More Backroom Deals Than Tammany Hall - A Youth Soccer Tale

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Apr 14, 2023 12:38 pm

My kids coach and I suspect a bunch of others have spots over the summer in case a kid comes along. Ton of different reasons why but kids that can play are still around through fall so not likely all or nothing. Someones getting cut from somebody's top team so id think theres a lot of 2nds and 3rds out there that will have to make room late if they want better players. Like the guy who just lost his best 4... gotta think a new best player in May/June would sound pretty good. Hell sounds like the team at her current club will still need her. Some of the top leagues are probably different cause theres tons of interest and limited top talent and only so many more you can add past 20... 22... 24 but for everyone else just seems like a pressure tactic.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Apr 14, 2023 3:18 pm

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Tue May 02, 2023 1:22 pm

That time of year, kid says lots of new faces in and out of practice.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Thu May 04, 2023 9:26 pm

The torture of not knowing drags on... Last I posted, my daughter went to a PDA practice and loved it. Coach told her she fit in well and he wanted to see her a couple more times before tryouts. Showed up the following week, coach was sick so they combined with the team a year younger. Showed up the week after, and the coach forgot to tell me he changed the time and location, so we showed up as the team was leaving.

Had tryouts on Tuesday. Coach ended by telling everyone they will send emails inviting a few girls to a practice, and if you don't get an email, you aren't being considered. Fortunately, the coach went up to my daughter and told her to come back Thursday so I didn't have to stress waiting to see if he sent an email. She went to the practice tonight, and I was thrilled to see only 2 other girls who weren't already on the team, but I know at least one girl who was invited but couldn't make it tonight. She fits in well talent wise, so just a matter of whether there is an opening at her position. Coach said they'd send out offers in about a week.

As for the "safety" team, the coach has been incredible. He told me to be honest and tell him where she is at, so I've been 100% open with him. He told me he would hold a spot, but he hoped PDA doesn't wait too long after tryouts. I got a very harshly worded auto-generated email from him saying it's past deadline and he needs an immediate response to the offer, as it isn't fair to waitlisted kids . I just assumed that didn't apply to me since I already discussed our situation. Just hope he can give me another week.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri May 05, 2023 7:17 am

Heard anything about the (still another) new league? Think I saw pda is in it. She might end up there. mls next second teams I've heard like ecrl. Probably won't effect my kid but mls/new league/npl/e64 all before you get to local league? They've got tons of players and a really great mlsn next team but don't think they've got enough for that many regional travel teams not to mention about 6 other teams in the age group

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Fri May 05, 2023 7:22 am

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Fri May 05, 2023 7:17 am Heard anything about the (still another) new league? Think I saw pda is in it. She might end up there. mls next second teams I've heard like ecrl. Probably won't effect my kid but mls/new league/npl/e64 all before you get to local league? They've got tons of players and a really great mlsn next team but don't think they've got enough for that many regional travel teams not to mention about 6 other teams in the age group

If by new league you mean E64, locally I think teams have their existing teams play in that league. I don’t really get it. Like MatchFit has two locations, and in each age group, the better of the two plays ECNL, worse plays ECRL, but for E64, it’s whoever is available from the two teams thrown together for the game.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri May 05, 2023 7:39 am

Nah it's something like national academy League. Whispers mostly

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Fri May 05, 2023 7:58 am

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Fri May 05, 2023 7:39 am Nah it's something like national academy League. Whispers mostly

JFC, like this shit isn’t confusing enough already. Just looked it up, and there is a Northeast Academy League under NAL. Several clubs are currently in my daughters league flight. The rest are going to an expanded ECRL. They are adding 60 or so clubs to ECRL without ECNL spots. I don’t get that either, but I’m sure it’s about money and increased recruiting.

My daughter is currently playing EDP in a flight called Club Club. Same clubs in every age group. Website bills it as competitive with ECNL, but it’s a joke as too much disparity. One team gotten crushed like 10-0 every game in our age group, but older girls in 2 age groups won the league. They dropped out, this team dropped 5 flights out of 7.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri May 05, 2023 10:49 am

Used to call kids team club v club also and it works great to me. Same deal all clubs put in boys and girls teams at every age group. A couple do struggle with that but only on the girls side. They started relegation last year so the competitive level is similar and the outliers are at the top cause some mid-big clubs have their #1s in there so that just makes it more competitive. Flip side is that some of weaker ecnl clubs 3rds cant keep up and get relegated so not every club has a club v club team anymore. Kid (and dad) is very lucky, team is tough for him and he can (could... this is atlanta) walk to the main field and his team practices at the HS. All the teams are in state and only one is more than an hour.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Fri May 05, 2023 11:12 am

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Fri May 05, 2023 10:49 am Used to call kids team club v club also and it works great to me. Same deal all clubs put in boys and girls teams at every age group. A couple do struggle with that but only on the girls side. They started relegation last year so the competitive level is similar and the outliers are at the top cause some mid-big clubs have their #1s in there so that just makes it more competitive. Flip side is that some of weaker ecnl clubs 3rds cant keep up and get relegated so not every club has a club v club team anymore. Kid (and dad) is very lucky, team is tough for him and he can (could... this is atlanta) walk to the main field and his team practices at the HS. All the teams are in state and only one is more than an hour.

You are incredibly lucky with the proximity, and I love the relegation idea. We are only in the second year of the Club v. Club. Half the clubs dropped out last year, entirely replaced with Long Island teams. Distance isn't too bad, but traffic makes it a bitch, took 3 hours to get home last year. I hate driving to LI. Got a 9:00 am game in Connecticut Sunday. Need to leave the house by 6:45. Not happy about that. I'd prefer to just play in the top flight of the league, more consistent competition and teams constantly move up or down flights each season to try and balance the league.

elflaco2 · Post by **elflaco2** » Fri May 05, 2023 2:57 pm

at first i was sad when the boy chose to stop playing club soccer...

now reading your travails (and still following his old clubs/team on social).. kind'a glad. and travel/town soccer? don't miss that mess at all.

ultimately is a $2-$6K investment per year ... and if they don't play college soccer....in hindsight in our own situation should've seen the end sooner and saved at least two years of club ball.. who knows.

of course the 18mo. old loves to kick the ball around though, so who knows when i'll get dragged back in.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Fri May 05, 2023 3:24 pm

elflaco2 wrote: ↑Fri May 05, 2023 2:57 pm at first i was sad when the boy chose to stop playing club soccer...

now reading your travails (and still following his old clubs/team on social).. kind'a glad. and travel/town soccer? don't miss that mess at all.

ultimately is a $2-$6K investment per year ... and if they don't play college soccer....in hindsight in our own situation should've seen the end sooner and saved at least two years of club ball.. who knows.

of course the 18mo. old loves to kick the ball around though, so who knows when i'll get dragged back in.

I know. In 4 years. But this time you'll be smart enough not to run the club.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Wed May 10, 2023 1:19 pm

Looks like our gamble is going to backfire. I'm risk averse and would have just stayed with the current team, but my wife didn't think it was worth the time and travel. PDA still hasn't given out offers, but the outgoing coach was kind enough to let me know where my daughter stands. Said she belong on their ECNL (A team) where she was practicing but isn't significantly better than anyone on the team to warrant kicking a current player off the team. I agree with the assessment, she was in the middle of the pack, but the ones who weren't as good weren't far off the pack. He let me know the incoming coach is offering her a spot on the ECRL (B team). All the commitment, money and travel of the A team, but playing in a secondary league. This team is a significant drop in level from her current team and we never would have left to move to this team. We left primarily due to the travel to league games and distance to the practice field, and this team will have much more travel and play at a lower level than where she is now. We were willing to deal with more travel for the highest level leagues (ECNL or GA).

We keep changing our minds on what to do. I was initially dead set against the ECRL team, but I know the training will still be top notch, and the coach will be the same as the A team coach, so if she can form a relationship and show she belongs on the A team, she'll have exposure. I don't want her to get her hopes up that she will get promoted, but it does happen. Yesterday I took a mood swing and was thinking we take the safety club offer, but the coach hasn't responded to my email from Monday, and when I logged into their website yesterday, I no longer have the option to accept their offer. His last email to me was saying to wait until after the PDA tryouts and hopefully they are quick with an answer. Not sure if he lost patience and gave my daughter's spot away without telling me. My wife keeps fluctuating, but she lands on quitting club soccer and playing school sports only. She is focused on what will help get into college, as we are seeing with my son how selective colleges have become.

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Wed May 10, 2023 4:31 pm

I just don't know that it matters all THAT much. It's highly unlikely she's going to play D1 soccer, right? But if she can put together a good highlights package - either high school or club - and you guys are strategica about attending ID camps and reaching out to targeted D3 coaches... That's the level they are looking at.

I mean, some of the women's programs in NESCAC, UAA and some of the Centennial conference teams (Swarthmore, Haverford, Hop) are EXTREMELY competitive. But they are still not trying to pick up D1 recruitment scraps -- they are looking at extremely bright kids that know they aren't going pro and just want to continue their soccer career for 4 more years.

I'm just saying, as a dad that thought my girl might make some waves with D3 softball... which didn't pan out... And as a guy that coached a combined A-B soccer team that saw over 40 girls playing at a pretty high level for 3 years at high school age...

I can count on one hand the number that wound up playing in college. And a good chunk of those girls won a state championship. That same year, the boys also won states... 3 of those guys went on to play college ball (one went to Amherst, a beast in the NESCAC.)

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Wed May 10, 2023 5:49 pm

That sounds encouraging to me. My kid (and almost everyone else) has found it very challenging to just show up and impress immediately in a highly competitive tryout. Just lots of different factors there and if she's even close to sticking with big name club 1s I would find a way to keep her going. No way school will get her better. College or not thats a big goal to make an ecnl team at u17. Now maybe coach is just being nice and I have a hard time with objectivity with my kid but if she loves it and you can swing it why not.

Kid went to id sessions this week. The club did pickup NAL and drop e64. So three full regional travel teams before my kids team now. The team is about to be blown up. Half would probably rather practice in the burbs (outbound with traffic yuk) and travel (Raleigh double yuk) to stay with thirds and there were so many kids at the id. They have mls so tons of other club jerseys in attendance. Mls kids were uniformly enormous and kid was blown away that they had reserves. His friends on team confirmed that great kids don't even play. Kid mentioned must have been tough on psyche. Uhhh yeah. But he got to play with some of the best in Georgia. Kids team likely to be in relegation fight from the jump now. Good part is some school buddies who got dropped 2 years ago coming to tryouts. Bad part is coaches want to add to top of rosters not bottom. Coach no dummy though on the crutin trail. Told kids already he has 4 coming from another team in league. Somehow they all deal with this like it's normal. Kids definitely adapt better than the adults. Listen to your kid

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Wed May 10, 2023 7:52 pm

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Wed May 10, 2023 5:49 pm That sounds encouraging to me. My kid (and almost everyone else) has found it very challenging to just show up and impress immediately in a highly competitive tryout. Just lots of different factors there and if she's even close to sticking with big name club 1s I would find a way to keep her going. No way school will get her better. College or not thats a big goal to make an ecnl team at u17. Now maybe coach is just being nice and I have a hard time with objectivity with my kid but if she loves it and you can swing it why not.

Kid went to id sessions this week. The club did pickup NAL and drop e64. So three full regional travel teams before my kids team now. The team is about to be blown up. Half would probably rather practice in the burbs (outbound with traffic yuk) and travel (Raleigh double yuk) to stay with thirds and there were so many kids at the id. They have mls so tons of other club jerseys in attendance. Mls kids were uniformly enormous and kid was blown away that they had reserves. His friends on team confirmed that great kids don't even play. Kid mentioned must have been tough on psyche. Uhhh yeah. But he got to play with some of the best in Georgia. Kids team likely to be in relegation fight from the jump now. Good part is some school buddies who got dropped 2 years ago coming to tryouts. Bad part is coaches want to add to top of rosters not bottom. Coach no dummy though on the crutin trail. Told kids already he has 4 coming from another team in league. Somehow they all deal with this like it's normal. Kids definitely adapt better than the adults. Listen to your kid

Playing where she is now isn't going to get her prepared to play D1, but if she can make the PDA ECNL team, almost every kid on those teams go on to play D1. Rutgers is always a top 10 program in Women's soccer, and their roster is 75% PDA players. Head coach used to coach at PDA, and most of his assistant coaches are at PDA, so it's a direct pipeline. She will never be good enough to play at Rutgers, but if she trains with kids who can, I do think she could have a shot at a lesser program. I don't care if she plays in college, in a lot of ways I prefer she didn't so she could have a more fun and well rounded college experience. She thinks she wants to play in college and if she can, I want to do what I can to give her a chance. There was a girl from our high school my daughter looks up to who is a freshman at Rutgers and plays on the soccer team. She started at PDA as a freshman and my daughter used her as motivation to make the team. Seton Hall just hired a PDA coach and his assistants are PDA guys, so the talk is that will become another direct pipeline.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Wed May 10, 2023 9:13 pm

Books r good too. Not sure how my kid would pass classes if we had to fight traffic most days.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Mon May 22, 2023 5:06 pm

Season officially over. Big weekend but questionable future. New league put a wrench in everything so word is everyone tries out but teams will move up a level and coaches directors from main site. That means npl and NC, sc, tn, al trips. Local league still best thing going but not sure what the options are til tryouts. Location main fields under contract apparently. Condos I'm sure. Also kills the girl's vaulting program. State medals and school records! At least as far as the neighborhood goes. One more year they say. Coach and head of program gone to promotion at local club. Feels like a pivot to HS

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Jun 02, 2023 4:13 pm

Backed down and let the kid play with the clubs better team but now a couple more hotel weekends. Adults would never be able to deal. All clubs hold tryouts the same 3 days so you have to choose where to go then subject yourself to a public pronouncement of ability as coaches move kids up and down the hierarchy of fields. Wouldnt speak to me on ride cause he didn't get picked off new league field at end of night two. Still new coach so new eyes and he dropped a couple kids who could really play and another who saw it coming. New league team took both centerbacks and the striker. Kid says theres only one kid that will help coming on. School buddies fromild versions of his team didn't make his team but seem to be back with the club. I just couldn't. They all talk openly about other tryouts and show allegiance to the kids as people/friends and recognize the truths in skill and game. Glad that's done. If the first week of summer says anything it's the YMCA and workouts with fb Americano buddies and ball. He's gotten good. Or James harden has taught the youths a step back 3.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Sun Jun 04, 2023 2:01 pm

This is not my kids club but is the club my kids coach left for so I signed him up for tryouts but didn't go. On one hand that's great and more info than I get on a fucking job on the other hand it scares the shit out of me. Kids sports man.

Hi everyone,

This past week we hosted over 1,100 players who came to try out for next year's 2015-2016 Academy and 2009-2006/05 11v11 teams. We do appreciate, and want to say thanks, to all of the athletes for coming out and we hope they enjoyed the opportunity to show their ability!

Xxxs tryouts consist of simply watching players playing the game. Coaches are not there to coach, rather evaluate and recommend movement between the playing fields to create the most balanced levels across the age group. After the on-field tryouts, the coaches gather together to discuss each player and work to finalize rosters. This can take several days and many meetings.

For players who participated in xxx's program this past year, every player was rated and ranked throughout the year in an internal depth chart, as well as all coaches in each age group participated in several virtual and in-person meetings over the last few weeks of the spring season, in order to make sure we felt comfortable heading into tryouts with where each player currently sat within their class.

For players who did not participate in xxx's program this past year, in addition to the tryouts period, in early May we hosted 'Bring a Friend to Training' where current xxx players brought non-xxx player(s) to their training session, and we evaluated players then as well. For new players, this period is the only way for us to get a sense of their ability.

For new-to-xxx players who were not able to attend tryouts, as you can imagine it's extremely difficult to offer roster spots without being able to watch them play.

Every year we are asked questions about how much weight the tryouts period holds when determining team offers. The reality is that for players who played at xxx last season, they are/were being evaluated every time they stepped onto the field for the last 12 months. Tryouts for these players are still important because there are always new players to compare them with. For new players, oftentimes it's a judgment call. We do our best to get each placement right, fully knowing that these decisions can be extremely impactful.

Because of the sheer number of kids that attend tryouts, it's hard to guesstimate in advance which players will make certain teams. There are always returning players on 'the bubble' between teams or players who may decide to leave the club. In addition to this, players who were not likely bubble players do become bubble players based on players that impress the evaluators. All this said, it's difficult to be able to have a discussion with all players/parents about players shifting between teams before the offers are sent. However we do our best to have these conversations and firmly believe that the decisions we make are in the best interest of each player's development.

We are available and certainly willing to discuss your players' offer, though please understand that the offer your player receives is final and non-negotiable. Your offer is good for 72 hours, and you'll need to accept or decline via xxx.

Please also understand that many players will not be offered a roster spot tonight, rather will be placed on a waiting list. While we want to offer the opportunity for every kid to play for xxx, this is simply not possible. We are happy to discuss alternate options with/for these players as well.

We appreciate your support and your interest in being a part of one of Georgia's top soccer programs, and we look forward to seeing you all on the fields again soon.

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Sun Jun 04, 2023 8:16 pm

That’s a lot of words to state the obvious.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 12:59 pm

Because I was gunking up the wwc thread... kids team is no longer. About half new kids and a new coach. Soccer dad lesson #58... if kid wants a new team find a tryout for a team thats getting a new coach. 8 new and three went up and two went down. The kids that went down were some of my favorites to watch. One was the most technical player on the whole team. Feisty and willing just tiny. Zero fucks given. Cant play for this coach apparently. The other kid one of the top technically and one of the most aware. Knows how to play. Did give up on practice a bit near the end last year (even kids can see writing on the wall) and maybe thats why but mostly, again tiny. Just plain dumb to me but his team. They just released rosters last week after May 1 tryouts so feeling like post-tryout movement and lip service to appease folks cause they say this team and the team below (kids old team before NAL came about) will practice same days times locations. I hope they double roster kids but dont think that will happen. The club v club picked up some kids from another team that got demoted last year and lost basically the entire team to NAL backfill so likely candidates for demotion now. Kids situation not far off but no relegation in his league and theyll probably find a few points traveling to less populous states. The kids that got dropped from NAL team quit club altogether and the ones from MLS were all from out of state so no help from above. Feels like a fall-long training camp for January school tryouts. Kid has gotten a better though. Lot stronger and taller now. You can see the too-old kids clearly now cause everyone else is catching up or surpassing them in size. He played a 3v3 last weekend with lots of MLS kids and HS seniors on last hurrah before college and no problem. Got it handed to them but earned respect. I dont think they see nearly as many black players in Alabama and then to make them look foolish at times... started with laughs by their teammates getting embarrassed by 08s to handshakes and advice during the later games was cool to see. Speed and strength still an issue with the HS crowd but there were two teams of MLS next 08s in the divison below and they werent really better than him at all. Definitely not better than best player on kids team. Need to rewire his brain to trust his strength and speed after years of knowing they wouldnt work but likely a long process. Not sure hes ever going to get the work rate where it needs to be but this coach wants to counter so ive seen he does preach conditioning. Probably half the issue there. Made it through five 3v3 games in the heat so think the lungs are ripped open and heat acclimatization has started. School starts next week and tournaments by mid-August. Weeeeeeeeeeeee...

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 2:56 pm

I'm getting stressed reading all that. Good luck Citgo. What year and grade are your boy?

Nonlinear FC · Post by **Nonlinear FC** » Tue Jul 25, 2023 4:01 pm

I'm worried someone stole Citgo's "enter" key.

C'mon, man! I like reading that stuff, but my eyes are bleeding.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Fri Jul 28, 2023 8:21 am

So I have a lady who works for me. Her son has spent the week getting scouted and trained by Man City. Apparently he has had some outreach from DC United too. He is U8 (trains with the U10s).

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Wed Aug 16, 2023 6:33 pm

Question locally about mls teams wanting to keep younger teams. Atlanta United dropped its u12s and one of the mid years (u16?). The club has massively raised every level in the city. Top top youth level but also trickle down with community outreach and club level training opportunities. Anyway theyre cutting back seemingly and wonder if other mls will cause can't believe u8 free soccer is profitable.

Kid was AR all last weekend. Good times except dad having to drive but freed from watching I enjoyed the free time.

New league has 16 games fall and January postseason plus high school spring so skipping preseason tournaments a blessing probably.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Mon Aug 21, 2023 1:58 pm

https://www.theonion.com/mls-parents-co ... 1850749255

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Aug 25, 2023 1:44 pm

98 expected for the game tomorrow. Really really really hope I get an email pushing up to 7am. Rarely use the gifted yeti cause its too damned heavy but it will get hauled to the field with ice and rags to try and keep the kids out the ER

Giff · Post by **Giff** » Fri Aug 25, 2023 1:47 pm

I feel like if I had a Yeti I'd always use that adjective as well.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Sat Aug 26, 2023 4:41 pm

The kid did not perish and all dealt fine but the club did not call it off or move it off 12:30. Natl weather service says 99 when they walked off the field. In fairness the humidity dropped from 80% this am to 50% at game time and the wind picked up as the day went on and grass thankfully but thinking this coach might not be putting the kids well being first. What's the point of heat guidelines if you ignore them? And his style of play sucks. Just aint gonna work against better teams. Only a scrimmage but some of these tournaments stopped play from 1-5. Not this guy. Gotta buy a wet bulb to be a soccer parent these days.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Fri Sep 08, 2023 7:03 pm

Game on league kickoff got to think a lot of places. No reentry in each half so minutes. 18 man roster limit but more than 18 so...

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 3:53 pm

Refs wouldn't let kid play today cause he couldn't find his player card. Get over yourselves and just let the kid play this ain't champions League

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 3:59 pm

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Sat Sep 16, 2023 3:53 pm Refs wouldn't let kid play today cause he couldn't find his player card. Get over yourselves and just let the kid play this ain't champions League

Put that on the league rules, not the ref. My son (17) was officiating games last weekend and took a ton of crap from the assignor because they only had 2 refs. So they spoke to the coaches and the coaches said run a 2 man system, don't ask parents to act as a linesman. The league rules say they need to do a 3 man and it put my son at risk for having the game not "official" (and not paid). Oh and f that assignor...she is one responsible for getting 3 people on the game, not my son.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Sat Sep 16, 2023 4:41 pm

Yeah. Guy was kind and explained the same. Rules. And that the team mom better get a binder of cards instead of giving them to the kids. Still early morning, rain for warmups and dad on the sidelines in the mist for nothing

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:27 pm

Ref shortages an issue around here. Kids league has had three so far but lots of teams have two out there cause they have to and the middle and high schools usually have two. Can't imagine blaming the refs for that. I've seen refs pull a mom or dad but then instruct them to only call out of bounds. Not sure that helps with viewing/position angles

The Sybian · Post by **The Sybian** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 9:33 am

HaulCitgo wrote: ↑Sun Sep 17, 2023 12:27 pm Ref shortages an issue around here. Kids league has had three so far but lots of teams have two out there cause they have to and the middle and high schools usually have two. Can't imagine blaming the refs for that. I've seen refs pull a mom or dad but then instruct them to only call out of bounds. Not sure that helps with viewing/position angles

Travel and club don't seem to be a problem, but middle school games were a huge problem, and a major part of why we didn't let my daughter play middle school last year. All school soccer is 2 ref system, and they often only get one for middle school games, and don't use volunteer linesmen. It's horrendous. And only the worst refs get middle school games. Lots of unseen cheap shots, and lots of athletic kids with little or no soccer experience who get frustrated and lash out, or just poorly time challenges from lack of experience. We had a pair of guys a couple of games who were over 80 years old. One guy wears a visor with a green plastic translucent brim like an olde tyme poker dealer or a dorky kid in the early 1980s. They could barely walk, and definitely couldn't see. The ball was 5 feet out of bounds right next to one of them, kid on the other team picked it up to take a throw and got whistled for a handball. Players started laughing, girl on my daughter's team told the ref and he gave it as a throw. Another time ball was several feet out, and the lines were clearly marked, and kept dribbling. Everyone was laughing, including the girl dribbling, but the game was a blowout and nobody cared, so they kept playing.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 10:42 am

Ref shortage everywhere. And soccer refs have low game fees compared to other sports from what I can tell. Still better than flipping burgers and uber/lyft per hour. But payouts only happen 4 times a year.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 10:42 am

Ref shortage everywhere. And soccer refs have low game fees compared to other sports from what I can tell. Still better than flipping burgers and uber/lyft per hour. But payouts only happen 4 times a year.

HaulCitgo · Post by **HaulCitgo** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:07 pm

What's this 4x year stuff. Kid uses game officials website and gets a direct deposit the week after weekend but has only done tournaments so far. One paid cash on site.

wlu_lax6 · Post by **wlu_lax6** » Mon Sep 18, 2023 12:11 pm

Tourneys paid quickly but the regular seasons...end of season payout up here.