The Swamp

Pruitt wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:25 pm

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:23 pm

rass wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:11 pm That I don’t know. And don’t know that it matters.

I do think that what we know about an artist can affect our enjoyment of their work. But no one hears Tears In Heaven and thinks it’s an anti-unlocked windows song, much less racist.

The takeaway here is that Van Morrison has now recruited Eric Clapton into a presumed anti-lockdown song, not whether the artists have done anything relevant to any of us in the past 40 years.

A lot of "hip" 70 year olds are tearing their few remaining hairs out over this.

There's a xenophobic bent to a lot of older British musicians. Elvis Costello, Roger Waters, Clapton.

P.D.X. wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 5:07 pm

sancarlos wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 4:58 pm

And there's on smoking a joint
And another with spots
If I had my way... I'd have all of you shot!

Lol.

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:47 pm

Pruitt wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:25 pm

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:23 pm

rass wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:11 pm That I don’t know. And don’t know that it matters.

I do think that what we know about an artist can affect our enjoyment of their work. But no one hears Tears In Heaven and thinks it’s an anti-unlocked windows song, much less racist.

The takeaway here is that Van Morrison has now recruited Eric Clapton into a presumed anti-lockdown song, not whether the artists have done anything relevant to any of us in the past 40 years.

A lot of "hip" 70 year olds are tearing their few remaining hairs out over this.

There's a xenophobic bent to a lot of older British musicians. Elvis Costello, Roger Waters, Clapton.

Morrissey is one of the worst.

I’m a huge Clapton much fan I had never heard that. It sucks for sure. But I still like the way he plays guitar.

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:23 pm

rass wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:11 pm That I don’t know. And don’t know that it matters.

I do think that what we know about an artist can affect our enjoyment of their work. But no one hears Tears In Heaven and thinks it’s an anti-unlocked windows song, much less racist.

The takeaway here is that Van Morrison has now recruited Eric Clapton into a presumed anti-lockdown song, not whether the artists have done anything relevant to any of us in the past 40 years.

Dammit. My only takeaway was that the only part of those articles that mentioned that actually content of the song was the headline. We can presume/assume all we want but that was click-bait pure and simple and the # of people here and on Twitter presuming to pissed about a headline made up to piss them off was remarkable.

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 9:06 am

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:23 pm

rass wrote: ↑Fri Nov 27, 2020 7:11 pm That I don’t know. And don’t know that it matters.

I do think that what we know about an artist can affect our enjoyment of their work. But no one hears Tears In Heaven and thinks it’s an anti-unlocked windows song, much less racist.

The takeaway here is that Van Morrison has now recruited Eric Clapton into a presumed anti-lockdown song, not whether the artists have done anything relevant to any of us in the past 40 years.

Dammit. My only takeaway was that the only part of those articles that mentioned that actually content of the song was the headline. We can presume/assume all we want but that was click-bait pure and simple and the # of people here and on Twitter presuming to pissed about a headline made up to piss them off was remarkable.

And again, you’re reading too much into this. Or the wrong things. Morrison’s previous work (three anti-lockdown songs titled “Born to be Free”, “As I Walked Out”, and “No More Lockdown”) tells us what we can expect. It’s not clickbait. They amount to being press releases for Morrison’s Lockdown Financial Hardship Fund.

Basically he’s viewing his own septuagenarian ass to be more important than the frontline healthcare workers, or even the guys slinging beers at his concerts. If Morrison were truly interested in raising $ for professional musicians and not being just an ignorant shit-heel, he’d be coordinating efforts with his peers and then streaming concerts in empty venues.

For example, Trey Anastasio held a show at the Beacon Theatre in NYC that was streamed on Twitch last night. It was the 8th and final show during an 8 week run, and Trey mentioned at the end of the evening they’d raised over $350k last night for initiatives such as The Waterwheel Foundation’s Food Empowerment Project and The Divided Sky Fund, which raises money for quality of care and treatment for those suffering with addiction. No official announcement as of yet for final totals, but I suspect we’ll see something soon.

So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:22 pm So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

Yes I suppose that is the case. Apologies.

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:02 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:22 pm So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

Yes I suppose that is the case. Apologies.

Not to draw this out any more, but where do you go after a song called “No More Lockdowns”?

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:08 pm

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:02 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:22 pm So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

Yes I suppose that is the case. Apologies.

Not to draw this out any more, but where do you go after a song called “No More Lockdowns”?

Probably form a caravan and take off into the mystic and not be back for astral weeks.

New meaning to this one

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 4:31 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:08 pm

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:02 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:22 pm So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

Yes I suppose that is the case. Apologies.

Not to draw this out any more, but where do you go after a song called “No More Lockdowns”?

Probably form a caravan and take off into the mystic and not be back for astral weeks.

I'll join, but only if I get some time with the brown-eyed girl.

Giff wrote: ↑Mon Nov 30, 2020 10:25 am

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 4:31 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:08 pm

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 3:02 pm

rass wrote: ↑Sat Nov 28, 2020 12:22 pm So don’t you really mean I’m not reading enough into this?

Yes I suppose that is the case. Apologies.

Not to draw this out any more, but where do you go after a song called “No More Lockdowns”?

Probably form a caravan and take off into the mystic and not be back for astral weeks.

I'll join, but only if I get some time with the brown-eyed girl.

I originally read that as "but only if I get some with the girl's brown-eye."

That's what I was going for tbh.

TBH = "the butt hole"

Are you ready for the Cleveland Baseball Team?

Good for them. That's a pleasant surprise.

About time.

What about the Mumbai Indians?

degenerasian wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:19 pm What about the Mumbai Indians?

I know you’re joking but that kind of sounds like something Nate would post.

What?

(that was for degen's post)

Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

BSF21 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:25 pm Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

I think Cubs is fine.

BSF21 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:25 pm Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

I figure the Braves are the next target, then the Hawks’ logo.

I think this came up on here a couple years ago; someone designed a cool Hawk-shaped version. But the rights to it were bought by a junior or minor league team. The Hawks need to buy those rights and switch over.

A_B wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:33 pm

BSF21 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:25 pm Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

I think Cubs is fine.

You would

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:59 am

BSF21 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:25 pm Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

I figure the Braves are the next target, then the Hawks’ logo.

I think this came up on here a couple years ago; someone designed a cool Hawk-shaped version. But the rights to it were bought by a junior or minor league team. The Hawks need to buy those rights and switch over.

I've seen this one and I think it's a super awesome way to flip it and keep the heritage and colors. I hope they do at some point. I always feel a little iffy on wearing my Hawks apparel. I certainly don't mean anything by it but I'd hate to think I offend anyone by my team choice (outside of their recent performance).

BSF21 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 8:53 am

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 7:59 am

BSF21 wrote: ↑Sun Dec 13, 2020 11:25 pm Hoping this pushes Chicago to change the logo. It’s a beautiful rendering but it’s harder and harder to support knowing the general feelings towards it.

I figure the Braves are the next target, then the Hawks’ logo.

I think this came up on here a couple years ago; someone designed a cool Hawk-shaped version. But the rights to it were bought by a junior or minor league team. The Hawks need to buy those rights and switch over.

I've seen this one and I think it's a super awesome way to flip it and keep the heritage and colors. I hope they do at some point. I always feel a little iffy on wearing my Hawks apparel. I certainly don't mean anything by it but I'd hate to think I offend anyone by my team choice (outside of their recent performance).

Yeah, I've basically stopped wearing my Hawks-logo apparel. Right now I have two cases going against Utah tribes, with a call later today to pick up a third one, so wearing the logo pushes me into guilt overload.

Black-hawks are indigenous to C and S America. What’s up with the name, Chicagoland?

eta nvm. Named after an US army unit from WWI.

Owners were huge fans of Dominique Wilkins but didn't know how to properly honor him.

The Rory Sparrows?

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 9:32 am Black-hawks are indigenous to C and S America. What’s up with the name, Chicagoland?

eta nvm. Named after an US army unit from WWI.

Huh. I've always assumed it was named after the same guy the Black Hawk War in the 1830s was named after, the one where Abraham Lincoln was in the militia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hawk_War

Not to be confused with the Black Hawk War that took place in Utah in the 1860s, named after a different guy who the whites called Chief Black Hawk. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonga_Black_Hawk

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:32 am

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 9:32 am Black-hawks are indigenous to C and S America. What’s up with the name, Chicagoland?

eta nvm. Named after an US army unit from WWI.

Huh. I've always assumed it was named after the same guy the Black Hawk War in the 1830s was named after, the one where Abraham Lincoln was in the militia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hawk_War

Not to be confused with the Black Hawk War that took place in Utah in the 1860s, named after a different guy who the whites called Chief Black Hawk. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonga_Black_Hawk

The army unit is the story I've heard for many many years. Which is cool but still doesn't deal with the logo problem.

BSF21 wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:34 am

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 10:32 am

EnochRoot wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 9:32 am Black-hawks are indigenous to C and S America. What’s up with the name, Chicagoland?

eta nvm. Named after an US army unit from WWI.

Huh. I've always assumed it was named after the same guy the Black Hawk War in the 1830s was named after, the one where Abraham Lincoln was in the militia. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Hawk_War

Not to be confused with the Black Hawk War that took place in Utah in the 1860s, named after a different guy who the whites called Chief Black Hawk. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antonga_Black_Hawk

The army unit is the story I've heard for many many years. Which is cool but still doesn't deal with the logo problem.

Yeah, the logo is racist AF, but the name is freakin bad ass.

Apparently this is the official logo of the 86th Infantry Division

Of all the problematic nicknames and logos in sports, the Blackhawks seems the easiest to correct. I like that one posted above with the current colors but moving from face of the man to that of the hawk.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 2:15 pm Of all the problematic nicknames and logos in sports, the Blackhawks seems the easiest to correct. I like that one posted above with the current colors but moving from face of the man to that of the hawk.

That's what's so frustrating. I understand that changing the name of a franchise is a nightmare. And extremely costly. Think about the legal fees. How many Cleveland Indians logos and signage are in bars and restaurants and on stationary and promotional items and on and on and on. Changing it is a Herculean task.

Chicago has it easier. The name isn't offensive. Just changes the stupid logo. You barely have to refile for trademark protections. It's a dumb hill to die on.

And it's equally dumb because I genuinely think people think it's OK because there's no malice in it. I don't for a second believe someone drew the Hawks logo and went "heh. stupid fuckin indians we'll make them look super stupid and use it as our logo". It clearly came from a place of power. Indian warriors were powerful and to be feared and they wanted to convey that. But that doesn't make it OK today. It's more complicated than that on both ends of it.

Use the actual hawk. It's way fucking cooler anyway and you get to keep the awesome headdress colors that make the current hawks logo so visually beautiful. Without insulting an entire race of people.

I wonder if there will be a push to get rid of the word "Chief" in the military for some of our ranks.

I would think not since "Chief" is more a word to give leadership roles and responsibilities to with respect and admiration than appropriate Native culture. But we'll see.

I mean, obviously that would have huge implications for the private sector... The whole C-suite thing and all that.

“Just wait until you meet my brother”—Patsy Tebeau, probably

Johnnie wrote: ↑Mon Dec 14, 2020 8:15 pm I wonder if there will be a push to get rid of the word "Chief" in the military for some of our ranks.

I would think not since "Chief" is more a word to give leadership roles and responsibilities to with respect and admiration than appropriate Native culture. But we'll see.

Probably in the clear, as dictionary.com has the origin going back to the 13th century.