then kick for the Chargers and Jacksonville in the NFL.

I don't have the time to actually go dig this up, but I'm almost 100 percent sure that residential academies in the states are required to have academics baked in, and I'd be REALLY surprised if the same wasn't true in Europe. So I don't think anyone is forced to make an academic/athletic choice. They do have to make a life altering, massive upheaval choice to attend any residential academy, obviously exacerbated if they go to a place where they don't speak the language.