Why Do Local Cops Need Camoflauge?

[brian]

The Onion just kills it, as usual.

[howard]

These cops are acting like jack-booted thugs, and it will be interesting to revisit this thread 6 months from now to see what the consequences have been.

I can help you out there.

None. There will be none.

You can book that. 100% correct. There is a many-decades long losing streak not about to be broken.

The Onion also added this bit of nuance.

[rass]

Anyone read Radley Balko's book on the militarization of domestic law enforcement?

He seems to have been talking about this as long/much as anyone, and I've sort of followed him as he moved from outlet to outlet (now at the Wapo), but never picked up the book.

[Johnnie]

And the police chief is taking selfies with protestors too!

Alrighty! All better! We can go back to forgetting about our paramilitary police force now.

So when's the next batch of outrage going to happen?

EDIT

Veterans on Ferguson...a quick hit of veterans posting on Twitter their experience with ROE and deployed locations.

My initial "WTF?" reaction to this was "I was in Iraq and I wasn't this militarized." These guys were doing jobs much more dangerous than mine and even they are in shock.

[A_B]

Rembert Browne from Grantland.

[Rex]

Rand Paul from....Earth, what do you know

http://time.com/3111474/rand-paul-ferguson-police/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Rex]

The demographic angle that perhaps only I find interesting:

http://beltmag.com/ferguson-race-inner-ring-suburb/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[howard]

I am a fan of his dad (although Ron was far from perfect in his econ views and as a potential president.) I'll go on record now--folks looking to Rand as a candidate/leader/possible president because of his libertarian and freedom loving ideas and rhetoric may end up disappointed like Obama supporters from the left. Rand ain't his daddy, intellectually or politically.

[howard]

The demographic angle that perhaps only I find interesting:

http://beltmag.com/ferguson-race-inner-ring-suburb/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

When I was 10yo, two years after the Watts riot, we were ready to bug out from south central. Mom and dad had gone to school in order to acquire better jobs, they had saved every penny in order to make a down payment in a new community. Dad studied computer science in night school, mom took some accounting classes at JC while we were in school during the day to add bookkeeping to her set of secretarial skillz. So armed, dad started interviewing for the higher paying jobs, while mom considered neighborhoods in the San Fernando Valley inner band of suburbs that only recently began allowing black people to obtain mortgages.

(This is about suburbs and demographics.)

(There were important court rulings, followed by legislation, that suddenly legally eliminated and practically drastically reduced bank-mediated housing segregation throughout California. Around 1964 or so, a mortgage application could not be denied in certain zip codes because of race. With a jolt, working class, middle class and professional class black people could exit South Central LA and similar areas of SF, San Jose, Sacto and San Diego, for previously all-white neighborhoods and suburbs. This effect was dramatic in the years to come particularly in the San Fernando Valley, a band of suburban neighborhoods immediately north of Los Angeles, spanning a range of income levels.)

Instead of a local job, dad was hired in Sacramento. So he started scouting out neighborhoods up there. 'Inner city' traditional black neighborhood (nothing as large and tightly demarcated as in big cities) with the nicer bands for middle-class blacks; the expanding edges of Sacto open to all ethnicities; the small towns just outside of Sac that became its suburbs--Rancho Cordova, Elk Grove, Citrus Heights. And, (of course to you frequent readers,) a self-contained small town geographically and in other important ways isolated from the maturing urban area of Sac town 15 miles west, Davis. Which he chose.

My dad was a highway engineer. Before his computer training, he was out in the field constructing the highways that were the essential circulatory system for the Los Angeles suburban sprawl. After he learned to program, he became more involved in designing and planning for this expanding system throughout California that was the sine qua non of suburban and exurban growth. His career led me to be interested in these phenomenon, and gave my stoked interest some practical insight.

As soon as we were old enough to start playing sports against other schools and communities, in Sacramento to the East and the other small towns (Woodland, Vacaville, Fairfield) in other directions, I began to learn about the differences between Davis and the other places I might have instead called home. And finally, I come to the point.

The communities within and around the Sac urban center were different. One difference, over the years and decades, they were more dynamic. They changed more rapidly and drastically then did my little town (and the other little towns to the West.)

The suburbs of Sacramento were buffeted by economic and social forces in a manner very different than my town. Ethnic demographics was a visible marker of the rapid and drastic changes, as well as one of those very forces enacting the changes. Part of my awareness of these forces and their effects was because of their relative absence in Davis, and in these other smaller towns.

In college, I took a couple of courses that explored these issues of suburban change over the decades. And while in school in Santa Barbara, frequent trips to Los Angeles as well as friendships with fellow students from throughout the LA area helped me see with my own eyes the changes since I was a youngster of the largest (based on square mileage) collection of suburbs in this country.

Fascinating, complex subject. I guess I've spewed all these needless words above to state two conclusions. First, suburban neighborhoods and districts are far more sensitive to economic and social forces, including simple ethnic demographic, than other types of communities. Different than inner cities; different than self-contained small towns. Change displayed by suburbs in response to those forces comes fast and hard, in comparison. One might argue, the sensitivity to such change can rival if not outpace that suffered by a small town with one big employer when the proverbial mill shuts down. Certainly there is a great sensitivity to much more subtle forces than that mill shutdown.

Second, in light of the complexity and sensitivity, beware of simplistic analyses. Particularly those relying on ethnic demographics, as ethnic composition is all at once a force of causation, a marker of effect, and both at the same time (or, I suppose, neither.)

This is not a criticism of the linked article, which I quite like. But these are thoughts that occur to me as I read that, mostly in reference to other crap I've encountered, recently and over the years, on the same subject.

[Shirley]

I have this dream that Obama would see this situation and realize that it has given him an opportunity to do something that could actually give him a shot as being seen as a great president. As a black man, this is a chance to actually help the black communities in this country and make an actual, measurable, positive change.

He should come out and say that he is officially ending the War on Drugs. We lost this war. We lost it long ago. All it has done is help perpetuate and feed the awful cycle of violence, poverty and incarceration in our poor, urban (and largely black) communities.

He could decriminalize marijuana at a federal level and push for the same at state levels - using states like Colorado as an example that it works.

He should also push to repeal mandatory minimum sentence laws and massively defund the DEA and other drug enforcement groups. Hopefully this would help demilitarize our police, as they would get less funding for fighting drug gangs and there should be less NEED to fight drug gangs, as legalization/decriminalization will eliminate a lot of the violence.

This would obviously also help Mexico with it's massive struggles against their drug cartels.

Additionally, if we didn't put such a massive percentage of our poor in jail, maybe some of them would actually fill a lot of the jobs that we currently need to fill with immigrants.

It just seems like this change could have positive affects in so many areas.

A man can dream.

[Brontoburglar]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

[brian]

I have this dream that Obama would see this situation and realize that it has given him an opportunity to do something that could actually give him a shot as being seen as a great president. As a black man, this is a chance to actually help the black communities in this country and make an actual, measurable, positive change.

He should come out and say that he is officially ending the War on Drugs. We lost this war. We lost it long ago. All it has done is help perpetuate and feed the awful cycle of violence, poverty and incarceration in our poor, urban (and largely black) communities.

He could decriminalize marijuana at a federal level and push for the same at state levels - using states like Colorado as an example that it works.

He should also push to repeal mandatory minimum sentence laws and massively defund the DEA and other drug enforcement groups. Hopefully this would help demilitarize our police, as they would get less funding for fighting drug gangs and there should be less NEED to fight drug gangs, as legalization/decriminalization will eliminate a lot of the violence.

This would obviously also help Mexico with it's massive struggles against their drug cartels.

Additionally, if we didn't put such a massive percentage of our poor in jail, maybe some of them would actually fill a lot of the jobs that we currently need to fill with immigrants.

It just seems like this change could have positive affects in so many areas.

A man can dream.

The prison industrial complex funds Democrats every bit as lavishly as it does Republicans. Yay, two party system.

[brian]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

[Rush2112]

After he learned to program, he became more involved in designing and planning for this expanding system throughout California that was the sine qua non of suburban and exurban growth.

So either your dad is responsible for that shit show or your dad is Tom Vanderbilt?

[Shirley]

The prison industrial complex funds Democrats every bit as lavishly as it does Republicans. Yay, two party system.

Yeah, I didn't even list that nightmare as another reason to end the War on Drugs. I get why politicians on both sides are afraid of change there, but Obama's in his last term and I have to think he wants to leave a legacy more significant than First Black President.

The documentary "The House I Live In" is a fascinating and disturbing look at this whole thing. What's going on Ferguson looks to me like a very direct link from the issues the documentary covers.

[Brontoburglar]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Of course not. But it'll be fun to see how it changes.

[howard]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

What developments? If you mean things that haven't happened yet, what do you anticipate?

(Just asking--I don't know what you mean, bronts.)

(ETA context. this convo is picking up steam)

[rass]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

What developments? If you mean things that haven't happened yet, what do you anticipate?

(Just asking--I don't know what you mean, bronts.)

(ETA context. this convo is picking up steam)

This, right?

[howard]

After he learned to program, he became more involved in designing and planning for this expanding system throughout California that was the sine qua non of suburban and exurban growth.

So either your dad is responsible for that shit show or your dad is Tom Vanderbilt?

He wasn't Tom Vanderbilt, nor was he Robert Moses. But he absolutely had some responsibility. Kinda like contractors on the Death Star, I suppose.

" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

ETA: this is how sick I am. I first learned of Vanderbilt not from his book Traffic, or his other writings, but in the context of his Jeopardy! appearance.

[howard]

This, right?

Ah, nice to see the Ukrainian government press office is keeping busy during the lull in the civil war over there.

Hilarious if not so fucking sad and stupid:

The unidentified police officer who wrote the incident report on the robbery said he identified Brown by comparing surveillance images of the incident to the body of the slain teen.

Ah, so he was a identified as a suspect after he was kilt. Then jumped into a time machine, armed with the evidence, and executed him.

Straight out of the playbook. Can't start too early establishing that 'reasonable doubt' in the mind of a jury. Sad this shit works so well, over and over, decade after decade. Because people let it work/want it to work.

Here is the kind of justice you can accurately anticipate in this instance. Once in a decade, a token unlucky cop will get a token serious punishment, maybe including jail time. Once out of dozens if not hundreds of incidents of clear guilt of deadly violence. All the rest of the killer cops get this, over and over:

http://www.sfgate.com/crime/article/Jud ... 690145.php" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Johnnie]

Rembert Browne from Grantland.

I had chills reading that entire thing. America pisses me off.

[Shirley]

FWIW, in my middle school bad boy phase, my friends and I shoplifted Swisher Sweets many times. Nobody ever shot at us.

[A_B]

FWIW, in my middle school bad boy phase, my friends and I shoplifted Swisher Sweets many times. Nobody ever shot at us.

They knew better than to mess with a sassy black woman.

[Joe K]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Seriously. If this story does change the narrative, then it only goes to show how racism colors our society's perception of events. I went to a lily white, suburban high school where plenty of guys committed petty offenses like theft. But if one of my classmates were shot dead while running from the police after shoplifting cigars from a convenience store, you can be damn sure that cop would be criminally charged by the end of the day. I don't see how it should be any different here, even if Brown did "tower over" and "appear to intimidate" a store clerk.

ETA: Shirley beat me to it. Point is, teenagers do stupid shit, but that doesn't mean they should be gunned down.

[tennbengal]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Spot on.

[Ryan]

FWIW, in my middle school bad boy phase, my friends and I shoplifted Swisher Sweets many times. Nobody ever shot at us.

But did they give you burritos?

[Giff]

And apparently they didn't even stop him because of him being a suspect in the robbery.

[Pruitt]

Jesus, what a disgrace.

[Gunpowder]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Seriously. If this story does change the narrative, then it only goes to show how racism colors our society's perception of events. I went to a lily white, suburban high school where plenty of guys committed petty offenses like theft. But if one of my classmates were shot dead while running from the police after shoplifting cigars from a convenience store, you can be damn sure that cop would be criminally charged by the end of the day. I don't see how it should be any different here, even if Brown did "tower over" and "appear to intimidate" a store clerk.

ETA: Shirley beat me to it. Point is, teenagers do stupid shit, but that doesn't mean they should be gunned down.

Has anybody who is questioning whether this will change the narrative with a group of people actually read the comments on that article? Or checked Twitter? Because it's changed the fuck out of the narrative for a very large group of people.

[Gunpowder]

I'm fascinated to see how today's developments change the narrative regarding this situation

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Spot on.

It's a loud number, at the least. And I'll guarantee it's bigger than you think from what I've seen in the past 20 minutes.

[Rex]

I tell you, any crisis management consultant who has not packed his bags and moved to Missouri by now....

[brian]

It's a loud number, at the least. And I'll guarantee it's bigger than you think from what I've seen in the past 20 minutes.

I would posit that anyone that is swayed to not caring if he was killed by the police because of the possibility that he shoplifted some cigars probably wasn't really on his side to begin with.

[sancarlos]

And apparently they didn't even stop him because of him being a suspect in the robbery.

Yeah, but most people will just see the headline and not even get to that fact. Ergo - cop off the hook in some courts of public opinion. Which was clearly the goal. Really, since the cop didn't even know he was a robbery suspect when he shot him, there was no justifiable reason to bring up the robbery, other than to tar the kid's reputation, after the fact. Sheesh.

[Joe K]

It's a loud number, at the least. And I'll guarantee it's bigger than you think from what I've seen in the past 20 minutes.

I would posit that anyone that is swayed to not caring if he was killed by the police because of the possibility that he shoplifted some cigars probably wasn't really on his side to begin with.

Yeah, my point wasn't that I didn't think this might impact perceptions. It was that anyone who thinks this remotely justifies the cop's actions has some strong racial biases.

[Pruitt]

And apparently they didn't even stop him because of him being a suspect in the robbery.

Yeah, but most people will just see the headline and not even get to that fact. Ergo - cop off the hook in some courts of public opinion. Which was clearly the goal. Really, since the cop didn't even know he was a robbery suspect when he shot him, there was no justifiable reason to bring up the robbery, other than to tar the kid's reputation, after the fact. Sheesh.

The local news here in Toronto used the term "robbed a convenience store" to describe what the kid did.

Think it was just a case of shitty writing, but "robbing: a convenience store implies armed menace. Which will undoubtedly sway minds of those who can;t be bothered to read more than headlines.

[Brontoburglar]

I'm sure some people think it's OK for the cops to execute people for stealing cigars, but undoubtedly that's not a large number.

Seriously. If this story does change the narrative, then it only goes to show how racism colors our society's perception of events. I went to a lily white, suburban high school where plenty of guys committed petty offenses like theft. But if one of my classmates were shot dead while running from the police after shoplifting cigars from a convenience store, you can be damn sure that cop would be criminally charged by the end of the day. I don't see how it should be any different here, even if Brown did "tower over" and "appear to intimidate" a store clerk.

ETA: Shirley beat me to it. Point is, teenagers do stupid shit, but that doesn't mean they should be gunned down.

Has anybody who is questioning whether this will change the narrative with a group of people actually read the comments on that article? Or checked Twitter? Because it's changed the fuck out of the narrative for a very large group of people.

This. I had a certain news network in mind and a certain group of people. And no, the swamp wasn't included in my thoughts. Also why I said "narrative" rather than "actually what happened."

And along these lines, this should go in the Facebook thread, but...

Can someone please tell me why this sinceless looting and destroying of business and rioting in stl is taking place? The media will always spin a story mostly to benefit liberal propaganda bc most media outlets are liberal. All I know is an 18 year old broke the law and was punished? Where were these riots and harm to innocent ppl being done last year when a cop in kc killed a fire fighter? Why is this being made into trayvin Martin pt 2. This ongoing idiocy in stl is doing a lot more harm than good.

The cop/firefighter incident can be viewed here if you'd like (you hear the gunshots, but it's at the end of the video and don't see anything):



While you can argue that the police officer used his gun way too early, a guy beating a police officer's face in is not even comparable to this.

[Brontoburglar]

And apparently they didn't even stop him because of him being a suspect in the robbery.

Yeah, but most people will just see the headline and not even get to that fact. Ergo - cop off the hook in some courts of public opinion. Which was clearly the goal. Really, since the cop didn't even know he was a robbery suspect when he shot him, there was no justifiable reason to bring up the robbery, other than to tar the kid's reputation, after the fact. Sheesh.

I would like to know why it took six days for them to release that information and then why, when they released it, they had to then follow up six hours later and emphasize that the officer did not know about the robbery. Of course, I can wonder why, sadly, and hope I'm not right.

[mister d]

Of course you're right.

[Giff]

We know more about a fucking swisher being stolen than the kid being killed.

[howard]

The Real Issue Behind the Ferguson, Missouri Police Response

Protest Is Treated As Terrorism In America Today

Blog post highlights Radley Balko, a Washington Post writer (*WARNING--right wing source!) who has covered this issue for years. He testified before Congress on the issue--seven years ago.

What we’re seeing in Ferguson, this is not a local issue, really. I mean, this is something that’s been driven by national policies, by policies that Congress has approved of and has oversight of, and could end tomorrow, if they wanted to.

***

The idea that when we take domestic police officers and we train them like soldiers and we give them military gear and we dress them up like soldiers and we tell them they’re fighting a war—you know, war on crime or war on terror—they’re going to start to see themselves as soldiers. And that’s just a mindset that’s not—that really isn’t appropriate for domestic policing. And I think you saw that in the way that they responded to protests—not just in Ferguson, but also, you know, a lot of the crackdowns on the Occupy protesters, on the crackdowns at the political conventions over the years. I mean, this has become our default response to protest in the U.S., and it’s something that, you know, I think could be very antagonistic toward the very idea of free speech and the First Amendment.