Ghosts? Do you believe in them?

[HDO45331]

Do you believe in them?

My local Elks Lodge has a Lounge, and a kitchen, with a wall separating the two areas; a doorway connects the two areas, with light switches for the lounge on the wall. There is a horseshoe-shaped bar, in the lounge, with an island cabinet in the middle. On both ends of this cabinet, there are cash registers. The Elks has a surveillance system, with cameras pointing to numerous locations, and specifically, one for each cash register.

Last week, at 7:28am, the cleaning lady, was in the kitchen, when, all of a sudden, the lights came on in the lounge; looking into the lounge, she found no one there. Being alone, and with the building locked up as tight as a tick, she freaked out, and called the club manager, who called the head trustee. He came in at once, checked the entire building and found nothing. All doors were locked. He played back the surveillance tape on the computer server, and at 7:28am, the camera’s picture went from black to lights. In the picture, there is a picture of a woman, wearing a (rather modern) white top, walking out of the picture. All that was shown was the left shoulder, left breast, and the left arm hanging down. Nothing else was visible, as the main intent of the camera was to show the register, and the person using it.

I can attest to this, as I have seen the tape.

[Jerloma]

No, I don't but was the light switch turned to the on position or did the lights just come on magically? Is the cleaning lady a nut-job? It just seems like ghosts always pull the most pointless shit.

[HDO45331]

No, the lights are on a few switches. They could not just come on magically.

And, no, she is not a nut-job. I have known her for many years, and she is a well-grounded individual.

[Shirley]

It's one thing for someone to see a ghost. Lots of things could cause that belief.

For a ghost to show up in a camera image though, you're talking about actual matter affecting actual light. You saw a woman in a white shirt. That means that light bounced off of something of that shape. Matter.

I believe in physics WAAAAAY more than I believe in ghosts (what with the centuries of belief in the latter, but curiously, no actual evidence). Where do you believe this matter appeared from and where did it go? Molecules simply don't disappear.

[Scottie]

Believe? Not in the least. There's always an explanation for what really happened. Someone turned the lights on, power surge, malfunction, someone fucking around. And, much like Loma says, UFOs are a good parallel. "Hey, let's travel billions of light years so we can make weird patterns in some farmer's corn field and then take off without telling anyone we were there! Or better yet, let's travel billions of light years so we can conduct anal probes on some unsuspecting rural yokel." I'm sure the latter is decent work if you happen to be an extraterrestrial proctologist but the fact is that ghosts and alien grays only ever show up when there is a very limited number of witnesses, typically one. Ghosts and/or aliens never seem to make themselves known in crowded places. Stadiums are right out of the question. And for some reason these other-worldly travelers are terribly camera-shy.

People that believe they have been abducted by aliens are either suffering some psychological trauma, compensating for being assaulted, or just plain attention whoring. People that believe they have seen ghosts are either misunderstanding that which they've seen or are the victims of a hoax.

Face it, if there really were alien anal-probing bandits out there, by clandestinely avoiding contact with the masses for decades and only singling out individual victims, all they've really learned about humanity so far is that about one out of every ten homo-sapiens actually enjoys being anal-probed. Extraterrestrial travel ain't cheap; only Earth's governments are capable spending billions of dollars over decades to conduct studies that make such mundane conclusions.

[Jerloma]

Exactly. These beings would have to be complete masters at physics. Their intelligence would be so far off the charts that the idea of them simply anally probing people or making circles in corn fields is just ludicrous. As for ghosts, it seems clear that consciousness occurs in the brain so when that dies, it goes with it. Even if there were a soul that held it though, it would be immaterial and as Dave says, light can't reflect off of it.

[HDO45331]

Classic.

[HDO45331]

It's one thing for someone to see a ghost. Lots of things could cause that belief.

For a ghost to show up in a camera image though, you're talking about actual matter affecting actual light. You saw a woman in a white shirt. That means that light bounced off of something of that shape. Matter.

I believe in physics WAAAAAY more than I believe in ghosts (what with the centuries of belief in the latter, but curiously, no actual evidence). Where do you believe this matter appeared from and where did it go? Molecules simply don't disappear.

I have no idea. But, I can assure you that I saw the video, and the time is exact. In a quiet setting, a closed lounge, there should have been some noise. Footsteps. Whatever. There was nothing.

[Jerloma]

It's not a thread jack. The parallels would shock. Read Demon Haunted World if you ever get a chance. Every single recorded report of either thing meets practically the same criteria.

[Shirley]

I have no idea. But, I can assure you that I saw the video, and the time is exact. In a quiet setting, a closed lounge, there should have been some noise. Footsteps. Whatever. There was nothing.

Who showed you the video? You know, it's not hard to make special effects these days.

You say it was quiet - were there other sounds on the tape? Or is there simply no audio? It's pretty common for surveillance video to have no sound.

Where is this video evidence of a ghost now? Surely something like that would be something that should be shared with the greater world, right? Can we see it?

[Shirley]

BTW, I don't want this to sound like I'm attacking HDO. I'm not. But "extraordinary claims require extraordinary evidence." I just want to know more of the details.

[elflaco]

Oh ye of little faith, doubting thomases and all that.

[tennbengal]

The whole left breast?

[HDO45331]

The whole left breast?

area.

[Scottie]

The whole left breast?

area.

Ethereal areola.

[Jerloma]

I actually do believe there are aliens though. It just seems mathematically unlikely that there aren't. Many, in fact.

[Scottie]

I actually do believe there are aliens though. It just seems mathematically unlikely that there aren't. Many, in fact.

Given that the number of planets in the universe is so large as to be meaningless to the human mind, I'd have a far more difficult time believing there was not life out there.

And even that assumes life, in whatever form it takes, requires a planet.

This guy says it quite well:

With at least 200 billion galaxies out there (and possibly even more), we’re very likely talking about a Universe filled with around 10^24 planets, or, for those of you who like it written out, around 1,000,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 planets in our observable Universe.

[The Sybian]

The whole left breast?

area.

Ethereal areola.

And my new band now has a name. Thanks, Scottie.

[DSafetyGuy]

Ethereal areola.

And my new band now has a name. Thanks, Scottie.

You might want to check to see if any 70's lesbian porn stars had that name to avoid potential lawsuits.

[The Sybian]

Ethereal areola.

And my new band now has a name. Thanks, Scottie.

You might want to check to see if any 70's lesbian porn stars had that name to avoid potential lawsuits.

Fuck it, they are all dead or too broke to afford the filing fees to file a lawsuit.

[ZMan]

HDO, get that vid uploaded to youtube, you'll make serious bank on the advertising.

[HDO45331]

HDO, get that vid uploaded to youtube, you'll make serious bank on the advertising.

I shall. Wish me luck.

I don't know anyone there that knows how to transfer it from the server. (That is the reason I would not believe any funny business with doctoring the pictures.)

[Scottie]

Ethereal areola.

And my new band now has a name. Thanks, Scottie.

Heh. The oddest thing is that if you Google "ethereal areola" (in quotes) it yields "No Results Found". I once heard Douglas Coupland talking about his novel The Gum Thief in which a character is writing a novel called Glove Pond. Coupland uses that title because he was screwing around trying to find exactly and only two words put together, that make sense, which would yield no results in Google. It's not easy to do, in fact. It would appear that today I have done it entirely by chance. I really couldn't resist the sound of it.

Anyhooo, yeah, I'll buy your album.

[Jerloma]

HDO, get that vid uploaded to youtube, you'll make serious bank on the advertising.

I shall. Wish me luck.

I don't know anyone there that knows how to transfer it from the server. (That is the reason I would not believe any funny business with doctoring the pictures.)

Just record the monitor with your phone and then upload it right from there.

[A_B]

HDO doesn't even have a camera on his phone. Because it's a desk phone. With a rotary dial. With only one number. The operator to connect him to his party on the local party lines.

[ZMan]

I'm pretty sure you have the operator ring Beechwood4-5789 to post videos to youtube.

[HDO45331]

HDO doesn't even have a camera on his phone. Because it's a desk phone. With a rotary dial. With only one number. The operator to connect him to his party on the local party lines.

My phone number is 2 longs, and a short.

I'll try to get someone with an intelligent phone to do this.