The Swamp

tennbengal wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:49 pm

Steve of phpBB wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 12:58 pm So, Rudy Gobert sure got a big contract ...

He did indeed. I guess they had to and what not, but, yeah, big contract.

I had figured that their signing Derrick Favors, plus rumors of discord between Gobert and Mitchell, meant that they were not going to sign Gobert.

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:54 pm

Giff wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:18 pmHe's still the best offensive player in the league, has improved his defense steadily (one of the best post defenders in the league), and hasn't shown a single sign of slowing down at all. Yeah, I wouldn't want to include picks along with a guy who cannot shoot for that! If I'm a Sixers fan, I'm salivating at him and Embiid on the same team. It makes them the instant favorites in the East.

Correct me if I'm very possibly wrong, but isn't the NBA the one sport where you can kinda argue a player needs playoff success as validation unless his teammates all really, really suck?

It's early, but I'm not following. Harden's had great playoff success, FYI.

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:29 am

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:54 pm

Giff wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:18 pmHe's still the best offensive player in the league, has improved his defense steadily (one of the best post defenders in the league), and hasn't shown a single sign of slowing down at all. Yeah, I wouldn't want to include picks along with a guy who cannot shoot for that! If I'm a Sixers fan, I'm salivating at him and Embiid on the same team. It makes them the instant favorites in the East.

Correct me if I'm very possibly wrong, but isn't the NBA the one sport where you can kinda argue a player needs playoff success as validation unless his teammates all really, really suck?

It's early, but I'm not following. Harden's had great playoff success, FYI.

Oh, giff. I don't think you're right on this one.

sancarlos wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:59 pm Nothing gets Giff to be less OK than somebody disrespecting Harden.

Kind of notable that the biggest diss comes from the other Houston guy.

And then nothing annoys sancarlos more than when I say something about it.

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:31 am

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:29 am

mister d wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:54 pm

Giff wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 2:18 pmHe's still the best offensive player in the league, has improved his defense steadily (one of the best post defenders in the league), and hasn't shown a single sign of slowing down at all. Yeah, I wouldn't want to include picks along with a guy who cannot shoot for that! If I'm a Sixers fan, I'm salivating at him and Embiid on the same team. It makes them the instant favorites in the East.

Correct me if I'm very possibly wrong, but isn't the NBA the one sport where you can kinda argue a player needs playoff success as validation unless his teammates all really, really suck?

It's early, but I'm not following. Harden's had great playoff success, FYI.

Oh, giff. I don't think you're right on this one.

If playoff success is only defined by championships, then you're right. But that's a really stupid way to define playoff success when his peak has been at the same time with some of the best teams of all-time. At least that's what the media tells us.

I'm not saying he's not a great player. Not even close to that. But yeah, in the NBA, to be an all time great, you better get a title or two. And if you happen to beat an all-time great while you're at it, even better.

Stockton
Malone
Webber
Mutombo
Lenny Wilkens (was in the NBA top 50 at 50)
Maravich
Barkley
Elgin Baylor

They're all all-time greats and have zero rings combined. RINGZ is a top-three stupidest athlete discussion ever.

ETA: Please start shitting on Giannis, as well. He's got 2 MVPs and no rings. Add Steve Nash to the list, too.

It's not how many ringz you have, but he had a few bad showings in deciding games, and I remember the discussions being about whether he was out of shape/injured or if his playing style doesn't work against great teams (especially trying to get free throws against guys who miraculously don't get called for fouls). So a fear would be, you give up too much and then your team still comes up short at the end.

Newsflash: 29 of 30 teams come up short at the end. Harden's certainly had more playoff success than anyone else playing a key role on the Sixers, sans Danny Green.

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:33 am Newsflash: 29 of 30 teams come up short at the end. Harden's certainly had more playoff success than anyone else playing a key role on the Sixers, sans Danny Green.

Did you not just disprove your own point?

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:33 am Newsflash: 29 of 30 teams come up short at the end. Harden's certainly had more playoff success than anyone else playing a key role on the Sixers, sans Danny Green.

Harden is 51-28 in the postseason the last four years, having made the postseason each those seasons.

Giannis: 20-18
Lebron: 39-20 (missed playoffs two seasons ago)
Curry/Durant: 46-14 (missed playoffs last season - Klay Thompson and Draymond the same)
Raptors: 31-24 (just added them as the other title-winner)
Chris Paul: 23-19

Ripping him for playoff performance is weak.

51 of 184 NBA coaches are .500 or above in the playoffs and 13 have won 60% of their playoff games. Harden is at 64.6%, which only six coaches have surpassed.

Harden had a 32- and 33-year-old Chris Paul, who missed 24 games each of those seasons, as his best teammate ever.

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:47 am

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:33 am Newsflash: 29 of 30 teams come up short at the end. Harden's certainly had more playoff success than anyone else playing a key role on the Sixers, sans Danny Green.

Did you not just disprove your own point?

No. My point is Harden has had playoff success. More than most since he's been with the Rockets. I don't limit my definition of playoff success to winning a championship.

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 11:04 am

A_B wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:47 am

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 10:33 am Newsflash: 29 of 30 teams come up short at the end. Harden's certainly had more playoff success than anyone else playing a key role on the Sixers, sans Danny Green.

Did you not just disprove your own point?

No. My point is Harden has had playoff success. More than most since he's been with the Rockets. I don't limit my definition of playoff success to winning a championship.

Yeah, but the "sans danny green" thing seems to weight championships. Because I don't think anyone here would even try to argue that Danny Green is a better player, in historical terms, than Harden.

I was just pointing out that the only person on the Sixers who has gone as far or further than Harden in the playoffs is Danny Green before someone said "what about Danny Green hahaha dummy?"

Also, I never said championships don't matter.

(As a long-time Alex-Rod defender and Henrik lover, I’d like to be clear I intentionally said playoff success versus titles.)

Yeah, that was all A"Ishouldbearocketsfan"B.

Giff wrote: ↑Tue Dec 22, 2020 9:32 am

sancarlos wrote: ↑Mon Dec 21, 2020 3:59 pm Nothing gets Giff to be less OK than somebody disrespecting Harden.

Kind of notable that the biggest diss comes from the other Houston guy.

And then nothing annoys sancarlos more than when I say something about it.

I'm not annoyed at all. It's just a bit surprising to see your strong reactions sometimes.