Return of Confessions

[A_B]

DC, it sounds like you have set D1 up very well for the life ahead of her. My wife and I try as hard as we can to let my kids roam and explore and expose them to more adult things. My older two are still relatively cautious about things, but I'd like to see them become as self-sufficient as possible before they set off out of our home. Thanks for sharing.

My third grader keeps debating the merits of living in a dorm or living at home in college. He wants to live at school, but he thinks he might miss us. I told him he will have a much different feeling about that 18.

The more and more I think about it, the more I think that a gap year after HS sounds like a good idea. Figure out how to be self sufficient in the world before going to college. I doubt my kids will be that independent though.

Especially good if going to school out of state.

[govmentchedda]

DC, it sounds like you have set D1 up very well for the life ahead of her. My wife and I try as hard as we can to let my kids roam and explore and expose them to more adult things. My older two are still relatively cautious about things, but I'd like to see them become as self-sufficient as possible before they set off out of our home. Thanks for sharing.

My third grader keeps debating the merits of living in a dorm or living at home in college. He wants to live at school, but he thinks he might miss us. I told him he will have a much different feeling about that 18.

The more and more I think about it, the more I think that a gap year after HS sounds like a good idea. Figure out how to be self sufficient in the world before going to college. I doubt my kids will be that independent though.

Especially good if going to school out of state.

In state tuition?

[mister d]

I know I would have been a stupid idiot about it, but that sounds smart to me now. The difference between how seriously I took college from junior year on and then the next step up to how serious I took grad school versus HS and the first two years of college is pretty insane.

[govmentchedda]

I know I would have been a stupid idiot about it, but that sounds smart to me now. The difference between how seriously I took college from junior year on and then the next step up to how serious I took grad school versus HS and the first two years of college is pretty insane.

I think they would learn two very important things in a gap year; how to survive in the world and a ton about themselves. I spent a very long time trying to figure out who I was, what I wanted to do, etc. It seems like a year of figuring out a few things on your own would be very helpful.

[mister d]

My only problem might have been settling into home and not wanting to go to college the next year. I was immature as fuck so being thrown into a new city and having to learn to handle myself probably helped long term. I guess that's the risk.



(Hahahahahahaha "handling myself" could refer to masturbation!!!)

[govmentchedda]

My only problem might have been settling into home and not wanting to go to college the next year. I was immature as fuck so being thrown into a new city and having to learn to handle myself probably helped long term. I guess that's the risk.



(Hahahahahahaha "handling myself" could refer to masturbation!!!)

Yeah, I get that, but college is always there. Why spend the money (take out the insane debt) if you're "finding yourself"? What better time to be broke as hell than 18 years old?


Hahahahaha, masturbation is funny

[BSF21]

I always say I learned a lot more by being "at" college than being "in" college. Full disclosure, I had my tuition taken care of, and the first semester of room and board (state school, this was cheap) so I could glide into the learning curve. After that, it was self sufficiency. If I kept my grades up and stayed off a police blotter, the tuition kept getting paid. I was on my own for finding a job, a place to live, and a way to support myself. I wouldn't change a thing about it.

[mister d]

Yeah, I get that, but college is always there. Why spend the money (take out the insane debt) if you're "finding yourself"? What better time to be broke as hell than 18 years old?

I was always going to be able to handle college grades-wise, so waiting a year probably would have been more risk than reward. I think that probably makes more sense for a student who would be at risk of failing out coming out of HS.

[govmentchedda]

Yeah, I get that, but college is always there. Why spend the money (take out the insane debt) if you're "finding yourself"? What better time to be broke as hell than 18 years old?

I was always going to be able to handle college grades-wise, so waiting a year probably would have been more risk than reward. I think that probably makes more sense for a student who would be at risk of failing out coming out of HS.

Me too, and my situation was similar to what BSF described above. I don't know what my risk would have been though, had I taken a year off.

[A_B]

Yeah, I get that, but college is always there. Why spend the money (take out the insane debt) if you're "finding yourself"? What better time to be broke as hell than 18 years old?

I was always going to be able to handle college grades-wise, so waiting a year probably would have been more risk than reward. I think that probably makes more sense for a student who would be at risk of failing out coming out of HS.

Me too, and my situation was similar to what BSF described above. I don't know what my risk would have been though, had I taken a year off.

I thought I was ready. Top 5 in class, took all the AP classes offered (which wasn't many) and got to college and got my ass kicked. Got As in the easys 101s but C or worse in all my other classes. It was a shock. Second semester wasn't much better. Being in engineering might have been a big part of the problem, though.

[Giff]

Yeah, I get that, but college is always there. Why spend the money (take out the insane debt) if you're "finding yourself"? What better time to be broke as hell than 18 years old?

I was always going to be able to handle college grades-wise, so waiting a year probably would have been more risk than reward. I think that probably makes more sense for a student who would be at risk of failing out coming out of HS.

Me too, and my situation was similar to what BSF described above. I don't know what my risk would have been though, had I taken a year off.

I thought I was ready. Top 5 in class, took all the AP classes offered (which wasn't many) and got to college and got my ass kicked. Got As in the easys 101s but C or worse in all my other classes. It was a shock. Second semester wasn't much better. Being in engineering might have been a big part of the problem, though.

My major required one math class, so first semester I signed up for advanced physics thinking I was just going to take on every challenge I could, minimum requirements be damned. I stopped listening about 8 minutes in and dropped the class as soon as the first one was over.

[The Sybian]

I've advised so many people against going into law school immediately after college. Biggest mistake of my life. Straight out of college, you end up seeing law school as an extension of college in a way, especially socially. Most people who take time in between have a sense of the real world, which puts a completely different focus on law school, plus the majority of people straight out of college are there because they didn't know what to do (this was me). People who came in with a goal or reason to be there had a hell of a lot more focus, and weren't nearly as miserable as the rest of us. Working and living in real world exposes you to a lot of legal concepts that I was learning for the first time. So many times in life, not in work, I come across things I learned in law school that seemed complicated without the life experience of dealing with these commonly known concepts. A lot of people respond saying if I took a year off, I may not have gone. They are right, which is another reason I recommend taking the time off. If you really want it, you will go, and if you don't really want it, you shouldn't go in the first place.

[govmentchedda]

I've advised so many people against going into law school immediately after college. Biggest mistake of my life. Straight out of college, you end up seeing law school as an extension of college in a way, especially socially. Most people who take time in between have a sense of the real world, which puts a completely different focus on law school, plus the majority of people straight out of college are there because they didn't know what to do (this was me). People who came in with a goal or reason to be there had a hell of a lot more focus, and weren't nearly as miserable as the rest of us. Working and living in real world exposes you to a lot of legal concepts that I was learning for the first time. So many times in life, not in work, I come across things I learned in law school that seemed complicated without the life experience of dealing with these commonly known concepts. A lot of people respond saying if I took a year off, I may not have gone. They are right, which is another reason I recommend taking the time off. If you really want it, you will go, and if you don't really want it, you shouldn't go in the first place.

As you might imagine, I agree with this 100%. I definitely should have taken a year off before law school.

[DC47]

'Taking a year off' before going to college isn't what it used to be. At least not when 'what it used to be' was back in the 70s.

Back then, it mostly meant some combination of menial labor, adventure, travel, and perhaps making some money for college. Waitressing and then flying to Europe with a pal and a Eurail pass. Working construction in the summer and fall, ski bumming around the Rockies in the winter, getting a job as a temp ranger in a national forest the next spring. Working at the hardware store while living at home and saving your cash. Hitch-hiking out west to sleep on your high-school pals' floor; the hitching being the more interesting part.

Now, it can mean that. Or it can mean a program in Italy studying art history, followed by a program on a boat in the Caribbean studying marine biology. So a 'gap year' can be quite structured and safe. It's an industry now -- you can go to 'gap year fairs' and talk to 30 companies that run programs. All will be Fun with a capital F, and some learning will no doubt occur. But not the same kind of personal challenge that many needed and got long ago, to accelerate their maturation before attending college. Though to be fair (and slightly less curmudgeonly), the simple passage of time in the presence of people you didn't already know will lead to considerable personal development in almost any eighteen year-old.

My oldest probably won't take a gap year, though she's considering it. She's attending college classes as a high school student, and loves that world too much to want to take a break; she wants a break from high school ASAP. Beyond that, her life has already had a lot of 'gap year-y' stuff in it, apart from the menial labor (she works in a molecular biology lab). In particular, travel to foreign lands and living away from home. This summer will have even more. She'll go on a month-long backpack trip in the mountains where I did the same at 19.

It's amusing to me that the trip I did for $500 costs 12-14X more for my daughter. The gear she'll buy costs more than our entire trip. Part of this is that she's going on a trip with a Outward Bound-type company. I did my trip with a guy who had done their trip the year before; we knocked-off their program in every detail from route to gear to food. Though we did add one important herb to their list. And perhaps the original itinerary did not include naked frisbee, diving and sliding through the clay-flats of the outflow when the sun hit the glacier in late afternoon. We financed some of the $500 cost of the trip on the return leg by stopping at a liquor store in Wyoming to load cases of Coors (which had little to no distribution east of the Rockies) into and on top of our van. Six-packs sold for 3X our cost on the informal market back east. Drove 24 hours a day and slept in the back, with one night in a park with a shower.

Can I just say: Nothing like that's happening here these days. More's the pity.

[govmentchedda]

'Taking a year off' before going to college isn't what it used to be. At least not when 'what it used to be' was back in the 70s.

Back then, it mostly meant some combination of menial labor, adventure, travel, and perhaps making some money for college. Waitressing and then flying to Europe with a pal and a Eurail pass. Working construction in the summer and fall, ski bumming around the Rockies in the winter, getting a job as a temp ranger in a national forest the next spring. Working at the hardware store while living at home and saving your cash. Hitch-hiking out west to sleep on your high-school pals' floor; the hitching being the more interesting part.

Now, it can mean that. Or it can mean a program in Italy studying art history, followed by a program on a boat in the Caribbean studying marine biology. So a 'gap year' can be quite structured and safe. It's an industry now -- you can go to 'gap year fairs' and talk to 30 companies that run programs. All will be Fun with a capital F, and some learning will no doubt occur. But not the same kind of personal challenge that many needed and got long ago, to accelerate their maturation before attending college. Though to be fair (and slightly less curmudgeonly), the simple passage of time in the presence of people you didn't already know will lead to considerable personal development in almost any eighteen year-old.

My oldest probably won't take a gap year, though she's considering it. She's attending college classes as a high school student, and loves that world too much to want to take a break; she wants a break from high school ASAP. Beyond that, her life has already had a lot of 'gap year-y' stuff in it, apart from the menial labor (she works in a molecular biology lab). In particular, travel to foreign lands and living away from home. This summer will have even more. She'll go on a month-long backpack trip in the mountains where I did the same at 19.

It's amusing to me that the trip I did for $500 costs 12-14X more for my daughter. The gear she'll buy costs more than our entire trip. Part of this is that she's going on a trip with a Outward Bound-type company. I did my trip with a guy who had done their trip the year before; we knocked-off their program in every detail from route to gear to food. Though we did add one important herb to their list. And perhaps the original itinerary did not include naked frisbee, diving and sliding through the clay-flats of the outflow when the sun hit the glacier in late afternoon. We financed some of the $500 cost of the trip on the return leg by stopping at a liquor store in Wyoming to load cases of Coors (which had little to no distribution east of the Rockies) into and on top of our van. Six-packs sold for 3X our cost on the informal market back east. Drove 24 hours a day and slept in the back, with one night in a park with a shower.

Can I just say: Nothing like that's happening here these days. More's the pity.

Your description of the "what it used to be" gap year is what I have in mind for my kids. Shit, I'd love to do it myself.

[The Sybian]

Your description of the "what it used to be" gap year is what I have in mind for my kids. Shit, I'd love to do it myself.

Mrs. Chedda, I'm taking a gap year. I'll see you and the kids in 12 months.

[govmentchedda]

Your description of the "what it used to be" gap year is what I have in mind for my kids. Shit, I'd love to do it myself.

Mrs. Chedda, I'm taking a gap year. I'll see you and the kids in 12 months.

Peace out!

[Johnnie]

I kind of did "take a year off" before going to college. Hell, I took about 8 of them off before I started and finished up last year.

Knowing what I know now, I would have went to college somewhere warm and commissioned into the military. The pay is much better and I'd still get to travel the world.

I'm making up for lost time while I'm here. What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

[Pruitt]

I kind of did "take a year off" before going to college. Hell, I took about 8 of them off before I started and finished up last year.

Knowing what I know now, I would have went to college somewhere warm and commissioned into the military. The pay is much better and I'd still get to travel the world.

I'm making up for lost time while I'm here. What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

What you say is very wise indeed.

I have two older teenagers and have been married for 19 years. But at seemingly random moments I will remember odd incidents from my youth - great times, great memories. And maybe it's an aging thing, knowing that even if I had a chance, I wouldn't survive a weekend living like I used to, but these memories are only slightly bittersweet. They're fun and funny.

Except for the sexual memories. Those make me very sad indeed.

[P.D.X.]

What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

That's depressing as fuck. Just got back from Nicaragua solo and I think I was only "alone" like a couple of days. Met a couple of Swiss chicks on the chicken bus and we ended up traveling for 4 days together, then met 2 american girls on a plane to a Caribbean island (both traveling solo) and we all ended up hanging for a week. And met a bunch in between. It's not like you go into zen mode and shut everyone out.

[DC47]

I have two older teenagers and have been married for 19 years. But at seemingly random moments I will remember odd incidents from my youth - great times, great memories. And maybe it's an aging thing, knowing that even if I had a chance, I wouldn't survive a weekend living like I used to, but these memories are only slightly bittersweet. They're fun and funny.

I remember jumping into the water at the old quarry. We'd try to miss the submerged refrigerator, but not by so much that we hit the shallows. It's amazing it was there -- a long haul in from the dirt road. I guess if you have enough guys you can carry anything.

I always wondered how the newcomers, who didn't know what was down there, managed the jump. Perhaps there were no newcomers, except those who were brought there by old hands. It's not like the quarry was a public park.

Except for the sexual memories. Those make me very sad indeed.

Sorry to hear that. No one should spend their youth without having at least a few good times of the sensual sort.

[DC47]

Knowing what I know now, I would have went to college somewhere warm and commissioned into the military. The pay is much better and I'd still get to travel the world.

Looking back, just about every major decision I've made didn't work out as well as I had hoped. What you do after that becomes obvious is the critical bit. I guess life is just like that.

I'm making up for lost time while I'm here. What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

I was never happy solo. But spent years in that state as I wasn't going to be happy being in a relationship just to avoid being alone. So I remember what it feels like, though those days are long gone for me.

However, life is long. You are young. Many chapters still to come. Many people who are happily married at your age end up unhappily single for decades before they die. Perhaps you will do this in reverse.

[Pruitt]

Except for the sexual memories. Those make me very sad indeed.

Sorry to hear that. No one should spend their youth without having at least a few good times of the sensual sort.

You misunderstand - I had a number of fine sexual memories. The melancholy is from realizing they aint happening again - at least not in as exciting (or frequent) way.

Used to be I'd go over to my girlfriend's place and we'd have sex at 8 and then again at 11.

Now, it's the 8th and 11th. (wife's mood depending...)

[The Sybian]

Except for the sexual memories. Those make me very sad indeed.

Sorry to hear that. No one should spend their youth without having at least a few good times of the sensual sort.

You misunderstand - I had a number of fine sexual memories. The melancholy is from realizing they aint happening again - at least not in as exciting (or frequent) way.

Used to be I'd go over to my girlfriend's place and we'd have sex at 8 and then again at 11.

Now, it's the 8th and 11th. (wife's mood depending...)

That's why we have porn.

[DC47]

I was making a small bit of humor.

If you have older teens, and the 8th and 11th are in the same month, you're doing relatively good.

[Johnnie]

What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

That's depressing as fuck. Just got back from Nicaragua solo and I think I was only "alone" like a couple of days. Met a couple of Swiss chicks on the chicken bus and we ended up traveling for 4 days together, then met 2 american girls on a plane to a Caribbean island (both traveling solo) and we all ended up hanging for a week. And met a bunch in between. It's not like you go into zen mode and shut everyone out.

I don't have that wanderlust gene. Or at least it isn't pronounced like it is in some people. I get too fixated on my limitations (military rules, getting back and forth between home and destination operating within them, my Jeep's gas mileage...etc) that I forget to just go somewhere.

It's not like I'm not traveling. I'm going to Greece in July for the Yacht Week. Me and 7 people I've never met before on a boat. I'm planning a Baltic cruise thing in August. And I need to make a phone call to the Westvleteran Abbey in Belgium to make the greatest beer run pilgrimage ever. So, I'm not confined to my house in anyway. I would just rather not go places by myself most of the time.

[Pruitt]

I was making a small bit of humor.

If you have older teens, and the 8th and 11th are in the same month, you're doing relatively good.

Well, that is a theoretical reality.

Last night, just as things started becoming fun, my wife's phone went off - daughter needed to be picked up at a friends house - and my son came home which made the dog bark like a crazy beast.

But, we'll try again some day.

[A_B]

I am having at this moment, what I believe to be the first ever smoothie in my life.

It's really really good.

[mister d]

Smoothies are incredibly high variance.

[degenerasian]

What blows is traveling solo. At least to me. The whole "finding yourself" ideal seemed so hokey. I just want a bunch of decent memories so I can die not thinking of death.

That's depressing as fuck. Just got back from Nicaragua solo and I think I was only "alone" like a couple of days. Met a couple of Swiss chicks on the chicken bus and we ended up traveling for 4 days together, then met 2 american girls on a plane to a Caribbean island (both traveling solo) and we all ended up hanging for a week. And met a bunch in between. It's not like you go into zen mode and shut everyone out.

I don't have that wanderlust gene. Or at least it isn't pronounced like it is in some people. I get too fixated on my limitations (military rules, getting back and forth between home and destination operating within them, my Jeep's gas mileage...etc) that I forget to just go somewhere.

It's not like I'm not traveling. I'm going to Greece in July for the Yacht Week. Me and 7 people I've never met before on a boat. I'm planning a Baltic cruise thing in August. And I need to make a phone call to the Westvleteran Abbey in Belgium to make the greatest beer run pilgrimage ever. So, I'm not confined to my house in anyway. I would just rather not go places by myself most of the time.

You are away ahead of me. I would never go on a trip with 8 strangers.

[Johnnie]

Me and 11 Mormons ran Ragnar Wasatch Back together. They were awesome people.

[govmentchedda]

Eleven Mormons and I

[A_B]

Eleven Mormons and I

What Johnnie doesn't realize is that that team is now 12 mormons.

[The Sybian]

Eleven Mormons and I

What Johnnie doesn't realize is that that team is now 12 mormons.

Crackerjack!

[Mr. C]

I just lost an opportunity on a real estate deal that would have turned $120K plus a little sweat equity into an easy $200k+ because I dragged my feet.

I feel fucking sick right now. And I want to punch something.

[Johnnie]

Call me a horrible person (with weak English skills), but riots over shit like police brutality are acceptable to me. Peaceful protests don't mean shit in my eyes especially when cops in riot gear show up as a means of control. The Million Man March was in 1995. Did that help anything? (That's a non sarcastic question.)

It really sucks that private businesses are getting burned to the ground though. I don't like that. I'd rather it be the homes of the cops that murdered the victim.

[mister d]

As long as its businesses and not people, its an ends justify the means situation.

[Giff]

Call me a horrible person (with weak English skills), but riots over shit like police brutality are acceptable to me. Peaceful protests don't mean shit in my eyes especially when cops in riot gear show up as a means of control. The Million Man March was in 1995. Did that help anything? (That's a non sarcastic question.)

It really sucks that private businesses are getting burned to the ground though. I don't like that. I'd rather it be the homes of the cops that murdered the victim.

Considering the shit that white people get fired up about, I can only imagine their reactions if they and their ancestors had to deal with the crap many minorities have to deal with.

I do illegal shit in my car nearly every time I operate it. Some more illegal than others if I'm alone. I've been pulled over two times since 2004. Once was right after I had toked up and the guy just reminded me to make sure my registration was renewed soon (it had been out for three months) and the other I didn't even get a warning for going 15mph over the speed limit. There's no way I'm not spending time in jail already if I'm black.

[sancarlos]

As long as its businesses and not people, its an ends justify the means situation.

Assuming it's not your own family business.

[mister d]

Sure, this assumes I'm neither the cops nor the victim's family nor the business owner.